Unofficial - CEL/SL/Idle Issue List for FR-S/BRZ Owners

[eurospeed]

Originally Posted by @Art_Mighty

PLEASE READ...

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...t=16673&page=2

Zombi ROCKS!

While this may apply to some cars which start up immediately with a CEL/SL, it does not explain cars that are driven and then experience the CEL/SL minutes/hours into the drive. My car was fine for about 10-15 minutes of driving and then started with the idle problem and then later experienced the CEL/SL at a light.

While I appreciate the mechanic's diagnosis, we need to be careful that this is another opinion of a very complex issue that the Toyota/Subaru engineers haven't yet figured out after over 3 months of documented failures.

I do believe this is both a hardware and software issue where once the CEL/SL is triggered, damage may have occured to the various components that are being replaced. That is why I don't believe a straight flash or ECU replacement will be solve everyone's problems...some cars, absolutely (especially pre delivery vehicles).

[Sargy]

Mine started after being on for almost 2 hours during a photoshoot. turned it off after and started it 30 minutes later, idle was near perfect and 5 minutes after it started it randomly turned on.

[rapidcars]

Originally Posted by eurospeed

While this may apply to some cars which start up immediately with a CEL/SL, it does not explain cars that are driven and then experience the CEL/SL minutes/hours into the drive. My car was fine for about 10-15 minutes of driving and then started with the idle problem and then later experienced the CEL/SL at a light.

While I appreciate the mechanic's diagnosis, we need to be careful that this is another opinion of a very complex issue that the Toyota/Subaru engineers haven't yet figured out after over 3 months of documented failures.

I do believe this is both a hardware and software issue where once the CEL/SL is triggered, damage may have occured to the various components that are being replaced. That is why I don't believe a straight flash or ECU replacement will be solve everyone's problems...some cars, absolutely (especially pre delivery vehicles).

Good point though it does worry me a little that they haven't figured this out after 3 months.

[@Art_Mighty]

Originally Posted by eurospeed

While this may apply to some cars which start up immediately with a CEL/SL, it does not explain cars that are driven and then experience the CEL/SL minutes/hours into the drive. My car was fine for about 10-15 minutes of driving and then started with the idle problem and then later experienced the CEL/SL at a light.

While I appreciate the mechanic's diagnosis, we need to be careful that this is another opinion of a very complex issue that the Toyota/Subaru engineers haven't yet figured out after over 3 months of documented failures.

I do believe this is both a hardware and software issue where once the CEL/SL is triggered, damage may have occured to the various components that are being replaced. That is why I don't believe a straight flash or ECU replacement will be solve everyone's problems...some cars, absolutely (especially pre delivery vehicles).

eurospeed,

You are precisely correct on every point. If anything this theory (if true) should make it plain to everyone that the ECU flash is only a workaround to a mechanical problem; the VVT system is not functioning as originally intended. His explanation is a useful puzzle piece but it's not the whole picture. Put another way, many of you who are hoping for only an ECU flash may be passing up a better long term outcome by resisting the major engine work.

My car went 1600 miles befor tripping it's CLE and the code I got, P0016, is rare. I asked my mechanic to confirm again with Toyota tech support and they're still requiring the cam gear change ONLY. This is not a one-size-fits-all explanation. It's only a piece to the puzzle.

[Jar]

Originally Posted by ftc~brz

we are all going to be the first time they hear of this problem...my sales and service people both said that.
my sales person said they delivered 11 of them already...I have yet to see anything on the road...except a black frs the day before I got mine

Correct. Don't expect anybody official, least of which the Scion rep or service guy, to be forthcoming about this ongoing issue. Any official word can cause a widespread outburst in the somewhat narrow market that this car was designed to cater to, and really impact sales.

Remember these days all it takes is a video tweeted out of a service guy with a Toyota logo on his shirt admitting to the problem, and BAM, Toyota / Scion have to go into damage control mode. I don't need to explain why it's in their best interest to prevent this from happening.

[Teknian_Culprate13]

Ok guys even if they rip apart the engine and replace parts that are still ok with new ones what's the big deal your getting new parts anyways and work is professionally done only thing losing is time right?

[Jar]

Originally Posted by Sargy

Also noticed the same part number used here. I wonder if the other stuff is necessary anymore since im only getting the ecu changed.

My ECU was 1 number shorter on the part number, SU003-04521. I hope it has the appropriate corrections.

[@Art_Mighty]

Originally Posted by soconfoozed

It's really god damned frustrating that Subaru and Scion seem to have a corporate policy of insisting the internet doesn't exist and owners don't talk to each other...

Remember, until yesterday's leaked document this problem didn't officially exist. As far as Toyota/Scion of North America is concerned there's no VVT problem which spans across 100's cars, we're individuals which they're dealing with on a "case by case" basis....

[Teknian_Culprate13]

link to documentation?

[rapidcars]

Originally Posted by Teknian_Culprate13

Ok guys even if they rip apart the engine and replace parts that are still ok with new ones what's the big deal your getting new parts anyways and work is professionally done only thing losing is time right?

I'd rather a car that wasn't torn apart by a mechanic. It's not a huge deal to me but I'd rather one that was untouched from the factory, especially when I'm shelling out $30k. That being said, I was prepared for the possibility that this might happen with a first year car and took the risk since I didn't want to wait any longer and wanted to be one of the first to have one with all the attention that goes with it. Still worth it assuming they can fix it for good.

[BORGSRT]

UPDATE!!! Got my car back today took it in the 24th last month I left the work order sheet at work but it was mostly cam stuff. The bad news for me is since my rear end melted and the car filled with smoke they said " we think that you ran the car with no muffler so we will not pay the 3500 to fix it." I said "is that not speculation?" they said "yep" so now I have a car with no bumper 550 miles on it. I'm in arbitration in order to get rid of the car and it's seems with all of this information I hope it will go pretty fast. The dealership Also received another fr-s in today same issue without the bumper melt. I'm waiting for the light to come back on again at this point.

[@Art_Mighty]

Originally Posted by Teknian_Culprate13

link to documentation?

[EN2_Squirrel]

What does CEL stand for

[Sargy]

Check engine light