TOYOTA GAZOO Racing Presents World Debut of the New JDM GR 86 (Second Gen 86)!

[WolfpackS2k]

30 years ago automakers put out conservative performance numbers for their cars. And it confused people when magazines (and people IRL) could do better.

Here we are 30 years later and...how is the same thing happening?!

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

30 years ago automakers put out conservative performance numbers for their cars. And it confused people when magazines (and people IRL) could do better.

Here we are 30 years later and...how is the same thing happening?!

We are more interested in debating the delta between the manufacturer’s numbers of the first gen and second gen. Either they were conservative and then they weren’t, so their numbers look better on the second gen or the car really improved by 1.1 seconds. If it is the latter then is it mostly the engine or mostly the tires or mostly one less gear to shift into or equally all three? Why was this discussion started? Because AnalogMan mentioned wanting to know what it actually feels like, which spawned comments that it might not be so great. Why? Because one less gear shift could improve times without much change in feel, and if someone already has PS4 tires then they might already have improved their 0-60 time. Maybe the 1.1 seconds is actually 0.3 seconds of actual improvement in acceleration.

The difference between manufacturers and journalists is actually not the focus of the debate, even if we are discussing the discrepancy.

[KR-S]

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

TCoat- I simply mentioned the fact that for someone who tracks their cars, that FOR THE SAME price the PP BRZ was the better buy for the added suspension, brake improvements.
I will always love the Hakone, but I stand by what I said about the PP being the better buy for the same $. Also, Hakone was under 600 built if I recall correctly, to say just as many are being tracked as PP cars is utter nonsense. Again, I’m at the track often, especially in 2021. I’ve seen 2 Hakone ever on track here, but dozens of BRZ PP cars. Again you DONT track your car so like always you speak without any knowledge, just bias.

Tcoat was making a point that people will choose to drive whatever variation of the 86/BRZ however they want, on the track or as a daily, and not dictated by some rando on the internet.

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

I never said the performance of the new car will be “earth shattering” like you say. If you reread the bottom of the last page I state how the performance of the new cars won’t blow us away, but that we will definitely notice an improvement over the previous model. Again I know people who HAVE been in the new car and can attest to this.

No shit. Given that this is a new generation, I would expect the new car to have significant improvements over the original, improvements that I myself am looking forward to. However, it is not wrong to be skeptical of the new car UNTIL it comes out. You only know a handful of people who have driven the car; wait until the car is released to the public.

This is your problem: you are already declaring the car to be superior overall, when in fact it is only superior in terms of performance, stock for stock. Long-term ownership, reliability, and how well the car responds to mods are areas of concern of mine and likely areas of concern for others as well.

I wouldn't trade in my first-gen for a GR86, because among a plethora of other reasons, I find that the improvements are not enough to warrant trading in my car for. And yes, this is my opinion, I'm not stating it as fact. By all means, nobody is going to stop you from buying the GR86, and I'm fully interested in hearing your thoughts both performance-wise and long-term.

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

And AGAIN you bring up looks, which are subjective to each person, who cares?

As stated by others on the previous page your BIAS and hate towards these new cars is completely evident, and you and a few others are acting like immature children, grow up.

Believe it or not, looks are just as important as anything else. I'm not interested in driving something that does not appeal to me from a looks perspective. I actually find the GR86 to be quite good looking if not a bit on the porky side compared to the last generation. However, some other people do not like the car and will voice their opinion by simply not buying the new car. I'd say that Toyota and Subaru would care if sales were not as expected as a result.

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

“If I actually buy one instead of talking about it”....again if you ever take off your hate blinders and read I’ve stated that I love the current car, and drive my GF’s 19 BRZ PP often, which is why I’m looking forward to the new car, and sold my Camaro to buy the new car. I can’t buy what isn’t being sold yet, but that may be too hard for you to comprehend...

Well clearly, it was too hard for you to comprehend that he wasn't referring to the new model; he was referring to the Hakone.

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

Difference is, I welcome the improvements and don’t bash the new model on every forum thread simply because “it doesn’t look good” blah blah.

Every piece of data I’ve mentioned on the new cars statistically have been FACT, not rumor or filled with bias/hate like your posts. Again, if you actually did research you would know this to be true.

You can hate me and the new car all you’d like. Your immaturity speaks loudly, the truth hurts. Enjoy your lawn ornament!

But Tcoat doesn't go in every thread and bash the new model for its looks. He has his opinions of the car and you have yours. That's that.

[The86Minister]

Looks even better than the GT86 and also happy to see that it will be released in Europe.

