FastLaneDaily talks about Scion's FRS

[cyde01]

Originally Posted by ToyotaObsession

Sure in certain circles it's looked down upon, but so was Hyundai then they came out with the Genesis. Now people looked at them in a different light.

a lot of people compare Scion to Hyundai in a way to say there's nothing wrong with Scion, but how about comparing Hyundai to Toyota? Hyundai created an exciting sports car in the Genesis coupe and luxury sedans like the Equus and Genesis sedan without having to create a separate "youth brand" like Scion or luxury brand like Lexus. as a result, the Hyundai brand is starting to rival the Toyota brand's prestige, while Toyota has become more like GM when they sucked.

[blewmax07]

I think the guys in that video made a few good points but I really don't care what the car is branded as. At the end of the day, it will still be a Toyota and I will be confident that I will have a reliable car. Personally, I'd rather drive a Scion vs a Hyundai any day. Also, if Subaru came out with their version of this car I wouldn't car to buy that either. I don't live in areas with snow so I don't need four wheel drive. Only thing I would like is a turbo that they might have. Anyway, I just want them to make the damn car already. If they do and it's as good as it's supposed to be, it will sell no matter what brand its under.

[Matador]

The guys in the video are total douche nozzles worried about the piece of plastic on the front. Yes, I am concerned about it being a scion, but that lil piece of plastic is the least of my worries.

[poormans_LFA]

I really don't get this whole hang up thing with the Scion badge, personally. Providing the production car looks close enough this will be the sexiest car for under $30k. If the 370Z had a tad more character design wise it would knock this car out of the park, but it doesn't. As was said, the Scion badge is by far the least of my worries. Not a Scion fan, but does it matter? Come on people.

[Dimman]

It's about the bigger picture, but I swear they did a reasonable job of quickly summarizing a lot of our 'Scion or Not' arguments.

For the record I think it's a bad idea as a Scion. I don't see it saving the brand (iQ has a better shot, dead serious). I worry about what will happen to the future of the FT86 and Toyota sports cars if Scion ends up failing (the old guy made excellent points about how hard it is for 'corporate' to backtrack from a failing idea, it took bankruptcy for GM to admit that Saturn was worthless, and Scion has a lot of similarities to Saturn).

But I'm very tentatively accepting the realities of becoming a Scion owner. Pending a lot of the unanswered questions about the car are answered in a satisfactory manner.

On a positive Scion note, look what their race program allowed Dragon to do with what is essentially a short-wheelbase, 2 door Camry. If they can make a tC fast, they can make the FT86 faster.

Now if they can only fix the douche/ricer (not you Dragon...) image...

[blur]

I'm not concerned with image at all. Its the fact that it's supposed to be a youth appealing brand and the fake announcement that has me worried. I am in fact part of that "youth', but I haven't came across one person my age that tastefully mods cars or is into racing. My neighbor, 21(ish), has a Civic Si. His mods? body damage, stickers, a tow hook and tasteless xxr wheels. I seriously dislike what my age group is into.

[xantonin]

In America, you own a Scion... in Soviet Russia, Scion owns you!

[Mr.Jay]

the echo the voices of how a lot of people see Scion

true car nuts will buy the car regardless of label but a lot of people who would of bought the toyota will defect I think

[Dark]

Scion or Toyota, it's going to be exactly same car. Heart of Subaru, Organs of Toyota. However, it's more than mechanical. Isn't that the reason people pay 375K for a LFA? Car nuts don't care about the badge, but how many car nut out there vs varied types of buyers?

Originally Posted by Mr.Jay

the echo the voices of how a lot of people see Scion

true car nuts will buy the car regardless of label but a lot of people who would of bought the toyota will defect I think

Can you be clearer on your statement?

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by cyde01

a lot of people compare Scion to Hyundai in a way to say there's nothing wrong with Scion, but how about comparing Hyundai to Toyota? Hyundai created an exciting sports car in the Genesis coupe and luxury sedans like the Equus and Genesis sedan without having to create a separate "youth brand" like Scion or luxury brand like Lexus. as a result, the Hyundai brand is starting to rival the Toyota brand's prestige, while Toyota has become more like GM when they sucked.

