The All-New GR Corolla World Premiere April 1, 2022

[Yoshoobaroo]

It may not be so bad then. If you can get one for MSRP ~18mo after release my complaints are mostly gone.

Then again Toyota’s allocation system still sucks ballsack. I want to just go to my local dealer and say ‘I want to order BLANK’ and then they say ‘of course, we’ll take your deposit and send you a delivery date in the next few days’. That was my experience with Subaru and it was fantastic. No games, no bidding war within the waitlist, and I got the car exactly as I wanted, at the time they gave me when I ordered it. I don’t care about having to wait, but this whole ‘you may be able to buy what we’re getting in somewhere between next month and 2024’ is just garbage.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

It may not be so bad then. If you can get one for MSRP ~18mo after release my complaints are mostly gone.

Then again Toyota’s allocation system still sucks ballsack. I want to just go to my local dealer and say ‘I want to order BLANK’ and then they say ‘of course, we’ll take your deposit and send you a delivery date in the next few days’. That was my experience with Subaru and it was fantastic. No games, no bidding war within the waitlist, and I got the car exactly as I wanted, at the time they gave me when I ordered it. I don’t care about having to wait, but this whole ‘you may be able to buy what we’re getting in somewhere between next month and 2024’ is just garbage.

That is just it. Everybody isn't going to get one of the first run even if willing to pay what will be a huge premium. Not even basically realistic to think otherwise. after the initial frenzy is over then they will still be around and much less expensive.
Hell, in two years you will probably be able to pick up a good used one from somebody that moved onto the next bigger and better thing.

[Sasquachulator]

Originally Posted by fredzy

I think it's an R&T paywalled article, I must have been able to read it before. It was the widely quoted 6000 first year, with ramp up to 8000 but "no hard cap on production." 8000/yr could end up being plenty for the determined after a year or two.

They can ramp up for the demand as they see fit like they've been doing with the GR Yaris. I think that car is only mandated to be around 25000 units a year to meet the Rally requirements, but I think they've ramped it up because the demand for them is high.

Keep in mind the GR Corolla doesnt really have a "history" so to speak so you dont want to be over optimistic about sales numbers, especially since its also an enthusiast level sports non-SUV, with a gas engine in a ever-changing SUV + EV world.

Plus these cars seem to be all hand built in the Matomachi(?) plant, home of the Lexus LFA, the Lexus LC and the GR Yaris.

Knowing what cars come from there, it doesnt seem to be set up to be a high volume plant, so they can only make so many at a time....especially now they'll be adding another car to the production line.

[Ohio Enthusiast]

Truth is, the vast majority of enthusiasts that cry "if only they made more of them I would buy one" would actually not buy one. Toyota (and every of manufacturer) cater for the people that actually buy their cars, not to forum jockeys. If enthusiast actually bought the new cars they claim to want the automotive market would have looked quite different from today. But it's always "too expensive", "not enough power", "my wife can't drive stick", "no room for the kids", "I'm never buying a new car", etc...

[weederr33]

I will buy one for sure depending on supply, the economy, and my own financial situation by the end of next year. That's all I'm planning so far. Until that point, I plan to sit back and enjoy what people do with them and how they last.

[bcj]

So,

I bought a new FR-S, but it took them 20 years to build it.
I wanted one, but nobody would make one. The patience was difficult.
Don't think I will drop it for the next big thing soon though.
I'll wear it in a bit more before handing it off to the 2nd owner.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Ohio Enthusiast

Truth is, the vast majority of enthusiasts that cry "if only they made more of them I would buy one" would actually not buy one. Toyota (and every of manufacturer) cater for the people that actually buy their cars, not to forum jockeys. If enthusiast actually bought the new cars they claim to want the automotive market would have looked quite different from today. But it's always "too expensive", "not enough power", "my wife can't drive stick", "no room for the kids", "I'm never buying a new car", etc...

