Any good reason to stick with 1st Gen?

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by ZDan

For me, the new car is no less a "blank canvas" than my '17. Maybe more of one due to lack of big brakes For sure minimally I'd be looking at springs, dampers, way more front camber, and wheels/tires minimum, with swaybars and exhaust/intake/tuning mods further possibilities, same mods I've done with my car. And of course many will be looking at E85 and FI with the new one, same as with last-gen. It doesn't seem to me that the new car is any less analog either. Weight has gone up by about 50-60 lb. same vs. same, +1.5%, which isn't great, but not as bad as it could have been, not by a long shot. And it's only ~15-20 lb. heavier than my PP.

Oh yeah I think Toyota/Subaru had already gone in some ways in that direction with your 1.5 gen being a little heavier and having the digital readouts (compared with the 2013), so probably less of a difference for you. I have a 2013 FRS which was the lightest, most primitive and worst equipped of the years (halogens, analog radio, no heated seats, fully analog gauges, no steering wheel controls) but I also enjoy it for those same reasons. This new one loses some of that simplistic character, even if objectively better in nearly every way.

I agree the new one is no less of a blank canvass though. I'm planning to transfer over my coilovers, BBK, and wheels/tires, but I'd probably do those mods on any tracked car I bought. The only way it's less of a blank canvass is it makes as much power (if not more) as my E85 tuned 1st gen, so I may not bother going E85 with it.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Oh yeah I think Toyota/Subaru had already gone in some ways in that direction with your 1.5 gen being a little heavier and having the digital readouts (compared with the 2013), so probably less of a difference for you. I have a 2013 FRS which was the lightest, most primitive and worst equipped of the years (halogens, analog radio, no heated seats, fully analog gauges, no steering wheel controls) but I also enjoy it for those same reasons. This new one loses some of that simplistic character, even if objectively better in nearly every way.

I have base 2013 and base 2017 BRZs weighing in at 2764 vs. 2777. Kind of amazing how much heavier the PP is, +43 lb...
I like minimalist cars, but things like LED headlights and steering wheel controls add pretty much zero weight and for me are pluses. Touchscreen controls where you have to file through menus, not so much! Terrible idea...

I agree the new one is no less of a blank canvass though. I'm planning to transfer over my coilovers, BBK, and wheels/tires, but I'd probably do those mods on any tracked car I bought.

Yeah, if all that stuff just swaps over that definitely makes me more likely to buy sooner!

The only way it's less of a blank canvass is it makes as much power (if not more) as my E85 tuned 1st gen, so I may not bother going E85 with it.

But it's nice to know that if you *did* wanna go that route, there's still more performance to be gained! For me, E85 too impractical...

[saltywetman]

Originally Posted by alone1i

My initial thoughts at the beginning of 2nd gen-
- it is ugly, specially rear
- 1st gen was built with passion and the chief engineer Tada-san was such an passionate about this project, 2nd gen is not. 2nd gen more like commercial than passionate.
- 1st Gen is OG. And OG is always beloved no matter what comes next

Now-a-days, looks like my initial thoughts are not that correct that I used to feel.

The first gens were def a passion project and was a very well recieved and a success (at least in its initial few years of sales). Then the facelift added a bit of refinement, and now the second gens are even more refined. They pretty much improved on a lot of chief complaint areas while still staying loyal to Tada-san's formula. No need to reinvent the wheel but the additional refinements still make this second gen another forward step with the same winning formula

[alone1i]

Originally Posted by saltywetman

The first gens were def a passion project and was a very well recieved and a success (at least in its initial few years of sales). Then the facelift added a bit of refinement, and now the second gens are even more refined. They pretty much improved on a lot of chief complaint areas while still staying loyal to Tada-san's formula. No need to reinvent the wheel but the additional refinements still make this second gen another forward step with the same winning formula

Exactly it is my feelings too. My 2020 86 is packed with performance package, once they start offering that, that day I may start thinking to upgrade it to 2nd Gen.

[falcon_wizard]

For me simple reasons:
-built engine
-turbo
-low mileage
-oil cooler
-improved brakes
-reliable,well sorted and in top condition
-I love my car after 8 years as much as the first day.
-prefers the look as well, particularly the rear, but they are both nice.
-all paid for a long time ago :-)

This being said, If mine was bone stock, I would consider a gen 2 once its available with the brembo brakes package and give it a year or two to sort out any issues with the new design. If I was into getting my first sports car, then I would get a gen 2 for the improved mechanics. In my case, my car is sorted to my taste after a couple years of work and performs to a much higher level than a gen2, so I plan to keep it as long as it will have me :-) hopefully another 6 years or more… at which point I’ll probably buy another one… so one could say I’m down for a 2028MY Gen 2 and will be creating a thread to see if its worth buying it vice a gen 3 :-)

[alone1i]

Originally Posted by falcon_wizard

For me simple reasons:
-built engine
-turbo
-low mileage
-oil cooler
-improved brakes
-reliable,well sorted and in top condition
-I love my car after 8 years as much as the first day.
-prefers the look as well, particularly the rear, but they are both nice.
-all paid for a long time ago :-)

