Anybody here getting that greasy "$27k" feeling?

[madfast]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Quite possible that they may be Sachs rather than Bilsteins.

i think you're right, because in one of the Nurburgring spy videos there was a Sachs truck right next to the garage the FT pulled into

[madfast]

Originally Posted by Spaceywilly

Interesting that they call it a four-passenger coupe. That's the first mention I've seen of rear seats. Those are going to be some tiny seats.

huh? the original concept had rear seats. and the FR-S press conference already confirmed that it'll be 2+2... and the spy shots clearly show room behind the front seats...

[Aki]

Originally Posted by Driftster

Well judging by the buyer market.... If everyone is buying ms3s si's and gti's.... Your area is a bunch of wouldbe car people.hipsters who buy cars based on "i know a guy" stories..

I bought an Si based on loving the handling of the car and that it's a trusty daily driver, couldn't care less of what others think.

Originally Posted by Driftster

Except the MSRP of the S2000 wasn't much lower than dealer markups there man.. the S2000 MSRP'd for almost 40 grand, with shopping around it could be found for that...But most people didn't shop around..

You're comparing apples to oranges and don't understand what goes into pricing a car. Price is dictated by some of the following:

1) Economies of scale. A lower-production car (S2000, Porsche) needs to be at a higher price in order to recoup the cost.
2) Scalability, extension of tech across multiple platforms. The F20/F22 engines if you noticed were only used on one car: S2000. Hence R&D costs incurred on the engine aren't recouped from other cars. Not only the Subie version, but we also don't know whether the engine/tech would be transferred to other cars.
3) Market positioning: Profit margins are in part dictated by its respective market. The general rule is that the lower in price you go, the smaller the margin, which is countered by sales volume. BMWs have a much higher profit margin than say a Scion TC per car. Honda S2000 wasn't at all an entry-level performance car; the FT86 is.
4) Build-up of the brand. Toyota may make the profit margins of the FT86 slimmer if that helps bolster Scion as a brand, which in turn can change consumer perceptions of other Scion models.


In short, you can't just look at a S2000 or Porsche and guesstimate the price tag. There are too many factors.

[Mr.Jay]

Originally Posted by Spaceywilly

Interesting that they call it a four-passenger coupe. That's the first mention I've seen of rear seats. Those are going to be some tiny seats.

its always been a 4 passenger coupe thats what makes it special in the market a light weight rwd 4 person coupe does not exisit

[shaX 07]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

Considering that $28k buys you a well equipped Cooper S, GTI, or Miata, and those cars are all likely to be cross-shopped, it's not too far off-base. The snag is the FR-S is touting minimalism and likely won't have a lush interior or feature-laden. As such, if Scion prices it at $25k, it'll be much easier to move.

You have to remember that $30k is the new $20k, and the USD doesn't buy nearly as much as it used to. Sad but true.

Considering this car was originally said to have an estimated cost of Sub $20k (meaning UNDER $23k) and now we're up at around $28k, is depressing in itself. The fact that they're also now saying the car will have around 200HP, is even more depressing.

This car is not AT ALL what they said it would be 2 years ago when we first heard about it.

[Spaceywilly]

This car is not AT ALL what they said it would be 2 years ago when we first heard about it.

They haven't actually announced anything about the car yet.... the 27k in the OP was based on Canadian dollars. People are jumping to conclusions based on a bunch of rumors.

[Random_Art]

Originally Posted by Spaceywilly

They haven't actually announced anything about the car yet.... the 27k in the OP was based on Canadian dollars. People are jumping to conclusions based on a bunch of rumors.

And the Canadian Dollar is now currently worth more than the American Dollar.
$1US = $.959 Canadian.

But that's besides the point. We don't know the final price and all this speculation is letting all the pessimists spread rumors and mis-information about everything. I prefer to reserve judgement until we have some real info and not just speculation.

[Mr.Jay]

I went to my local Scion dealer the other day to talk to them about the FT86 and try and get a reserved spot in the test drive line and what I was told was to expect around 27K fully optioned out as well as the sales guy made multiple hints that 200hp is the minimum the HP would be he suggested we would see around 220ish hp


I wouldnt trust this info since it clearly seemed to me that I knew more about the car than he did

[Want.FR-S]

Originally Posted by Mr.Jay

I went to my local Scion dealer the other day to talk to them about the FT86 and try and get a reserved spot in the test drive line and what I was told was to expect around 27K fully optioned out as well as the sales guy made multiple hints that 200hp is the minimum the HP would be he suggested we would see around 220ish hp


I wouldnt trust this info since it clearly seemed to me that I knew more about the car than he did

In terms of power number, was he quoting based on the info of FT86 in GT5?

Is there a price for the *based* version? It seems that from the sound of it, the price of 27K is the price if you add every possible option from the catalog. If that is the case, what would be the based price then?

[Spaceywilly]

I wouldn't put any more faith in a Scion salesperson than I do in the magazine blurbs. They don't know any more than we do. Neither of them care about getting the facts right, they just want your money.

[Giccin]

Originally Posted by Want.FR-S

In terms of power number, was he quoting based on the info of FT86 in GT5?

Lol if that's the case.. the car would cost 500k. haha

[Random_Art]

Originally Posted by Spaceywilly

I wouldn't put any more faith in a Scion salesperson than I do in the magazine blurbs. They don't know any more than we do. Neither of them care about getting the facts right, they just want your money.

Hell, half the time they don't know anything about the car they're actually selling. Someone on Newcelica.org a while back told a story of when he had his celica in for service. He overheard a sales guy trying to tell customers that the new Celicas were turbo charged. So, he popped the hood and made the sales guy point out the turbo.

[Mr.Jay]

Originally Posted by Random_Art

Hell, half the time they don't know anything about the car they're actually selling. Someone on Newcelica.org a while back told a story of when he had his celica in for service. He overheard a sales guy trying to tell customers that the new Celicas were turbo charged. So, he popped the hood and made the sales guy point out the turbo.

Yea I don't actually believe what they say but its good to hear what they have heard or believe at least

I asked if he was qouting from GT5 and he said "No, 200HP was the minimum goal they had and production version should be just a bit more powerful, something like 220ish" He made the point that the TC has 180HP and that they couldn't price the FT86 fully loaded at 27K if it only had 20HP more than the TC but like I said I took what he said with a gain of salt considering he thought it was gonna look like the FRS until I showed him the spy shot pics.

I was at the International Car Show a year back and I overheard a Lexus Salesman telling some interested people about the IS-F how the quad pipes were real and how the stacked them to increase downforce and cooling, couldn't take it so I politely went up corrected him and pointed out that if you look under the car you can see that the stacked pipes are faux. Boy he wasn't happy about that one.

[enc0re]

I hate that about the IS-F. If I was spending $61K+ on a sports sedan I would not tolerate any fakery. It would honest to gods be a deal breaker for me if I were in the market for such a car. Compare the underbody of an M3 to an IS-F.