Unofficial - CEL/SL/Idle Issue List for FR-S/BRZ Owners

[FT86Raven13]

Originally Posted by jesperswe

Anyone know if the codes P0019 also optional P0017, P0018 is bascially the same?

Not sure if they're the same, but are optionals... check here.

http://nissanhelp.com/diy/obd_codes/p0019_toyota.html

[@Art_Mighty]

I believe the following error matrix to be true (based on the Dealer's Tech and the Subaru TSB...

P0016 Crankshaft Position Abnormality - P000A Slow Response - P0011 Target Error (Bank 1=Passenger Side, Sensor A=Intake Cam)
P0018 Crankshaft Position Abnormality - P000C Slow Response - P0021 Target Error (Bank 2=Drivers Side, Sensor A=Intake Cam)
P0017 Crankshaft Position Abnormality - P000B Slow Response - P0014 Target Error (Bank 1=Passenger Side, Sensor B=Exhaust Cam)
P0019 Crankshaft Position Abnormality - P000D Slow Response - P0024 Target Error (Bank 2=Drivers Side, Sensor B=Exhaust Cam)

[KingRohan]

Originally Posted by @Art_Mighty

Because I got a P0016 and the tech said that it was on the passenger side I believe the following is true...

P0016 Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation (Bank 1=Passenger Side, Sensor A=Intake Cam)
P0017 Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation (Bank 1=Passenger Side, Sensor B=Exhaust Cam)
P0018 Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation (Bank 2=Drivers Side, Sensor A=Intake Cam)
P0019 Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation (Bank 2=Drivers Side, Sensor B=Exhaust Cam)

When the Subaru tech did this my car, he got errors too. Following steps from first Subaru TSB. He also informed me, when he took these parts from a working Impreza no CEL issues, and put them in my BRZ, errors still came up.

Leading him to believe the fault somewhere else in the car.

[@Art_Mighty]

I stumbled upon this at a site called nissian help...

http://nissanhelp.com/diy/obd_codes/p0019_toyota.html

Possible causes
- Dirty Oil
- Variable Valve Timing (VVT) sensor circuit is open or shorted
- Variable Valve Timing (VVT) sensor poor electrical connection
- Faulty Variable Valve Timing (VVT) sensor
- Damaged ECM Help with this

When is the code detected?
The Engine Control Module (ECM) set code P0019 when no receives no signal from the Variable Valve Timing (VVT) sensor.
Symptoms
- Engine Light ON (or Service Engine Soon Warning Light)
- Lack/Loss of power
- Engine rough idle

P0019 TOYOTA Description
The Engine Control Module (ECM) controls the Oil Control Valve (OCV) to regulate the intake camshaft angle. As a result of the angle change, the engine timing is advance or retard. Optimizing engine timing will help the engine improve torque and fuel economy, and the exhaust emissions decrease under overall driving conditions. The Variable Valve Timing (VVT) system includes the Oil Control Valve (OCV) and VVT controller. The ECM detects the actual intake valve timing using signals from the camshaft and crankshaft position sensors, and performs feedback control.

...and some more info here...

http://www.permoveo.ltd.uk/tabid/122...a/Default.aspx

Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation

What does this mean?
OBD Code P0016refers to the crankshaft position sensor (CKP) and Camshaft position sensor (CMP) work in harmony to control the spark/fuel delivery and timing. They both consist of a reluctor, or tone, ring which passes over a magnetic sensor, which generates a voltage, indicating position. The crankshaft sensor is part of the primary ignition system and functions as the "trigger". It detects the position of the crankshaft relays that information on to the PCM or the ignition module (depending on the vehicle) to control spark timing. The Camshaft position sensor detects the position of the camshafts and relays the information to the PCM. The PCM uses the CMP signal to identify the beginning of the injector sequence. What ties these two shafts and their sensors together is the timing belt or chain. The cam and crank should be precisely timed together. If the PCM detects that the Crank and Cam signals are out of time by a specific number of degrees, this P0016 code will set.
Symptoms


Possible sumptoms of OBD code P0016
Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) illumination The engine may run but with reduced performance The engine may crank but not start The engine may exhibit a rattle near the harmonic balancer indicating the tone ring is damaged The engine may start and run, but poorly
Causes

Possible causes of OBD code P0016
Timing chain stretched, or timing belt skipped a tooth due to wear Misalignment of timing belt/chain Tone ring on crankshaft slipped/broken Tone ring on camshaft slipped/broken Bad crank sensor Bad cam sensor Damaged wiring to crank/cam sensor Timing belt/chain tensioner damaged
Possible Solutions

First, visually inspect the cam and crank sensors and their harnesses for damage. If you notice broken/frayed wires, repair and recheck. If you have access to a scope, check the cam and crank patterns. If a pattern is missing, suspect a bad sensor or a slipping tone ring. Remove the cam gear and the crankshaft harmonic balancer and inspect the tone rings for proper alignment and make sure they're not loose or damaged or that they haven't sheared the key that aligns them. If they are properly installed, replace the sensor. If the signal appears normal, then check the timing chain/belt for proper alignment. If it's misaligned, check for a damaged tensioner that may have allowed the chain/belt to slip a tooth or several teeth. Also check that the belt/chain isn't stretched. Repair and recheck.

[@Art_Mighty]

...and here's another potentially useful nugget of information:

http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/04-06-Tun...e/cip0016p.pdf

this is a PDF doc which describes the operation and trouble states of the toyota VVT system for the 2UZ-FE motor.

