(TSB) No More Crickets Under My Hood!!

[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Master Tech is "doing it wrong". It even clearly states IN the TSB the cause of the noise. Stupid stupid stupid. This isn't "other subarus". How many "other subarus" have Toyota D4S direct injection? None.

Most of us on this board know that ethanol has nothing to do with it, because we're smarter than that.

The cause of the noise per the TSB is the high pressure fuel pump. The TSB also notes you may hear another ticking noise - caused by D-4S - which is completely normal. They are two *completely different* noises which you seem to be misconstruing as the same.

About ethanol... the manual states not to use ethanol mixes > 10%. I could ALWAYS reproduce the cricket noise before. After I switched to ethanol-free 93 octane, I could NEVER reproduce it. What kind of conclusions should I draw from these observations? Should I ignore these *hard facts* because people on this forum are "smarter than that"?

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by HunterGreene

But the subbie TSB does actually say that certain formulations of gasoline may cause it...

From the TSB:

Didn't see the word Ethanol in that statement.

[wawro569]

Im having mine replaced tomorrow, and I drive about 350 miles a week so i'll let you guys know how it goes as far as fixing the issue goes.

[HunterGreene]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Didn't see the word Ethanol in that statement.

Tomato, tomahto. Unless I misread (which is possible, I skim posts like everyone else), the only place the crickets are really coming out is the US and Canada. What do we have in our Gasoline formulations that most of the rest of the world doesn't? Thats right, ethanol. Its a simple conclusion of logic.

[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Didn't see the word Ethanol in that statement.

1) TSB mentions sound is caused by certain fuel mixes.
2) Manual advises to limit fuel mixes containing ethanol.
3) Crickets went away when I switched to enthanol-free fuel.

Just stop.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by switchlanez

The cause of the noise per the TSB is the high pressure fuel pump. The TSB also notes you may hear another ticking noise - caused by D-4S - which is completely normal. They are two *completely different* noises which you seem to be misconstruing as the same.

That's not true. I'm talking about Crickets. What does the TSB say needs to be replaced to fix the Crickets? Answer: HPFP. What uses a HPFP on our cars? Answer: Direct Injection What is the Direct Injection system called? Answer: Toyota D4S.

Conclusion: Crickets are a result of TOYOTA's Direct Injection D4S HPFP. Which makes the crickets in this car unrelated to the crickets in other Subarus that don't have Toyota D4S.

Is that a fair conclusion? I feel it is.

Originally Posted by switchlanez

About ethanol... the manual states not to use ethanol mixes > 10%. I could ALWAYS reproduce the cricket noise before. After I switched to ethanol-free 93 octane, I could NEVER reproduce it. What kind of conclusions should I draw from these observations? Should I ignore these *hard facts* because people on this forum are "smarter than that"?

I know you are "smarter than that". Drawing a conclusion based upon the sampling of only 1 unit from the entire pool isn't exactly solid evidence and no scientist, engineer or random geek would say it is.

My experience is DIRECTLY inverse of yours. I ran 3 tanks back to back with E0, still the same level of crickets at the same randomness of intervals as with tanks of E10. Octane here is 92. So now you have opposing data from 2 units of the entire pool. What conclusion do you draw now?

The conclusion I draw is that the TSB identifies the noise as a mechanical part but also mentions temperature and formulation. ToyoBaru has a greater sampling of the total pool than anyone on this board does and they physically identified the failure (or occurrence) as being mechanical.

The word "formulations" isn't specific enough and could mean anything: E0, E10, E85, toluene, AVgas, race ruel, 91 octane, 93 octane, etc etc..

And let's use the whole wording eh?

It is a result of the positioning of the plunger stopper inside the HPFP. Some may have a plunger stopper position that when combined with certain fuel temperatures or formulations, may result in aeration of the fuel within the body of the pump causing this sound when the engine is idle.

"When combined with".... "temperature or formulation".

I find it ridiculous to conclude as a matter of fact that ethanol is the definitive cause like you have. Especially in the face of contradicting information from other owners and the TSB itself.

Stop... Just stop.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by HunterGreene

Tomato, tomahto. Unless I misread (which is possible, I skim posts like everyone else), the only place the crickets are really coming out is the US and Canada. What do we have in our Gasoline formulations that most of the rest of the world doesn't? Thats right, ethanol. Its a simple conclusion of logic.

That's a good point.

I ran without ethanol for 3 tanks. Still got crickets. Logical to conclude that ethanol is not the culprit.

However it is more logical to conclude that with a faulty HPFP both ethanol and/or temperature are the culprit. E10 on some cars, Temp on others. Seems to be exactly what the TSB suggests.

[switchlanez]

^You're free to read and interpret printed jargon all you want. My observations still hold true. Actions speak louder than words.

[HunterGreene]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

That's a good point.

I ran without ethanol for 3 tanks. Still got crickets. Logical to conclude that ethanol is not the culprit.

However it is more logical to conclude that with a faulty HPFP both ethanol and/or temperature are the culprit. E10 on some cars, Temp on others. Seems to be exactly what the TSB suggests.

I don't know what to tell you. I do have questions, though: Where did you get your E0 Gas? Do they advertise as such? Have you tested it to ensure it isn't cut with ethanol? Since you want to monitor the facts here so closely to pick out the nuances, I just want to be sure that everything is on the straight and level here.

If anything, you would be the anomaly here. From what I have read, most of the owners who switched to E0 have lost their crickets (new figure of speech?). Hence why I would check beyond a website certification that the E0 I was getting was actually E0.

However, I agree with your last point--temperature may factor in here as much as the fuel does. To avoid nitpicking and get back to the big picture, though, lets face the fact that getting a new HPFP does indeed lose the crickets at least in the short term.

[RavenFR-S]

Thank you for posting this. I brought mine in and they ordered the parts necessary. They had not checked the TSBs lately and had not known it was out. I brought this and they helped me on the spot. They said they will be contacting the other 3 FR-S owners they had come in with the same problem when no TSB was available.

[Re~Mix]

Brought my car into Piercey Toyota (Fremont, CA) today. Parts were ordered to replace both the rear tailights and engine parts for the cricket TSB. Hassle free experience, feel like i'm gonna have a brand new car back!

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by HunterGreene

If anything, you would be the anomaly here. From what I have read, most of the owners who switched to E0 have lost their crickets (new figure of speech?). Hence why I would check beyond a website certification that the E0 I was getting was actually E0.

I personally haven't tested my 3 different E0 stations for purity, but have others for theirs?

Yes, I've used 3 stations all with relatively recent tests for purity (and one I use to fill fuel for the race car), with the data from others on this website: http://pure-gas.org/ All stations visited I spoke with the owners who verbally confirmed it and they advertise E0 for 92 octane.

What would be ironic would be the inverse of what you posit. Somebody filling up with what they thought was E0 but in reality was E5 or E10 yet their crickets went away for that period of time. That probability is just as likely as me being sold E10 by E0 stations at 3 separate locations.

Either way, like others here I look forward to getting my HPFP replaced.

[Brimford]

350 miles in, crickets are back, though not quite as loud and are come and go.

Will be calling back up to speak with the dealership this week. Pretty mad.

[ShoGun]

Originally Posted by Re~Mix

Brought my car into Piercey Toyota (Fremont, CA) today. Parts were ordered to replace both the rear tailights and engine parts for the cricket TSB. Hassle free experience, feel like i'm gonna have a brand new car back!

did you have to provide proof of the condensation of the tailights?