Front Crash Bar

[RNG]

Hi guys, is this damage bad enough to reach the main frame? Previous owner had a minor accident but did not replace the bar. Only thing broke was the headlight bracket and damage to the previous bumper, he got a new one before selling it. The pictures aren't very clear my apologies just making some assumption. Planning on getting a new crash bar alongside the headlight bracket

*Just noticed the pictures are uploading in a tilted manner, sorry for the trouble if you have to download and straighten it!

[TRS]

99.9% nothing happend to the frame. Would also keep the bar. Doesnt look like anything dramatic happend. Might take a little less force in a future crash, but the difference should be absolutely marginal.

Disclaimer: If you want to be 100% safe, be safe and buy a new one.

[RNG]

Originally Posted by TRS

99.9% nothing happend to the frame. Would also keep the bar. Doesnt look like anything dramatic happend. Might take a little less force in a future crash, but the difference should be absolutely marginal.

Disclaimer: If you want to be 100% safe, be safe and buy a new one.

took it to multiple shops, all of them confirmed this damage is too little to reach the frame as there are cars with worse damage to the crash bars but the frame turns out intact. One of them also said the crash bar did not take any hit as there aren't any dents. Gonna upgrade to tube bash bars anyway hehe

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by RNG

Gonna upgrade to tube bash bars anyway hehe

If you’re driving it on the street, think twice about that. The risk of the crash structure not behaving as intended in a crash is hard to over state. Could be the difference between walking away and being badly injured.

[RNG]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

If you’re driving it on the street, think twice about that. The risk of the crash structure not behaving as intended in a crash is hard to over state. Could be the difference between walking away and being badly injured.

I'm not sure but I thought the aftermarket ones were stronger? I might be wrong I just don't know that is

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by RNG

I'm not sure but I thought the aftermarket ones were stronger? I might be wrong I just don't know that is

Stronger is worse. Crumple zones need to crumple so you don’t crumple. You also pose a bigger danger to other cars and pedestrians. The bar may be even at the wrong height to even interface with the other car’s crash structure in a crash. It could just punch straight through a door because it is too high/low/not wide enough to hit the crossbar in the door.

Crash mechanics are incredibly complicated and hard to predict, I always strongly recommend keeping all the crash structure completely unmodified, it’s not worth the risk to you and others.

[TRS]

Those bars are made for a purpose. Thats drifting. Not street driving. They help to avoid damage to the sensible and weak components you find in Front and rear sections while beeing more rigid then the OEM crash bars to safe some time and money for the drift guys. This is nothing what will realy work for a street car. Usualy one tries to avoid having multiple smaller contacts to other cars each day. The bumper will be scraped anyway and even more likely if your running a crash bar. Only very few situations in a every day driving accident will turn out in a way that a drift armor will help you.

Also it is quiet questionable if runing this modified crash bar is legal in your region. There might be some where this is no legal issue, but Id tend to say that there are far more where it would be an issue. And, as said before, the load to the chassis/frame of the car will be even higher at crash if your running a strengthened bar since more load is transfered and less energy is absorbed by the deformation of the crash structure.

I definately dont want to say that those bash bars are not good. They definately are good, but only for the purpose they are meant for. So if you are looking to build a drift missile, you're on the right path. If you are building a street car I would overthink this decission, at least for the front.

In the rear the story is a little "special" for the 86 chassis. There I also was considering a bash bar, even if Im driving a street car. Why? Because the factory crash bar is a joke. If you ever had one in hand you'll know what I mean.

BTW overlapping of crash structures is a big issue in the design of passender cars since the first crash tests where made. Until today there is no real standard for size and position of them. This isnt even realy feasible, since it would create limitations which would be nearly impossible to be handled. With other words: If you crash a car like the 86 with something like a van, pickup or truck this will always be a big issue, no matter what kind of crash bar you are running.

[RNG]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

Stronger is worse. Crumple zones need to crumple so you don’t crumple. You also pose a bigger danger to other cars and pedestrians. The bar may be even at the wrong height to even interface with the other car’s crash structure in a crash. It could just punch straight through a door because it is too high/low/not wide enough to hit the crossbar in the door.

Crash mechanics are incredibly complicated and hard to predict, I always strongly recommend keeping all the crash structure completely unmodified, it’s not worth the risk to you and others.

that makes sense, you are right.

[RNG]

Originally Posted by TRS

Those bars are made for a purpose. Thats drifting. Not street driving. They help to avoid damage to the sensible and weak components you find in Front and rear sections while beeing more rigid then the OEM crash bars to safe some time and money for the drift guys. This is nothing what will realy work for a street car. Usualy one tries to avoid having multiple smaller contacts to other cars each day. The bumper will be scraped anyway and even more likely if your running a crash bar. Only very few situations in a every day driving accident will turn out in a way that a drift armor will help you.

Also it is quiet questionable if runing this modified crash bar is legal in your region. There might be some where this is no legal issue, but Id tend to say that there are far more where it would be an issue. And, as said before, the load to the chassis/frame of the car will be even higher at crash if your running a strengthened bar since more load is transfered and less energy is absorbed by the deformation of the crash structure.

I definately dont want to say that those bash bars are not good. They definately are good, but only for the purpose they are meant for. So if you are looking to build a drift missile, you're on the right path. If you are building a street car I would overthink this decission, at least for the front.

In the rear the story is a little "special" for the 86 chassis. There I also was considering a bash bar, even if Im driving a street car. Why? Because the factory crash bar is a joke. If you ever had one in hand you'll know what I mean.

BTW overlapping of crash structures is a big issue in the design of passender cars since the first crash tests where made. Until today there is no real standard for size and position of them. This isnt even realy feasible, since it would create limitations which would be nearly impossible to be handled. With other words: If you crash a car like the 86 with something like a van, pickup or truck this will always be a big issue, no matter what kind of crash bar you are running.

thanks for the insight man, I have not really thought about it that way! Thing is I was concerned about my main frame and I am not really sure how much damage in the crash bar or how much force does it take for an impact to reach the main frame from the crash bar.

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by RNG

thanks for the insight man, I have not really thought about it that way! Thing is I was concerned about my main frame and I am not really sure how much damage in the crash bar or how much force does it take for an impact to reach the main frame from the crash bar.

If you’re worried about keeping the car’s frame undamaged, like @ said, let the OEM bars do their job. They’re designed to be strong enough for small impacts, but weak enough to give in when the loads are higher. It’s a fine balance and I would only trust it to the people that have had the entire car model in FEA software.

[RNG]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

If you’re worried about keeping the car’s frame undamaged, like @ said, let the OEM bars do their job. They’re designed to be strong enough for small impacts, but weak enough to give in when the loads are higher. It’s a fine balance and I would only trust it to the people that have had the entire car model in FEA software.

yes, I think I will be keeping the stock crash bar but if it bothers me too much I will just fit another OEM crash bar. Got some results today from a professional shop, seems like everything is alright?

[pope]

I see you already got measurements back to show your car is alright, but if it helps you feel any better, this is my car I purchased wrecked and rebuilt. Front bash bar embedded the condenser in the radiator and exploded the fans. Frame wasn't touched.

[RNG]

Were you able to fit the new crash bar bolt on without any issue?

[pope]

new bar bolted straight on.