CIRCUIT DESCRIPTION
VVT sensor (VVL or VVR signal) consist of a signal plate and pickup coil.
The VVL or VVR signal plate has 1 tooth on its outer circumference and is mounted on the intake camshafts.When the camshafts rotate, the protrusion on the signal plate and the air gap on the pickup coil change,causing fluctuations in the magnetic field and generating an electromotive force in the pickup coil.The actual camshaft angle is detected by the VVT sensor and it provides feedback to the ECM to control the intake valve timing in response to during condition.

MONITOR DESCRIPTION
The ECM optimizes the valve timing using the VVT (Variable Valve Timing) system to control the intake valve camshaft. The VVT system includes the ECM, the OCV (Oil Control Valve) and the VVT controller. The ECM sends a target duty−cycle control signal to the OCV. This control signal, applied to the OCV, regulates the oil pressure supplied to the VVT controller. The VVT controller can advance or retard the intake valve camshaft. The ECM calibrates the valve timing of the VVT system by setting the camshaft to the maximum retard angle when the engine is idle. The ECM closes the OCV to retard the cam. The ECM stores this value as VVT learning value (When the difference between the target valve timing and the actual valve timing is 5
degrees or less, the ECM stores this in its memory.).

If the learning value meets both of the following conditions ((a) and (b)), the ECM interprets this as a defect in the VVT system and sets a DTC.

(a) VVT learning value is less than 20°CA (Crankshaft Angle) or more than 39°CA.
(b) Above condition continues for more than 18 sec.

I'm not exactly sure how much of this interesting info directly relates to our motors but there are a number of possible root causes (bad sensors, VVT sprockets, oil control units, ECM's, timing chains, the list seems to go on and on).

I traded in my E46 M3 to get my FR-S and it's ironic how VVT concerns seem to follow me around. The only system on that car that concerned me from a reliability standpoint was VANOS...

[mact]

I'm wondering if we should post build dates of each car?

[jesperswe]

So there are 4 of these cam gears? And it's random which one fails? Why does only 1 out of 4 fails?
Aren't they all from the same batch of cam sprockets? Is it more ECM related than one might think?

[FT86Raven13]

Originally Posted by jesperswe

So there are 4 of these cam gears? And it's random which one fails? Why does only 1 out of 4 fails?
Aren't they all from the same batch of cam sprockets? Is it more ECM related than one might think?

From reading through all of the posts and in reviewing any of the online documentation for those codes we've seen... That's my guess.

That said, at this point I'm more interested in knowing whether (once the fix the cam) I'll be able to drive the car more than an additional 107mi, before running into another CEL road block!?!?

[Ericbdrummin]

My FRS went in the shop for the idle,cel, issue on 9/7 with 2950miles on it.
Dealer said that there was no problem with the car later that day. Within 25 miles of driving the next day, it all happened again but now the CEL is always on. Car went back in the shop on 9/10 and as of today 9/11 I'm in a rental. I have talked to Scion and have a case number and mgr. I have asked Scion to give me a 100,000 mile warranty if they want to keep me in this car, no faith now. They said there is nothing that they can do till after the car is fixed, REALLY ? I will be holding Scions feet to this fire, total BS with a brand new car.

[Ericbdrummin]

Please add me to that list too.
Eri***rummin
Scion FRS. 2950 miles.
Centennial Toyota, Las Vegas

[UbSaMrC]

Add me to the list, FRS - CEL at 2008 miles, throttle dipping at idle goes from 600 to just over 400 then nearly stalls. I just dropped it of to the dealership, waiting on the diagnostics.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

[@Art_Mighty]

Originally Posted by jesperswe

So there are 4 of these cam gears? And it's random which one fails? Why does only 1 out of 4 fails?
Aren't they all from the same batch of cam sprockets? Is it more ECM related than one might think?

That's exactly the concern I have. Are we fixing one cam just to have another one fail. Subaru isn't known for making crappy motors so this is sorta surprising. Does anyone know if VVT is new to Subaru designed boxer engines (I'm a boxer noob, i dont know a lot about this engine I just bought)?

[Darweeezy]

Originally Posted by Darweeezy

Just had the CEL and SLIP light come on. Bringing it to the dealership tomorrow afternoon.

~1200 miles
Manual Transmission
VIN: 7077XX

So I got an update from the dealership I dropped my car off to. They are saying its going to take 3 or more weeks to get my car fixed but from the sound of my toyota rep its probably going to take longer . My car isn't even a month old. I called scion and got a case number. Scion better compensate me good or I'm going to exercise the lemon law.

[@Art_Mighty]

Originally Posted by @Art_Mighty

My Asphalt FR-S (vin 7087XX) is reporting a P0016 Crank-Cam position correlation fault code at 1600 miles. CEL and Traction Control lights come on. It feels like there's a power reduction. Engine Idle is OK. Car being left at dealer for repair.

Dealer / Scion Update:

My dealer tech looked at the car and confirmed the P0016 code. After speaking to Toyota tech support my technician said he's been directed to replace the cam gear and the oil control valve (he stated something about being told to replace the ECU at one point and then later he was directed to leave it be). The cam gear is onsite but the oil valve on backorder with no ETA. If my service writer is correct, it's likely the engine will be removed from the car or at the minimum partially lifted from the engine bay for the repair.

Clayton from Scion customer server called me today and said he's been in contact with the dealer about the status of the repair and parts (it's going to be at least two weeks before the part arrives). He mentioned he would follow up with me and the dealer on a weekly basis and that there would be some from of compensation coming to me after the problem was resolved.

One last note. This dealer has sold 15 FR-S's (what would the the plural for FR-S anyway?) so far and apparently I'm the first FR-S at that dealer with the problem.