^

And its on purpose. They wanted to overtake GM as the worlds largest automobile manufacturer...and they just did that, at the expense of the soul of the company: High quality affordable cars, across all markets: economy, luxury, truck/suv, and sports.

Not saying their quality sucks nowadays, its still great. But its not what it used to be (sup '80s yotas). And hell, they don't even have sports cars anymore. TOYOTA, doesn't have a flagship sports car anymore. TOYOTA...if you know even a sliver of its history, that would astonish you. They've pushed the Sports segment into Lexus' corner. Thats fine and dandy from a bean counter pov (hey, low volume, why not make it Lexus?), but so long goes the affordable part.

The only reason I don't like it being a Scion is because I'm a Toyota Sports car nut...I WANT to see them redeem themselves in that market, because they used to make some of the best affordable sports cars money could buy. It looks like my forum handle won't be going anywhere anytime soon however....

[cyde01]

Now that they're creating a Prius "brand," that'll make it 4 brands total. That's 3 too many, if you ask me

[serialk11r]

In my head the idea of a luxury brand offshoot makes sense, because luxury cars in my mind are a distinct superclass of their own, and brand image is something that does matter to luxury car buyers. However I don't really understand the difference between Scion and Toyota, I always thought Toyota was supposed to be the affordable car...and young people presumably go for affordable? I mean, the streets are infested with Corollas and Camrys, and those cars land in approximately the same price range as Scion. Scions look pretty ugly too I can't see why they'd be any more appealing to anyone.

[kawazydude]

the FRS' badging as a scion is simply a symptom of the underlying problem.

the FRS (or the FT-86 i should say) was meant to be a successor of the old hachiroku, not a recent tc or any other scion car. it's just infuriating to see that toyota decided to put a scion badge on the FRS not b/c the scion badge helps toyota convey the inspiration behind the FRS or to add any extra meaning to the FRS in terms of what it's supposed to symbolize for toyota (passion and excitement) since it could've done that better with a toyota badge instead. rather, the SOLE reason for badging it a scion is to save a failing brand (a brand which i could care less for). THAT's the problem.

of course, i understand toyota's effort to try to save one of their brands -- it's business after all. but therein lies the problem: the otherwise perfect FRS was badged a scion not as a result of toyota's love for cars, but toyota's business interests. that to me detracts from the very message toyota is trying to send with this car, that toyota is still passionate about cars.

but i still love the FRS, and more likely than not, i'll probably buy it (unless subie's version blows scion's out of the water). but am i sad about its branding as a scion? you bet.

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by kawazydude

the FRS' badging as a scion is simply a symptom of the underlying problem.

the FRS (or the FT-86 i should say) was meant to be a successor of the old hachiroku, not a recent tc or any other scion car. it's just infuriating to see that toyota decided to put a scion badge on the FRS not b/c the scion badge helps toyota convey the inspiration behind the FRS or to add any extra meaning to the FRS in terms of what it's supposed to symbolize for toyota (passion and excitement) since it could've done that better with a toyota badge instead. rather, the SOLE reason for badging it a scion is to save a failing brand (a brand which i could care less for). THAT's the problem.

of course, i understand toyota's effort to try to save one of their brands -- it's business after all. but therein lies the problem: the otherwise perfect FRS was badged a scion not as a result of toyota's love for cars, but toyota's business interests. that to me detracts from the very message toyota is trying to send with this car, that toyota is still passionate about cars.

but i still love the FRS, and more likely than not, i'll probably buy it (unless subie's version blows scion's out of the water). but am i sad about its branding as a scion? you bet.

It'll be a Toyota everywhere except the U.S. I said this way back when the forum started, literally, over a year ago, that Toyota USA would have the final say on what badge this car gets in the U.S. market. I was right.