In my case the "problem" would be the lack of equipment compared to my current car (fully-equipped Camry). Would definitely consider one if there would be a high-end version with JBL, electrically adjusted seats/steering wheel, HUD etc, highly doubt it tho.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

TCoat- I simply mentioned the fact that for someone who tracks their cars, that FOR THE SAME price the PP BRZ was the better buy for the added suspension, brake improvements.
I will always love the Hakone, but I stand by what I said about the PP being the better buy for the same $. Also, Hakone was under 600 built if I recall correctly, to say just as many are being tracked as PP cars is utter nonsense. Again, I’m at the track often, especially in 2021. I’ve seen 2 Hakone ever on track here, but dozens of BRZ PP cars. Again you DONT track your car so like always you speak without any knowledge, just bias.

Also, my credit is phenomenal at over 820, they didn’t “sell the car to someone else because of my credit” but told me they couldn’t locate one mid last year, but only after promising me they could, getting me into the dealer and after running my credit. They then tried to get me to buy another car, which is a common trap tactic by dealers. Get your facts straight, I’m very responsible financially. When I did actually locate a Hakone 3 hours away that was new, I got pre-approved over the phone and had finalized a price with the dealer. They knew I was unable to make it there for 2 days as I was at a conference for work that week. Another buyer came in and offered them more, so they sold it to him instead. Had NOTHING to do with credit. I love the Hakone color, always have, but mine would have had to get modded suspension and brakes immediately for my track use. That’s why I mentioned the PP being a better “starting” car for people like myself. They most certainly aren’t as eye catching as the Hakone however, no doubt.

I never said the performance of the new car will be “earth shattering” like you say. If you reread the bottom of the last page I state how the performance of the new cars won’t blow us away, but that we will definitely notice an improvement over the previous model. Again I know people who HAVE been in the new car and can attest to this.

And AGAIN you bring up looks, which are subjective to each person, who cares?
As stated by others on the previous page your BIAS and hate towards these new cars is completely evident, and you and a few others are acting like immature children, grow up.

“If I actually buy one instead of talking about it”....again if you ever take off your hate blinders and read I’ve stated that I love the current car, and drive my GF’s 19 BRZ PP often, which is why I’m looking forward to the new car, and sold my Camaro to buy the new car. I can’t buy what isn’t being sold yet, but that may be too hard for you to comprehend...

Difference is, I welcome the improvements and don’t bash the new model on every forum thread simply because “it doesn’t look good” blah blah.

Every piece of data I’ve mentioned on the new cars statistically have been FACT, not rumor or filled with bias/hate like your posts. Again, if you actually did research you would know this to be true.

You can hate me and the new car all you’d like. Your immaturity speaks loudly.

I see you deleted your original post and are now in full back pedal mode.
Good thing it was quoted:

Originally Posted by RetroRacer View Post
So glad i didn’t buy the local Hakone edition 86 manual with 950 miles for sale for $31k locally. Color is nice, but even the Performance pack BRZ was a better buy for the same $. Again I’m amazed how many people pay more for a “color” over a better driving car. Most people who own a Hakone don’t “track” their car, that’s the difference, they just want a car that looks good, but don’t use the drivers car for what it’s intended for.
The new car will outperform the old one on every front.
Definitely prefer the Toyota styling to the BRZ. But will change mine immensely for an upcoming sema show. A bigger 2.4 motor with improved power band and better chassis that’s 50% more rigid to build upon, Well done Toyota/Subaru!
Will sit nicely in my garage next to my 2007 STI Crawford built, and 91 NSX. Sold my 2012 SS/RS sema Camaro recently but I prefer lightweight over HP. Look forward to building a phenomenal new GR86.

I do not hate anything beyond the appearance. Big ugly side vents are big and ugly no matter if they are functional or not.
Not once have I bashed the potential performance. I just don't play the bench racer numbers game and will wait to see what it actually does with that massive 10% increase.
We shall see who has more miles and wheel time my" lawn ornament" or your weekend warrior racer wanttabe toy.
Funny you think it so much superior but already planning to change it!

[KR-S]

I noticed that too; it was gone at the time I first saw the thread (last midnight).

[Dadhawk]

Ultimately, it looks like I'll be a 1 Generation owner of the 86.

There's not enough positive difference here for me to want a second gen, although I do like the Toyota better than the Subaru.

I'm with @Tcoat on the side profile negatives, and obviously that isn't where they could distinguish the models.

No surprise really though, I can think of only one time I've replaced a specific car model with the same model, and that was with the family hauler (Chevy Astro).

