New ICE Vehicles Banned in California by 2035

[Arthur-A]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

By the way, our beloved 86 is just as "stupid" if you are looking at it as the perfect car. It gets mediocre gas mileage for it's size particularly compared to a hybrid, it isn't really a four person vehicle, and again unless you are hauling something more thick than a tire, you aren't going to get it in the trunk.

Oh yeah, I'm sure communists seethe every time they see one

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Wally86

I mean... in the states, you absolutely can have a jet powered golf cart.

You just can't (legally) drive it on public roads.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Arthur-A

But still, people should be free to buy whatever vehicle they want, otherwise it'll be a turd-world totalitarian shithole.

The cars that are available to us are shaped by regulations that strongly favor trucks and SUVS, and actively reward cars and trucks/SUVs for being physically *bigger*.

So those of us who want to buy smaller, lighter-weight cars are generally just out of luck

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by alex87f

relatively "narcissistic" interests ("hey, that truck makes me look manlier")

I can't help but add that I'm so tired of this type of thinking. I literally know dozens of truck owners (I live in the US, and in the South, and in Georgia after all) and not a single one of them own their truck because it makes them look manlier (or womanlier since about 40% of them are women).

Nearly every one of them has a utilitarian purpose (even if it's only 20% of the time) for owning a truck.

And, unlike a group of enthusiasts who think you need a vehicle for every occasion, most buy their vehicle for that 20% utilization since they have limited funds for transportation.

Are there folks that maybe buy trucks just because they can, and have no use for it, sure. But that is a very small percentage. Just because every truck you see on your commute is not carrying a load, or pulling a trailer doesn't mean that it doesn't spend part of its life doing that.

[/rant]

[Wally86]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

You just can't (legally) drive it on public roads.

That's a golf cart problem lol. I bet you could get one registered and road legal under some other status (hot rod or something).

Originally Posted by ZDan

The cars that are available to us are shaped by regulations that strongly favor trucks and SUVS, and actively reward cars and trucks/SUVs for being physically *bigger*.

So those of us who want to buy smaller, lighter-weight cars are generally just out of luck

Ain't this the truth.

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

I can't help but add that I'm so tired of this type of thinking. I literally know dozens of truck owners (I live in the US, and in the South, and in Georgia after all) and not a single one of them own their truck because it makes them look manlier (or womanlier since about 40% of them are women).

Nearly every one of them has a utilitarian purpose (even if it's only 20% of the time) for owning a truck.

And, unlike a group of enthusiasts who think you need a vehicle for every occasion, most buy their vehicle for that 20% utilization since they have limited funds for transportation.

Are there folks that maybe by trucks just because they can, and have no use for it, sure. But that is a very small percentage. Just because every truck you see on your commute is not carrying a load, or pulling a trailer doesn't mean that it doesn't spend part of its life doing that.

[/rant]

I've seen people make the justification for a truck but most of my friends that have trucks know I'm a big advocate for just renting them the couple of times a year that you actually need one.

I know for bulk home improvement purchases I've both rented trucks and had pallets drop shipped to my driveway. Sometimes a little creativity can save you a lot of money. (Especially with today's truck prices)

[Sasquachulator]

People buy cars/trucks to fullfill 90% of their needs. Things that happen very seldomly (like moving a couch) they dont need to worry about because how many times do you move a couch?

People who do outdoorsy stuff do so far more often than moving a couch and they'd like to have the one vehicle be able to fullfill that needs among the host of other common everday needs. No one wants to be inconvenienced by renting a car for example when they dont need to.

Some people use silly justifications like towing a trailer ONCE a year (IF They even tow) but i think it ultimately comes down to both WANTING the product AND making sure it does what you want it to do. You're dropping upwards of more than $50k it better do as much shit as you want....whats the point of having it if you are just gonna spend a big chunk of time renting or inconveniencing yourself without your big purchase (unless its not intended to do certain things...like you dont buy an 86 with the intent of trying to haul ikea stuff in it...i mean you could to a certain extent but you didnt buy that car to do those things).

and unless you're made of money most households are 1 car or 2 car. If youre a 1 car household your car better do everything you want it to do. 2 is easier to deal since you can have one car do certain things and another do something else.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Wally86

I've seen people make the justification for a truck but most of my friends that have trucks know I'm a big advocate for just renting them the couple of times a year that you actually need one.

I know for bulk home improvement purchases I've both rented trucks and had pallets drop shipped to my driveway. Sometimes a little creativity can save you a lot of money. (Especially with today's truck prices)

Sure, and you could say the same for a car that's owned as a track toy or a canyon carver you use infrequently.

Renting is practical when it's a once or twice a year thing. It isn't if you are doing it multiple times a month.

