Space Things

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

What I proposed doing (using hyperbolic propellants as an ignitor...

I thought of that as well, as some level of safeguard, rather than having to deal with a couple of million lbs of it. The LEM only had 2,376Kg (5,238lbs) of fuel in it while Starship in its current configuration carries 1,179,340Kg (2.6M lbs) of fuel.

[bcj]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

Again, your first sentence is an incomplete sentence. I'm not trying to be the grammar police. It just gets confusing trying to determine what you are referencing in an incomplete sentence. You know in your mind, but it is confusing on the other end from my perspective.

Sorry for being pedantic at you. It just struck me as ... odd.
None of the many other points were troublesome.
Since I was in the space thread, I took the opportunity to expound on something else.

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

On your second point ( ... wall o' text ... ) confused by that statement. You even post a link and address the fact that there are other space projects in the works.

Nobody but the military is putting resources into industry so they can play pigz in space.
It's like ethernet was in '80.

Shouldn't like, Industry, be building tools for shareholder value?
It's not even on their radar as a potential market.
All the private PR budget is spent on walking around with new world conquerors' flags.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by ZDan

? The vid I showed is from a few years ago. Not "in the beginning". Curious words, suggesting Musk-worshippers consider him kind of a diety! I don't. I think he's both an idiot (forgiveable) and a total asshole (not forgiveable).

Jeebus effing gawd, specifically why I said "or low pressure".

Bottom line: It's a dumb idea that won't work. "Air bearings" in a vacuum (or "low pressure") tube, I mean it's laughable. Anyone who has any sense knows this. Which is why he reverted to fricking *wheels* to support the vehicle not long after that video. Somebody who wasn't afraid of being fired told him it was a stupid idea and wouldn't work.

Regarding Mars mission, it's a death sentence to anyone who signs up. While I agree with the *idea* of space exploration by humans, the possible benefit has to be weighed against the *cost*. Throwing a few humans to Mars might be a neat thing to do but IMO it is not worth ruining and/or extinguishing their lives, no matter how many people would willingly sign up for it.

Well, that was eight years ago, which is a little more than a few years. A person could get a PHD in eight years, so wherever he was, I'm sure he is more knowledgable than before. I'm not a Musk worshipper either. I'm just a fan of engineering, science, technology, etc, and he just happens to have car, energy, AI, boring, and space companies that are doing new, interesting and disruptive stuff, so that makes him part of many conversations.

The fastest train ever was a French train on wheels and not a Maglev train, so I don't know if wheels are limiting, so that could also be why he changed. I also don't know if you would need much air bearings (pressurized air out the surface of the sled legs). Air bearings work really well in industrial applications, but the air forced under the legs at speed could possibly create lift around the pod and keep it suspended in a tube. Round things shot through a tube tend to stay in the middle because the air circulates around it, but of course, there needs to be wheels when it stops, so there the pod doesn't drag/scrape--unless a pump creating like 60psi of pressure can be sustained. I don't know if creating a lower pressure environment is a terrible idea. It is the sole reason why planes fly so high. Are you saying it is laughable because keeping the tube lower pressure would be hard or prohibitively expensive or dangerous or all or what?

A three year mission to mars wouldn't be a death sentence. Are you saying you know the risk of cancer is greater than say smoking tobacco? Around 1.3 billion smoke tobacco including more than 10% of the US population, and even more live around second hand smoke, so finding risk-tolerant people wouldn't be a problem. Several astronauts were smokers including Buzz Aldrin.

Staying on mars would require tunnels, which is why there is The Boring Company. NASA discusses using lava tubes in its mission plan for long term housing in the initial years to avoid larger radiation doses. NASA will likely extend their limit on acceptable radiation levels like they did recently, so astronauts can go to Mars, but what really is going to happen is Optimus and other robots and autonomous vehicles will be sent to Mars to build tunnels, structures, mine materials, terraform the atmosphere and surface, and pave the way for humans to be able to survive on mars much easier.

With that said, current age or age of death:

-Gennady Padalka: alive at 65
-Yuri Malenchenko: alive at 61
-Sergei Krikalev: alive at 65
-Aleksandr Kaleri: alive at 67
-Sergei Avdeyev: alive at 67
-Oleg Kononenko: alive at 59 and is currently on the ISS.
-Valeri Polyakov: death at 80
-Fyodor Yurchikhin: alive at 64



-Peggy is alive and is 63, and so on.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

I thought of that as well, as some level of safeguard, rather than having to deal with a couple of million lbs of it. The LEM only had 2,376Kg (5,238lbs) of fuel in it while Starship in its current configuration carries 1,179,340Kg (2.6M lbs) of fuel.

The LEM wasn’t reusable, and it was small, but things are definitely different. I get the desire to ditch excess, but a hypergolic propellant starter system or even the torch system seems like a worthwhile backup, but engineers and people far smarter are working on the job, so I’m assuming they know what they are doing.

[Irace86.2.0]

[Irace86.2.0]

[Irace86.2.0]

[Irace86.2.0]

[Irace86.2.0]

[Irace86.2.0]

[Spuds]

A second reminder for anyone who didn't get the point the first time. This is a thread about stuff in outer space. If someone wants to have a discussion about whatever shape they believe the earth is while assuming there is no outer space, then please make your own thread. Especially if it involves religion or trolling by posting a million pictures that have nothing to do with the topic.

@ichitaka05

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

The fastest train ever was a French train on wheels and not a Maglev train, so I don't know if wheels are limiting, so that could also be why he changed.

Wheels are no prob. The point is that "air bearings" operating in a vacuum *or low-pressure* tube was a dumb idea in the first place.