This being said, If mine was bone stock, I would consider a gen 2 once its available with the brembo brakes package and give it a year or two to sort out any issues with the new design. If I was into getting my first sports car, then I would get a gen 2 for the improved mechanics. In my case, my car is sorted to my taste after a couple years of work and performs to a much higher level than a gen2, so I plan to keep it as long as it will have me :-) hopefully another 6 years or more… at which point I’ll probably buy another one… so one could say I’m down for a 2028MY Gen 2 and will be creating a thread to see if its worth buying it vice a gen 3 :-)

At the beginning I also thought about buying the basic model (talking about first gen) and slowly slowly upgrade one by one. I even already spent nearly $1K on buying floor jack, stands, a bunch of tools (made in japan, yahoo but $$$) etc. I am in my 30's now and have a wife who just want me on my spare time (18+ talk here). Then I am in IT industry and its pretty hard for me to find spare time now a days. And I also love playing StarCraft 2 sometimes. So, after all this consideration, I think it is way more realistic to get something well packaged from factory and honestly my current 86 with PP, is so nice. I have driven few other highly modified 86/brz, they are fasters but not smooth like mine factory one.

[Dirty Harry]

Originally Posted by ZDan

I have base 2013 and base 2017 BRZs weighing in at 2764 vs. 2777.

In Oz the measurements are bit greater between 2013 and 2017+ model years. Not much difference between 2017 and 2022. Ts is a bit fat lol.

BRZ Tare mass.

2013 1216kg (2681lbs).
2017+ 1242kg (2738lbs).
2017+ Ts model 1255kg (2767lbs).
2022 1246kg (2747lbs).

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by Dirty Harry

In Oz the measurements are bit greater between 2013 and 2017+ model years. Not much difference between 2017 and 2022. Ts is a bit fat lol.

BRZ Tare mass.

2013 1216kg (2681lbs).
2017+ 1242kg (2738lbs).
2017+ Ts model 1255kg (2767lbs).
2022 1246kg (2747lbs).

The other apples to oranges difference with the 2022 cars is they don't come with spare tires anymore.

[alex87f]

Yeah, I have 1230kg (2711lbs) on my French registration for a '13. Should be a normed weight with >90% of the tank & all fluids, no driver.
Euro cars had no spare, but a bit more equipment (HIDs, knee airbag, PF mirrors, small stuff)

Weirdly, the car's prior Belgian registration said it weighed 1239kg, even though no physical changes were made during the transfer. Oh well.

[Ohio Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by alex87f

Weirdly, the car's prior Belgian registration said it weighed 1239kg, even though no physical changes were made during the transfer. Oh well.

That's probably based on the numbers in the DMV-equivalent system. I once wrote a little program to parse the registration data provided by one such government office and as expected it was full of small and large errors, duplications and typos. I would trust manufacturer specs (more so when the weighing standard is listed (DIN/EU/dry/etc)) or actual scale weights people post, not government figures.

[alex87f]

Yup. Just found the 2013 brochure, which says 1230 - 1258kg with the above parameters (90% fuel, etc.), +23kg for the automatic.

Guessing 1230kg were for the uber-rare cars with 16" wheels, small brakes and base trim, and the majority of cars are closer to 1258kg.

[jflogerzi]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Oh yeah I think Toyota/Subaru had already gone in some ways in that direction with your 1.5 gen being a little heavier and having the digital readouts (compared with the 2013), so probably less of a difference for you. I have a 2013 FRS which was the lightest, most primitive and worst equipped of the years (halogens, analog radio, no heated seats, fully analog gauges, no steering wheel controls) but I also enjoy it for those same reasons. This new one loses some of that simplistic character, even if objectively better in nearly every way.

I agree the new one is no less of a blank canvass though. I'm planning to transfer over my coilovers, BBK, and wheels/tires, but I'd probably do those mods on any tracked car I bought. The only way it's less of a blank canvass is it makes as much power (if not more) as my E85 tuned 1st gen, so I may not bother going E85 with it.

You need to go e85. if anything the car will be happier. Just do Flex Fuel and ecutek.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by jflogerzi

You need to go e85. if anything the car will be happier. Just do Flex Fuel and ecutek.

I haven't ruled it out, but honestly I think I'd be pretty content with stock power for a while. Maybe if I'm starting to get bored and the warranty has run out.

[Dirty Harry]

Originally Posted by alex87f

Yup. Just found the 2013 brochure, which says 1230 - 1258kg with the above parameters (90% fuel, etc.), +23kg for the automatic.

Guessing 1230kg were for the uber-rare cars with 16" wheels, small brakes and base trim, and the majority of cars are closer to 1258kg.

Depends on the measurement used. Tare Mass here is an empty vehicle with all its fluids and 10 litres of fuel. Not a bad way to measure weight I guess as a vehicle’s petrol tank doesn’t stay full for long. Not sure if it’s the same in other countries?