I wasn't going to go down that road but yes 100% accurate!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by bcj

So,

I bought a new FR-S, but it took them 20 years to build it.
I wanted one, but nobody would make one. The patience was difficult.
Don't think I will drop it for the next big thing soon though.
I'll wear it in a bit more before handing it off to the 2nd owner.

Yep. This crying of "there are no more inexpensive sportscars made anymore" is sort of misleading. There are just as many now as at any given single point in the past. People tend to group while decades together and say "Look at all the choices there were" when in reality many of the examples were far from affordable at the time or were only decent for one limited version or only existed for for 2 or 3 model years.

[TylerLieberman]

Originally Posted by Ohio Enthusiast

Truth is, the vast majority of enthusiasts that cry "if only they made more of them I would buy one" would actually not buy one. Toyota (and every of manufacturer) cater for the people that actually buy their cars, not to forum jockeys. If enthusiast actually bought the new cars they claim to want the automotive market would have looked quite different from today. But it's always "too expensive", "not enough power", "my wife can't drive stick", "no room for the kids", "I'm never buying a new car", etc...

This is true. Like when the MKV Supra came out. People were going on about how they’d buy if it had 400-500hp or if it had a manual…. But they’re driving 10yr beat down WRXs… they aren’t buying anything lol

But there are people who would buy who would buy some of these cars if they were available and at the price they were supposed to be. A small portion, but they’re out there.

I wanted a new car like the 86 for years, as I grew up messing with 240s and RX7 s and Zs. It finally came and at a realistic price, so I bought one. Immediately. Went through a few other cars and then opted to buy another because of how much I liked it.

I had considered other cars over the years. One of which being a CTR. But due to limited availability and ridiculous markups, I gave up on it after 2yrs. Same applies to the Corolla. Spec wise, I have zero issues. Plenty of power. Plenty of space. Looks solid I’m every way to me. But the question will come down to whether or not one is actually available to be had at the proper price point. My guess is near Golf R pricing for a circuit edition, which I’d be ok with. But I’m not gonna spend $60,000 on a car that’s only worth $40,000.

I don’t need to be first. If I could find one early on at MSRP then I’d go in at the beginning. If not, I’m fine with waiting. How long? Idk. My life has changed pretty dramatically in the past 18 months. Could easily change again in another 18-24 months to where I don’t really care to own a vehicle like this. Who knows.

[soundman98]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

And that really defeats the purpose of an affordable enthusiast car. Toyota can fix this, but they won’t.

lol. i remember when everyone said that in 2013-14 about the 86.

IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE AFFORDABLE. HOW IS $25K AFFORDABLE

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by Ohio Enthusiast

Truth is, the vast majority of enthusiasts that cry "if only they made more of them I would buy one" would actually not buy one. Toyota (and every of manufacturer) cater for the people that actually buy their cars, not to forum jockeys. If enthusiast actually bought the new cars they claim to want the automotive market would have looked quite different from today. But it's always "too expensive", "not enough power", "my wife can't drive stick", "no room for the kids", "I'm never buying a new car", etc...

This is true. Many enthusiasts need to buy used because of the prices and markups. The average age of buyers gets older and older in general, but especially for sports cars that are second cars or luxuries over being practical, so they cater to an older and older crowd. This is one reason why we are getting a GR Corolla and not a GR Yaris; the Corolla is more likely to be bought be an older person as a practical family vehicle; the Yaris might be cheaper, but it might not find as much interest with older buyers.

Even if enthusiasts bought all the cars they claim they would buy like you suggest, are we really talking about a lot of cars being sold? Not really, so would the manufacturers change their investments much. Why would companies waste millions investing in low-volume, low-margin, sports cars when they could sell hundreds of thousands of other cars? Well, Toyota realized they would fade into bland, suburban, white noise if they continued on the bath they were on. The point of the sports car was to invigorate the brand, no different than competing in motorsports. This marketing strategy doesn’t work all too well if the only cars anyone ever sees is on a YouTube video. The number of MKV Supras I have seen I can count on one hand, yet I’ve seen more C8s. I’ve seen many 86s of course, and people ask me all the time what type of car I have and who makes it because it interests them, shouting out their window at me (the custom badges don’t help). They say really, thats a Subaru or Toyota. It seems silly to me to make a GR Corolla that is priced with more premium cars or out of touch or practicality to a typical, middle-class family or young enough person.

