Chris Harris Drive: GT86 / FR-S vs 370z vs Cayman S

[Zaggeron]

Originally Posted by FR-S/GT-86

True, but so are realities. The 370Z is a shortened chassis that underpins the G37, EX37, FX37... sedan, and two SUV's...

I am not here to slam the 370Z... it's a fine car. It's just too heavy for my tastes.

I am NOT like Jeremy Clarkson... poooowwwwwaaaa.... I like agility first, grace second, and power third...

I was referring to the camera angle that made sitting in the Z look like sitting in an SUV. A bit of creative journalism there

[FR-S/GT-86]

Originally Posted by Zaggeron

I was referring to the camera angle that made sitting in the Z look like sitting in an SUV. A bit of creative journalism there

I know, I was concurring... I agree they made it look worse than it probably was... it is worth noting how the platform is used though. :-)

[Zaggeron]

Originally Posted by FR-S/GT-86

I know, I was concurring... I agree they made it look worse than it probably was... it is worth noting how the platform is used though. :-)

True, but platform has very little to do with seating position in the resulting model that uses it.
This http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_...ond_Generation shares the same platform as the Z, but I'd be surprised if anyone could make educated guesses about the performance, handling, seating position, etc. based on knowing the stats of this van

[Kearny Mesa Scion]

Originally Posted by Zaggeron

Camera angle is everything and a little like statistics

don't think its the camera angle the Z sits like that even with the seats set at its lowest position. plus a driver like chris would set the seat as low as possible and the video team would try multiple shots before taping. if the camera lens was facing down it would show in the video.

the Z engine and the higher beltline is the cause, which you can thank the Global Pedestrian Crash Standards for the higher beltlines of all modern day cars. FRS/86/BRZ is able to get away with it because of the boxer motor. if nissan set the seats as low like the cayman or FRS the driver unless 6' or taller wouldn't be able to see over the dash. just look at the 7:41 and pause, the engine is above the shock towers. whereas the FRS/86/BRZ even if you include the intake manifold is way below the shock towers.

[Zaggeron]

Originally Posted by Kearny Mesa Scion

don't think its the camera angle the Z sits like that even with the seats set at its lowest position. plus a driver like chris would set the seat as low as possible and the video team would try multiple shots before taping. if the camera lens was facing down it would show in the video.

the Z engine and the higher beltline is the cause, which you can thank the Global Pedestrian Crash Standards for the higher beltlines of all modern day cars. FRS/86/BRZ is able to get away with it because of the boxer motor. if nissan set the seats as low like the cayman or FRS the driver unless 6' or taller wouldn't be able to see over the dash. just look at the 7:41 and pause, the engine is above the shock towers. whereas the FRS/86/BRZ even if you include the intake manifold is way below the shock towers.

We're not talking how low to the ground. The BRZ seats are lower by virtue of the fact the car has a lower profile than the Z. We are talking about seating position relative to the cabin. The video suggested the Z had a very upright "captain's chair" sort of seating position. This is just not true. I have both cars and the seating position is very similar in each. In fact, as I mentioned, it seems to be that you sit slightly more upright in the BRZ.

[Jordo!]

Originally Posted by shadoquad

I'd rather wait and see on Subaru/Scion developing a stock turbo, personally. When you FI a car outside of warranty, that's a huge risk. When it's covered by warranty, well then game on And I believe that will happen with the 86 in a year or two.

This is my sentiment as well.

If they had offered one from the get-go, I'd be seriously considering the merits of owning one vs. the other.

Still dreaming and drooling over the Gazoo twincharged car -- so want.

[Infernal]

Originally Posted by Jordo!

This is my sentiment as well.

If they had offered one from the get-go, I'd be seriously considering the merits of owning one vs. the other.

Still dreaming and drooling over the Gazoo twincharged car -- so want.

same here

[jadewbj]

Originally Posted by Zaggeron

Frankly, I'm not likely to have bought my BRZ if it were 240/260 HP via turbo. For one I'm a fan of NA. Also, for what I wanted this car for, the standard 200HP is fine -- though I wouldn't have complained if the torque figures were higher. For me it was why buy another corolla/civic/mazda/altima/etc. as a daily driver when for a bit more I can get something much more fun. Too much higher performance and it would have been hard to justify having two sports cars. At its current performance level, I can justify having both cars -- after all isn't this just an upscale RWD Corolla with a much nicer looking body that drives much better. That's what I tell myself anyway

Just wondering, what is your other sports car?

[Foobar]

Originally Posted by jadewbj

Just wondering, what is your other sports car?

I believe his other car's a Z.

[noAE86]

Originally Posted by MVJ1975

I'd dismiss both E92s out of hand. They're not sports cars, no matter how fast they are. If you're looking for a sports car, the E92 isn't going to satisfy.
.

thats not true at all, the m3 line is a evoluntionary design, it takes proven chassis concepts from previous gens to create the next, this alone puts it leaps and bounds ahead of the 86,

a sports car starts with a well designed chassis, and the doner chassis the 86 came from is not a sports car by any means, credit to toybaru for a feat of super auto powers in creating such a well balanced chassis from a supermarket bandit, and lets all hope this almost new chassis is just as good to live up to the "86" name,

if you have had serious seat time in ANY model m3 you'd never come to the conclusion its not a sports car, very few cars i have owned come close to the "satisfy" level m3's give, only other chassis's that have topped it are my lotus 7, ae86, and ford Escort RS1600 spec, and thats with extensive modifications.

the caymon is also a evo chassis design, it has had far more testing a redesigning then 99% of the cars on the road, + designs from previous 911's have leaked into most caymon chassis's. they have always gotten stick about building the same cars for years for a reason,

[Zaggeron]

Originally Posted by Foobar

I believe his other car's a Z.

Yea. 370z roadster

[MVJ1975]

Originally Posted by noAE86

thats not true at all, the m3 line is a evoluntionary design, it takes proven chassis concepts from previous gens to create the next, this alone puts it leaps and bounds ahead of the 86,

a sports car starts with a well designed chassis, and the doner chassis the 86 came from is not a sports car by any means, credit to toybaru for a feat of super auto powers in creating such a well balanced chassis from a supermarket bandit, and lets all hope this almost new chassis is just as good to live up to the "86" name,

if you have had serious seat time in ANY model m3 you'd never come to the conclusion its not a sports car, very few cars i have owned come close to the "satisfy" level m3's give, only other chassis's that have topped it are my lotus 7, ae86, and ford Escort RS1600 spec, and thats with extensive modifications.

the caymon is also a evo chassis design, it has had far more testing a redesigning then 99% of the cars on the road, + designs from previous 911's have leaked into most caymon chassis's. they have always gotten stick about building the same cars for years for a reason,

Nowhere did I say the E92s were bad cars.

The E92s aren't sports cars because they fall into another class. They're grand tourers, designed for comfy long drives with excellent power. As such, they have a different sort of focus than things like Elises and Miatas and such. If you want a GT, they're a fantastic choice. They are, however, not sports cars.

[Scion1181]

Originally Posted by nighthawk

Well, he was talking about UK market. And as you can see, there are caymans for that money out there.

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/list.asp?s=487&p=&d=0&min=&max=&y1=&y2=&txt=&px=&x sl=list&pagesize=15&filter=TP&o=q&pc=

Nice find.

[Sambo]

What makes Chris a top notch auto reviewer is his realistic down to earth yet witty way of describing precisely how a car feels. The bit about the feeling of yaw and rear end slip is sooo on point. It had me smiling ear to ear.