Trucks don't have to be expensive, it's just that's the way most folks buy them these days (all decked out). A base Colorado is @$30K and a based Silverado is @$39K.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

I can't help but add that I'm so tired of this type of thinking. I literally know dozens of truck owners (I live in the US, and in the South, and in Georgia after all) and not a single one of them own their truck because it makes them look manlier (or womanlier since about 40% of them are women).

Nearly every one of them has a utilitarian purpose (even if it's only 20% of the time) for owning a truck.

And, unlike a group of enthusiasts who think you need a vehicle for every occasion, most buy their vehicle for that 20% utilization since they have limited funds for transportation.

Are there folks that maybe by trucks just because they can, and have no use for it, sure. But that is a very small percentage. Just because every truck you see on your commute is not carrying a load, or pulling a trailer doesn't mean that it doesn't spend part of its life doing that.

[/rant]

Like really, really 20% of the miles of the vehicle is hauling, off-roading, using AWD/4WD, or towing? Something like 80% of people use it once a year or never. The remaining 20% might use it less than ten times a year, but 20%? Someone would need to live in a rural area in snow country to say that, and even then.

I realize you were likely exaggerating, but the exaggeration is probably extreme for the masses who rarely use these utility vehicles, and what’s more, their whole family drives them. How could four people in a household need these utility vehicles for mostly personal transportation and the rare event, when they could probably borrow it from their family members?

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Sure, and you could say the same for a car that's owned as a track toy or a canyon carver you use infrequently.

Renting is practical when it's a once or twice a year thing. It isn't if you are doing it multiple times a month.

Trucks don't have to be expensive, it's just that's the way most folks buy them these days (all decked out). A base Colorado is @$30K and a based Silverado is @$39K.

But as a daily truck, that impacts emissions. The rare motorcycle ride or canyon ride in a sports car isn’t impactful like a gas guzzling daily suv.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

Like really, really 20% of the miles of the vehicle is hauling, off-roading, using AWD/4WD, or towing? Something like 80% of people use it once a year or never. The remaining 20% might use it less than ten times a year, but 20%? Someone would need to live in a rural area in snow country to say that, and even then.

I realize you were likely exaggerating, but the exaggeration is probably extreme for the masses who rarely use these utility vehicles, and what’s more, their whole family drives them. How could four people in a household need these utility vehicles for mostly personal transportation and the rare event, when they could probably borrow it from their family members?

It's not an exaggeration but admittedly is an educated guess. I do live in a relatively rural area (many of my coworkers own multi-acre homes in West Georgia and East Alabama). Most of them are hunters, fisherman, farmers or ranchers, "horse people", etc besides their daytime jobs.

Move 30 miles East (Atlanta) it would change of course but the makeup of the vehicles changes as well.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

But as a daily truck, that impacts emissions. The rare motorcycle ride or canyon ride in a sports car isn’t impactful like a gas guzzling daily suv.

So do sports cars, compared to something that gets twice the gas mileage.

I understand what your are saying and don't fully disagree with you. My "complaint" is the stereotype of truck owners as people that should be driving a Prius but drive a truck instead. Those are more rare than most folks think, at least in my area of the world.

Oh, and EV trucks (at least the current generation) aren't going to help that much for those that actually use their trucks as trucks because of the correlation of load to range.

All the posers, or very casual truck users, should convert immediately.

[Wally86]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Sure, and you could say the same for a car that's owned as a track toy or a canyon carver you use infrequently.

Renting is practical when it's a once or twice a year thing. It isn't if you are doing it multiple times a month.

Trucks don't have to be expensive, it's just that's the way most folks buy them these days (all decked out). A base Colorado is @$30K and a based Silverado is @$39K.

I agree with you on both counts.

You absolutely should be able to buy whatever vehicle you want regardless of its use. It's yours to enjoy as you will.

And you definitely should have base model and lower model options that can do what you need also. I've got a 2020 base 86 and I'm sure I'd buy a base model of any car I look for. Base models now have more features than any luxury car 20 years ago. It's wild what you can get for base prices nowadays.

[Lantanafrs2]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Sure, and you could say the same for a car that's owned as a track toy or a canyon carver you use infrequently.

Renting is practical when it's a once or twice a year thing. It isn't if you are doing it multiple times a month.

Trucks don't have to be expensive, it's just that's the way most folks buy them these days (all decked out). A base Colorado is @$30K and a based Silverado is @$39K.

As Americans we can buy what we want whether it pleases quasi intellectual pinhead or not. If others don't approve they can stage peaceful protests or deface valuable artwork lol

[soundman98]

does my 5 year old tacoma make me look manlier?