Random Thoughts - Part III The Search for Spark (No Politics)

[spcmafia]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

AHHH but that example makes my point perfectly. That war is currently done almost exclusively from great distances not by boots on the ground. Precision artillery (these are not the "fling it and forget it" guns of even 30 years ago, guided rockets and missiles and drones are the reasons that those tanks and other equipment are in the hands of farmers not guys with rifles. The range of a M72 anti tank rocket is 600 feet if you are REALLY good and lucky. The Stinger is 3 miles and can be guided every inch of that. Which one do you think is more effective?
Your example is exactly what modern warfare looks like with he that hits from a distance lives long enough to win.
Of course you still need boots on the ground to hold and maintain your gains but they are not how the ground is being taken.

No, no, I get that. There are other variables in warfare, but I'm not going to get into that.



Where I was going with my pseudo-joke was bringing a knife to a gunfight phrase, because you could bring the latest tanks, UAVs, Helis, etc, just to have some bugaloo boi fck it all with our lord and savior Saint Javelin.



So the phrase should be switched to "Don't bring a knife, bring a javelin".

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by spcmafia

No, no, I get that. There are other variables in warfare, but I'm not going to get into that.



Where I was going with my pseudo-joke was bringing a knife to a gunfight phrase, because you could bring the latest tanks, UAVs, Helis, etc, just to have some bugaloo boi fck it all with our lord and savior Saint Javelin.



So the phrase should be switched to "Don't bring a knife, bring a javelin".

But again that is it. If they were taking out tanks with Panzerfausts, bazookas and sticky bombs it would be bringing a knife to a gunfight.
They are not. They are destroying them from miles away with drones, Stingers and Javelins.
The people with the tanks have brought a gun to a missile fight and it shows.

[spcmafia]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

But again that is it. If they were taking out tanks with Panzerfausts, bazookas and sticky bombs it would be bringing a knife to a gunfight.
They are not. They are destroying them from miles away with drones, Stingers and Javelins.
The people with the tanks have brought a gun to a missile fight and it shows.

Sooo... Don't bring a tank to a missile fight?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by spcmafia

Sooo... Don't bring a tank to a missile fight?

Really there is little reason to take a tank to any fight anymore.
They started out as a way to break through well established lines, then they became a way to get heavy ordinance close enough to the battle to make a difference now they are pretty much useful for nothing but fighting other tanks.
The development of light antitank weapons' and missile/rocket carrying drones or aircraft that can destroy them from miles away make them sitting ducks in today's battlefield. They simply no longer have any tactical value at all.

EDIT: I will amend that statement a bit. They still have value in a psychological sort of way as they are big, noisy and intimating but as an effective weapon system they are past their prime.

[spcmafia]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Really there is little reason to take a tank to any fight anymore.
They started out as a way to break through well established lines, then they became a way to get heavy ordinance close enough to the battle to make a difference now they are pretty much useful for nothing but fighting other tanks.
The development of light antitank weapons' and missile/rocket carrying drones or aircraft that can destroy them from miles away make them sitting ducks in today's battlefield. They simply no longer have any tactical value at all.

Actually there are a couple, we're still dumping millions on them or a reason, just like the F35s, the HMMWVs, etc. Hell, the Army is even considering a new variant of the M4. What detriments performance in the battlefield is when you have a combative force that lacks the level of readiness/mentality other nations have, aaaannnd relying on soviet-level quality of products.



Like a game once said "It sure counts who has the biggest stick, but it matters a hell of a lot more on who swings it"

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by spcmafia

Actually there are a couple, we're still dumping millions on them or a reason, just like the F35s, the HMMWVs, etc. Hell, the Army is even considering a new variant of the M4. What detriments performance in the battlefield is when you have a combative force that lacks the level of readiness/mentality other nations have, aaaannnd relying on soviet-level quality of products.



Like a game once said "It sure counts who has the biggest stick, but it matters a hell of a lot more on who swings it"

LOL The military, any military is well known for hanging onto things well past their prime. Tanks are fine if you are going after a group of tribesmen armed with technicals but that is about all.
A new variant of the M4 is just progress. There will always be a need for small arms.
The F35s are exactly what I was talking about in the start of all this. They can put a missile anyplace they want from many miles away.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

LOLTanks are fine if you are going after a group of tribesmen armed with technicals but that is about all..

You mean like Saint's Row 3 and Halo right? I find them very valuable in both..

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

LOL The military, any military is well known for hanging onto things well past their prime.

Hey, new shit's expensive.

[Spuds]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Really there is little reason to take a tank to any fight anymore.
They started out as a way to break through well established lines, then they became a way to get heavy ordinance close enough to the battle to make a difference now they are pretty much useful for nothing but fighting other tanks.
The development of light antitank weapons' and missile/rocket carrying drones or aircraft that can destroy them from miles away make them sitting ducks in today's battlefield. They simply no longer have any tactical value at all.

EDIT: I will amend that statement a bit. They still have value in a psychological sort of way as they are big, noisy and intimating but as an effective weapon system they are past their prime.

In general:
-The greater the range/timespan of kinetic engagement, the more countermeasures can be brought to bear before impact and the more effective they are.
-The greater the complexity of the engagement the more vulnerabilities it has, and more elements that can just go wrong.
-Long range fires don't take, secure, and hold ground.

[spcmafia]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

LOL The military, any military is well known for hanging onto things well past their prime. Tanks are fine if you are going after a group of tribesmen armed with technicals but that is about all.
A new variant of the M4 is just progress. There will always be a need for small arms.
The F35s are exactly what I was talking about in the start of all this. They can put a missile anyplace they want from many miles away.

All in all, again, is a matter of who is using the equipment. For example, you can bring a Javelin, a 120mm, against a tank, as long as it is not against a U.S one because of its capabilities. Other quality, like, soviet, absolutely.



You can bring an F35, but make sure you do a proper PMCS, then do it again, so it doesnt "ejecto seato cuz" you.



Like I said, there are a lot of variants when it comes to warfare, relying on one type of them makes you predictable, and it gives away your position because of satcom surveillance, that's why we still make, and invest in all the other equipment, for redundancy purposes.

[echo419]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

Last month, I've entered into local pro soccer team 3 days fantasy camp thingy. Surprisingly, I've won it and gonna be meeting the players along w quick warm-up exhibition match. It's happening tonight through Saturday (2~3hrs each day), I'm excited that I can't focus on work...

IDK, if you'd find this cool or not but Josef Martinez used to my my next door neighbor. Super nice guy, really likes his dogs and his grandma a lot.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by spcmafia

For example, you can bring a Javelin, a 120mm, against a tank, as long as it is not against a U.S one because of its capabilities. Other quality, like, soviet, absolutely..

I don't know, this Javelin would likely stop any tank....

[2020BRZtS]

Originally Posted by echo419

IDK, if you'd find this cool or not but Josef Martinez used to my my next door neighbor. Super nice guy, really likes his dogs and his grandma a lot.

They made a movie about my former neighbor. It was called Foxcatcher. He doesn't live there anymore.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by echo419

IDK, if you'd find this cool or not but Josef Martinez used to my my next door neighbor. Super nice guy, really likes his dogs and his grandma a lot.

That’s crazy cool!