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BRZ Second-Gen (2022+) -- General Topics General topics for the second-gen BRZ


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Old 09-15-2021, 08:02 AM   #127
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^^^^This is why MT always forever💪
Well, until about 2035 anyway....
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Old 09-15-2021, 10:35 AM   #128
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I’d forgotten about those… my mother had a early 135i with that trans and sometimes if you didn’t fully stop and stepped on the gas, the car would just sit there, no big deal except you’re trying to pull out onto traffic and are now just sitting in the road.

Didn’t happen often but was frightening when it did.
Yep, and then since it dumps all the tq right then, you get into the Traction Control......turns into a dangerous loop of not being able to move.

But just driving around without it on wasn't great either as it would smoke the tires through first two gears, and that was keeping it on Pilot Super Sports.
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Old 09-15-2021, 12:52 PM   #129
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Yep, and then since it dumps all the tq right then, you get into the Traction Control......turns into a dangerous loop of not being able to move.

But just driving around without it on wasn't great either as it would smoke the tires through first two gears, and that was keeping it on Pilot Super Sports.
Very true! I find it funny that other people had similar experiences with their early DCTs. Even the new ones can act wonky sometimes.

Ours was not quite so exciting lol, just a totally stock N55. Was still pretty quick though.
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Old 09-15-2021, 01:27 PM   #130
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Well, until about 2035 anyway....
I will fight that to my dying breath to ensure I have a manual transmission vehicle to drive until the day I die.
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Old 09-15-2021, 01:41 PM   #131
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I will fight that to my dying breath to ensure I have a manual transmission vehicle to drive until the day I die.
“Remember Goliad! Remember the Manual!”
- Sam Houston, or something like that

If that’s the way you feel you’ve gotta get them while you can; they ARE going away. Won’t be too long before the worst automatic (hooked up to an electric motor no less) will be better than the best PDK you can get today. And that’s just until the robots take over driving completely.
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Old 09-15-2021, 02:05 PM   #132
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I want a low speed/high torque (10,000 rpm max) electric motor in a sports car with a 6-speed manual.
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Old 09-15-2021, 04:16 PM   #133
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I want a low speed/high torque (10,000 rpm max) electric motor in a sports car with a 6-speed manual.

This thought could easily highjack the thread. Would a typical EV car benefit from having gears? Didn’t Tesla once use a 2 speed? What is the shape of an EV torque curve? What is the rpm range? If max rpm is 20,000 and the torque curve starts to decrease around 10,000 rpm, would gearing that keeps the motor in the 0 to 10,000 rpm range improve acceleration? Would lower rpm mean anything to an EV on the highway? Would the EV’s huge torque off the line shred a transmission? Would a CVT work?
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Old 09-15-2021, 04:36 PM   #134
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The 2nd gen BRZ will have similar performance to…?

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This thought could easily highjack the thread. Would a typical EV car benefit from having gears? Didn’t Tesla once use a 2 speed? What is the shape of an EV torque curve? What is the rpm range? If max rpm is 20,000 and the torque curve starts to decrease around 10,000 rpm, would gearing that keeps the motor in the 0 to 10,000 rpm range improve acceleration? Would lower rpm mean anything to an EV on the highway? Would the EV’s huge torque off the line shred a transmission? Would a CVT work?

It makes no sense since the torque curve of an electric motor is [ideally linear] and they can do 100k rpm if designed for it. (not flat as I said before, so maybe it does make some sense.)

But I want one. It would be so cool. Gotta find a way to make it loud under high current draw. You’d have to run a motor that’s an outrunner (rotor on the outside of the windings) than an inrunner style, so it would be shorter and bigger diameter, which would lower the RPM and increase the torque for a given power draw.

Last edited by Yoshoobaroo; 09-15-2021 at 04:46 PM.
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Old 09-15-2021, 04:42 PM   #135
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It makes no sense since the torque curve of an electric motor is absolutely flat. And they can do 100k rpm if designed for it.

But I want one. It would be so cool. Gotta find a way to make it loud under high current draw. You’d have to run a motor that’s an outrunner (rotor on the outside of the windings) than an inrunner style, so it would be shorter and bigger diameter, which would lower the RPM and increase the torque for a given power draw.

Not flat, loses torque the higher you rev. This is a model S p85.

https://www.dragtimes.com/2014-Tesla...phs-27027.html

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Old 09-15-2021, 04:48 PM   #136
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That.
For acceleration, you want the engine to be as close as you can to max power (not torque) whenever you're flooring it.

If the graphs above are correct, the Tesla's torque curve is only "flat" at low rpm, then it's the the power curve that is "flat", then both go down. For max acceleration, it is useful to keep the Tesla engine in the ~4000–9000 rpm range. Not too different from an ICE engine, if you think about it.

There are however other reasons why a gearbox might not be that useful. It adds weight, points of failure, and you'd need N of them if you have N engines.
It could be interesting if something like an NE/NF Miata EV or a Lotus EV had a lightweight electric engine with ~300 hp in the 4000–9000 range, and an old school gearbox.

Porsche Taycan has two gears, I believe.
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Old 09-15-2021, 04:49 PM   #137
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For max acceleration, it is useful to keep the Tesla engine in the ~4000–9000 rpm range. Not too different from an ICE engine, if you think about it.
Forgot to mention: unless you have so much torque at low rpms that you're traction-limited, which is the case for high performance Teslas.
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Old 09-15-2021, 04:53 PM   #138
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Porsche Taycan has two gears, I believe.
Yep, but only on the rear axle.
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Old 09-15-2021, 05:03 PM   #139
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Imagine operating two gearboxes at the same time
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Old 09-15-2021, 05:06 PM   #140
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Imagine operating two gearboxes at the same time
lol

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