Hubcentric Rings

[yoshiharadesign]

Originally Posted by Spartan65

Sorry this is a myth, having been in the industry for 15+ years what you are relaying is a type of preload. That pre load would never have the same tensil strength as a solid hub, you can take the five lugs and multiply each individual SAE rating and it will never come close to the SAE rating of the 56.1 hub.

Just thought it would be easier to explain in normal jargin. But this pretty much explains it in full detail :happy0180:

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by Spartan65

Sorry this is a myth, having been in the industry for 15+ years what you are relaying is a type of preload. That pre load would never have the same tensil strength as a solid hub, you can take the five lugs and multiply each individual SAE rating and it will never come close to the SAE rating of the 56.1 hub.

i'm talking about centering the wheel so as to avoid vibration, not strength.

plus how will the hub prevent shearing when the clamping force is overloaded, maybe in a vertical direction but not the rotational.

so how about dem plastic rings?

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

i'm talking about centering the wheel so as to avoid vibration, not strength.

plus how will the hub prevent shearing when the clamping force is overloaded, maybe in a vertical direction but not the rotational.

so how about dem plastic rings?

Impacts (curbs, potholes, etc) are in the vertical or near-vertical plane.

As for plastic, it depends on the plastic. If it's a simple plastic it won't do much. BUt if it's a high impact composite like what Rhino ramps are made of, they can do quite a bit. In a hubcentric ring application, you're not dealing with shearing or breaking the ring, but crushing it. Composites can have very high crush strengths. Also, keep in mind that the material of the ring has almost nowhere to go, which increases its ability to resist compression.

[xwd]

You can buy a set of Volk Racing hubcentric rings, they are aluminum. You can deform them pretty easily. How much force do you think those are really engineered to take?

I'm trying to find the old thread from honda-tech but once you torque 5 lugnuts down to around 75 ft-lbs, the force required to overcome the static friction between the wheel and the hub is over 40,000lbs.

So again, the lugnuts and the ring do absolutely nothing in transferring force anywhere. The ring is there so your wheel isn't sitting oblong compared to the hub and you don't get vibration. I would definitely recommend running them for that reason, but to say they are helping with vertical loads is incorrect.

[JoeBoxer]

Where is the best place to get hubrings? Should i pay $25 from wheeldude or just $10 for ebay ones?

[Phaedrus29]

I bought some Gorilla ones from amazon for like $6 per set. I got two different sized sets because I'm not 100% sure what size I need. I think the ones I ordered are "poly carbon plastic". Maybe next time I'll do aluminum, once I know what size I need, but I've heard the plastic ones are fine.

http://gorilla-auto.com/hub-centric-rings

[JoeBoxer]

Originally Posted by Phaedrus29

I bought some Gorilla ones from amazon for like $6 per set. I got two different sized sets because I'm not 100% sure what size I need. I think the ones I ordered are "poly carbon plastic". Maybe next time I'll do aluminum, once I know what size I need, but I've heard the plastic ones are fine.

http://gorilla-auto.com/hub-centric-rings

Thanks I got some gorilla hubrings and lugnuts off Amazon for $45 shipped.

[Phaedrus29]

Oh well, I got the Gorilla rings in 66mm and 67mm outer diameter and they are both too big for my wheels. I think I need 65mm and Gorilla doesn't make those. I broke one of the clips on the 66mm trying to squeeze it in there.

It looks like justforwheels.com has the size I need but they are $46 for an aluminum set.

[07stealth350z]

This thread clarified soo many things for me. Thanks!

[bucket]

Originally Posted by dwx

You can buy a set of Volk Racing hubcentric rings, they are aluminum. You can deform them pretty easily. How much force do you think those are really engineered to take?

I'm trying to find the old thread from honda-tech but once you torque 5 lugnuts down to around 75 ft-lbs, the force required to overcome the static friction between the wheel and the hub is over 40,000lbs.

So again, the lugnuts and the ring do absolutely nothing in transferring force anywhere. The ring is there so your wheel isn't sitting oblong compared to the hub and you don't get vibration. I would definitely recommend running them for that reason, but to say they are helping with vertical loads is incorrect.

I'd like to see the honda tech version, but here is my google + shitty memory of statics from like 10 years ago.

Going with the calculator at http://www.engineersedge.com/calcula...orque_calc.htm
89 ft-lbs = 1068 in-lbs
12mm major diameter = 0.472441in (google conversion)
Axial clamp force (website calculation) = 11302.99868131682 lbs...I'll call it 11303 lbs.

5 lugs, so total axial clamping force is ~56515 lbs.
Coefficient of friction between Aluminum and mild steel = .61 (don't know the exact material for the rotor, so I'll go with that)

.61 * 56515 lbs =34474.15 lbs

The real world results will vary and actual clamping force for an applied torque on a bolt seems to be a tricky calculation with a lot of variables in the mix to get an accurate model, but that's like 12x the weight of the car holding up each corner by static friction...there is a pretty good margin of safety there.

[Phaedrus29]

Originally Posted by yoshiharadesign

Yes. while that is possible, it is always easier to have a ring and tightening in sequence. As to hub rings on aftermarket vs oe, of course the wheels from oe are going to fit exactly. However, pairing a tight fitting set of rings with minimal tolerance will have the same effect. With rings, it merely simplifies things more.

When you say "tight fitting" hubcentric rings, I'm wondering how tight they are supposed to fit. As I mentioned above, I tried 67mm and 66mm Gorilla rings, and they were both too large. Today I tried some 65.1mm aluminum rings. The rings wouldn't slip right into the wheels and I had to hammer on them for a while to get them to fit. I eventually was able to get them into the wheels (and they are in enough that they don't stick out of the back of the wheel). But they are very tightly jammed/squeezed into the wheel. Is this something I should worry about? The place where I ordered these rings also has 64.1mm ones, so I'm not sure if that was really the proper size. Thoughts? Thanks.

[Sony]

Originally Posted by Phaedrus29

When you say "tight fitting" hubcentric rings, I'm wondering how tight they are supposed to fit. As I mentioned above, I tried 67mm and 66mm Gorilla rings, and they were both too large. Today I tried some 65.1mm aluminum rings. The rings wouldn't slip right into the wheels and I had to hammer on them for a while to get them to fit. I eventually was able to get them into the wheels (and they are in enough that they don't stick out of the back of the wheel). But they are very tightly jammed/squeezed into the wheel. Is this something I should worry about? The place where I ordered these rings also has 64.1mm ones, so I'm not sure if that was really the proper size. Thoughts? Thanks.

If you had to hammer the rings in and they fit then most likely they were slightly too big. I.e. 65mm instead of 65.1mm (yes the tolerances are THAT close.) 64.1 would probably be too small, if the bore was 64.1 you would not be able to hammer a 65.1mm ring in without noticeably deforming it. If you were able to get the rings in and the wheels still fit on your hubs with no gap between the backplate and the hub then you should be fine.

[ooharloo]

Does anyone know the center bore of the WORK Emotion CR kai? i have 18x9.5 +38 on all 4.

[Hanakuso]

Originally Posted by ooharloo

Does anyone know the center bore of the WORK Emotion CR kai? i have 18x9.5 +38 on all 4.

Can't you measure it yourself with measuring tape?