[blackhawkdown]

Originally Posted by The86Minister

Looks even better than the GT86 and also happy to see that it will be released in Europe.

In my case the "problem" would be the lack of equipment compared to my current car (fully-equipped Camry). Would definitely consider one if there would be a high-end version with JBL, electrically adjusted seats/steering wheel, HUD etc, highly doubt it tho.

You are describing a 3.0 Premium Supra. BTW, the JBL sucks in the Supra. lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[RetroRacer]

Bunch of poser internet keyboard warriors

Everything I stated was a fact, you girls simply are jealous little bitches.

Literally act like 12 year olds, who live with your parents. I’ve been modding/racing cars longer than you little millennials have been alive. Hope to see you all at one of the nationwide gatherings or meets, oh wait I forgot you stay at home because your scared of the fake Plandemic

You should see my inbox messages from multiple people who thanked me for speaking up against you TCoat, about they’ve never liked you but don’t want to say anything as they know you’ll stalk them to and harass them. You’re an internet bully, but a fucking ***** in real life.

I’ve since moved over to another forum anyhow which is full of adults who can have actual discussions, and different opinions, not high school tweeny bopper BS that goes on here.

Keep harassing people who dare to have different opinions than yourself, you’re the epitome of an internet keyboard warrior. Look at how many posts you have lmfao, you DONT EVEN WORK, you spend all day on this forum, you have no life, literally

You won’t have to worry about my facts & opinions that get your panties in a bunch any longer, I will never return here at all after this post to read or engage any further. Now go ahead with more pointless posts against me that I won’t ever read, but will give you nerds the internet attention you so deeply care about!

[Transport3r]

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

oh wait I forgot you stay at home because your scared of the fake Plandemic

[KR-S]

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

Bunch of poser internet keyboard warriors

Everything I stated was a fact, you girls simply are jealous little bitches.

Literally act like 12 year olds, who live with your parents. I’ve been modding/racing cars longer than you little millennials have been alive. Hope to see you all at one of the nationwide gatherings or meets, oh wait I forgot you stay at home because your scared of the fake Plandemic

You should see my inbox messages from multiple people who thanked me for speaking up against you TCoat, about they’ve never liked you but don’t want to say anything as they know you’ll stalk them to and harass them. You’re an internet bully, but a fucking ***** in real life.

I’ve since moved over to another forum anyhow which is full of adults who can have actual discussions, and different opinions, not high school tweeny bopper BS that goes on here.

Keep harassing people who dare to have different opinions than yourself, you’re the epitome of an internet keyboard warrior. Look at how many posts you have lmfao, you DONT EVEN WORK, you spend all day on this forum, you have no life, literally

You won’t have to worry about my facts & opinions that get your panties in a bunch any longer, I will never return here at all after this post to read or engage any further. Now go ahead with more pointless posts against me that I won’t ever read, but will give you nerds the internet attention you so deeply care about!

And now I truly believe you don't have any of the cars you claim to own.

Posting the image again because it's now even more relevant to your drivel.

[mazeroni]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Ultimately, it looks like I'll be a 1 Generation owner of the 86.

What would you do if your FRS died and could not reasonably be fixed (too great a cost or catastrophic frame damage)? Would you find a used Gen 1 or get something entirely different?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by RetroRacer

Bunch of poser internet keyboard warriors

Everything I stated was a fact, you girls simply are jealous little bitches.

Literally act like 12 year olds, who live with your parents. I’ve been modding/racing cars longer than you little millennials have been alive. Hope to see you all at one of the nationwide gatherings or meets, oh wait I forgot you stay at home because your scared of the fake Plandemic

You should see my inbox messages from multiple people who thanked me for speaking up against you TCoat, about they’ve never liked you but don’t want to say anything as they know you’ll stalk them to and harass them. You’re an internet bully, but a fucking ***** in real life.

I’ve since moved over to another forum anyhow which is full of adults who can have actual discussions, and different opinions, not high school tweeny bopper BS that goes on here.

Keep harassing people who dare to have different opinions than yourself, you’re the epitome of an internet keyboard warrior. Look at how many posts you have lmfao, you DONT EVEN WORK, you spend all day on this forum, you have no life, literally

You won’t have to worry about my facts & opinions that get your panties in a bunch any longer, I will never return here at all after this post to read or engage any further. Now go ahead with more pointless posts against me that I won’t ever read, but will give you nerds the internet attention you so deeply care about!

A bunch of snowflakes that gather together is called a blizzard!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by KR-S

And now I truly believe you don't have any of the cars you claim to own.

Posting the image again because it's now even more relevant to your drivel.

But he has said he does about 20 times!