Enthusiasts will show up if there is value. A 460hp Camaro or Mustang for $35k is a pretty good deal, and the sales figure support that value. Add up the sales of the Mustang, Camaro, Challenger/Charger, and enthusiasts are buying a lot of sporty vehicles, in the hundreds of thousands. I mean if anyone looks at the top vehicle sales, it seems like the Asian manufacturers do fine at producing some of the top CUVs and sedans in terms of production numbers, yet the sporty car market seems a little lacking in sales from them by comparison. Someone can get a F250 starting at $37k or a GT Mustang, but a turbo AWD 1.6L will probably be $40k+ from Toyota with low-volume dealer markups. It is a formula that is set to fail. It didn’t work out too well for the Focus RS either. They need to price it right and have enough volume to avoid markups to get the car out there, so it can do the marketing for their others cars and CUVs and pull more people into the Toyota family. Just my opinion if I was doing the marketing strategy.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g3...ing-cars-2021/

[PulsarBeeerz]

Remember, Toyota are a business first and the most profitable automaker in the world at that. They don't need enthusiasts cars or interest to move their reliable yet boring appliances. They sold 27,000+ twins in 2013. Sales goal for GR Corolla are ~6000ish units in 2023 or 2000 units more than Golf R in 2019 at its peak. What is the problem?

"Speaking to Road and Track, Toyota Vice President of Marketing Mike Tripp says the brand will produce “one too few” of its GR Corolla. The strategy is similar to that of supercar makers, which keep supply low in order to pump up demand.
Tripp stated that the limitations have nothing to do with Toyota’s ability to produce the cars at its Motomachi production facility, but rather the brand wanting to keep the GR Corolla exclusive and desirable.
“I wouldn’t say the limiting factor on these vehicles is our ability to produce them,” Tripp said. “It’s being very careful to make sure that we maintain the niche credibility.”

Focus RS kind of died because of dealer markups but not really. They sold every unit they made and over msrp. It was never meant to do Mustang numbers, they had the regular Focus for that. Additionally Ford was going in a different strategic direction by not making cars at all beyond Mustang soon.

[soundman98]

so i keep seeing vague references, lets just put it out there...

seems a lot of you agree that enthusiasts never have enough money, as all these performance vehicles are "priced outside of an enthusiasts range", so therefore, people that have money and can afford it, cannot be enthusiasts?

[Jeonsa]

Originally Posted by Sasquachulator

They can ramp up for the demand as they see fit like they've been doing with the GR Yaris. I think that car is only mandated to be around 25000 units a year to meet the Rally requirements, but I think they've ramped it up because the demand for them is high.

Keep in mind the GR Corolla doesnt really have a "history" so to speak so you dont want to be over optimistic about sales numbers, especially since its also an enthusiast level sports non-SUV, with a gas engine in a ever-changing SUV + EV world.

Plus these cars seem to be all hand built in the Matomachi(?) plant, home of the Lexus LFA, the Lexus LC and the GR Yaris.

Knowing what cars come from there, it doesnt seem to be set up to be a high volume plant, so they can only make so many at a time....especially now they'll be adding another car to the production line.

They could ramp up production but there was also that “One too few” comment Mike Tripp was talking about where they want to make enough to satisfy demand but they want it to still feel exclusive. Which fits a order system better than a allocation one.

As far as the Corolla goes, it actually does have a decent history but Toyota decided to take the most popular one (globally) in the AE86 and market it with the twins. Lol. Then they have the 90s Trueno/Levins in japan and that WRC AWD Corolla in late 90’s that used the Celica’s AWD system, but those aren’t really well known stateside.