I don't know if creating a lower pressure environment is a terrible idea. It is the sole reason why planes fly so high. Are you saying it is laughable because keeping the tube lower pressure would be hard or prohibitively expensive or dangerous or all or what?

Yeah, maintaining a vacuum or "low pressure" over any decent distance is problematic. Very difficult, very expensive, very susceptible to seismic events, vandalism, terrorism, etc. Vacuum train idea has literally been around over 100 years, apparently "invented" by the father of modern rocketry, Robert Goddard. Yeah, greatly reducing drag is a great idea! But doing that by flying at 40,000 ft in an airplane is not really a problem. Creating and maintaining a vacuum or low-pressure environment in an elongated tube for miles and miles and miles, not so practical. Ol Muskie repeatedly talked and laughed about how *EASY* it is though. Far from it... High-speed rail is a totally doable thing. Hyperloop is not really workable.

A three year mission to mars wouldn't be a death sentence. Are you saying you know the risk of cancer is greater than say smoking tobacco? Around 1.3 billion smoke tobacco including more than 10% of the US population, and even more live around second hand smoke, so finding risk-tolerant people wouldn't be a problem. Several astronauts were smokers including Buzz Aldrin.

No reason to bring up or talk about smoking to muddy waters. Already said there are any number of people who would sign up for a Mars mission despite the risks.

People would be exposed to FAR greater solar radiation and also cosmic rays. All the time logged by astronauts in low earth orbit where they are protected by the Van Allen belts does not translate into survivability outside the V.A. belts. Even lunar missions on the scale of days are far far more risky as solar activity can injure or kill astronauts outside the belts. Obviously a mission to Mars would leave them exposed for much longer. Building a ship with sufficient shielding makes the mission impractical, unless we want to spend a significant portion of GDP on it for years/decades. With the tech we have now or may have in the next say 10-20 years, I don't see it happening.

Staying on mars would require tunnels, which is why there is The Boring Company.

I don't see any giant boring machines being sent to Mars any time soon...

NASA discusses using lava tubes in its mission plan for long term housing in the initial years to avoid larger radiation doses.

Hell of a lot more realistic than sending massive boring machines...

NASA will likely extend their limit on acceptable radiation levels like they did recently, so astronauts can go to Mars, but what really is going to happen is Optimus

Optimus? I don't think humanoid robots would be of much use, but anyway, I think Optimus is way behind what Boston Dynamics has been doing.

and other robots and autonomous vehicles will be sent to Mars to build tunnels, structures, mine materials, terraform the atmosphere and surface, and pave the way for humans to be able to survive on mars much easier.

None of that is happening in our lifetimes...

With that said, current age or age of death:

Again, the environment outside the Van Allen belts is far more hostile/deadly vs. ISS/low earth orbit.

People seem to think that going to Mars is just a step beyond going to the moon. It is one or two orders of magnitude more difficult. I don't think it's realistic with chemical rockets. Unless you decide that a 25% chance of survival is acceptable risk...

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Unplugem

Ah, yes, the science-fiction fan is here to report me, just as I expected.

Look here, my friend. I am not trying to bash your beliefs; I am only trying to draw the connections for you, so that you can comprehend what you actually believe. Some people cannot connect the dots, even though the names are identical to Roman gods.

I'm not trying to dissuade you from believing in ancient Roman paganism. If you are going to tag a moderator to come and punish me, then let me ask: what exactly did I do wrong here? Didn't I stay on topic? Didn't I only show how "outer space," which is indeed the topic of this thread, is named after Roman gods? Is that not a fact? What did I do wrong here, that makes you want to report this discussion to a moderator? How have I wronged you?

How is posting images "spam?" I don't believe it's "spamming," but what do I know?

I’ve stated:

WARNING TO ALL: If you gonna debate, debate like an adult & not like my 7-yo nephew. No need to do pointless jabbing, taunting or calling pointless names. From this post on, idc if you’re old member or new member, if you break this rule, I WILL get you an early holiday leave (for 1 month).

You don’t need to call any member a pointless names. Spud even gave you a chance… I’ve gave a final warning, so no, not getting a second chance. I went through several pages of posts to see anyone else broke the warning, but I did not see it (maybe cuz it 6am & I’ve barely woke up, so didn’t see it).

Enjoy your 1 month holiday break. Hope to see you come back more calm without calling names & have an adult discussion or debate.

& this is still a warning to ALL in this thread. I’m not asking everyone to hold hands & sing kumbaya. All I’m asking for is not to yippee ki yay each other.

[Spuds]

Originally Posted by Unplugem

Ah, yes, the science-fiction fan is here to report me, just as I expected.

Look here, my friend. I am not trying to bash your beliefs; I am only trying to draw the connections for you, so that you can comprehend what you actually believe. Some people cannot connect the dots, even though the names are identical to Roman gods.

I'm not trying to dissuade you from believing in ancient Roman paganism. If you are going to tag a moderator to come and punish me, then let me ask: what exactly did I do wrong here? Didn't I stay on topic? Didn't I only show how "outer space," which is indeed the topic of this thread, is named after Roman gods? Is that not a fact? What did I do wrong here, that makes you want to report this discussion to a moderator? How have I wronged you?

How is posting images "spam?" I don't believe it's "spamming," but what do I know?

No, you are preaching and trolling. If you don't understand what that means you should really get off the internet and go experience the real world if they will still take you. Annoy the people geolocated near you before you take your crusade global, maybe they will have more patience. You know as well as I do that nobody here is going to suddenly change their mind, so why keep coming back. It's pointless except to be annoying.

Edit: Apologies to Ichi, I didn't see that you dealt with it before posting.