All-New 2022 Subaru BRZ Makes Global Debut

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by HKz

just remove some grip then? put the primacys back on..

There’s a good chance the primacies are still standard. The reveal shows the PS4s available ‘on select models’

[thill]

There are other ways to induce oversteer. Changing sway bars, alignment, tire change, turning off nannies, etc. I wouldn't worry about it It's still a lightweight RWD car at the end of the day.

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by HKz

why are people still saying this? are we all looking at the same tach and spec sheet? 7000 is peak power, redline is clearly still beyond that..

My mistake.

[Quentin]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

There’s a good chance the primacies are still standard. The reveal shows the PS4s available ‘on select models’

That probably refers to all season versus summer. My FR-S was delivered with all season.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

It makes FI an issue for anyone not using e85. Power potential without E85 was already limited at 12.5:1, but there is already more power on board because of the displacement, so maybe FI on pump gas will have more modest gains, but on E85, NA gains will be greater, and on FI, the tuners will likely hit the limits of the internals before they hit the limits due to knock. In fact, I don't believe I am aware of the limits on E85 at 12.5:1; I know people have pushed the car to over 600whp on built internals. If 13.5:1 has a limit on E85 then again I am sure it exceeds the strength of the stock internals and is outside of most people's needs, but the 13.5:1 will benefit many people who just want E85 and headers, which far exceeds those with FI, which far exceeds people with FI going for big power.

I am only referring to default power level of most FI kits around 300HP on the stock FA20 engine. I agree E85 can yield more power with 13.5 compression. But it will probably be still less than 300HP. I am not interested in E85 due to its much lower mpg and availability. I am not interested in a power level less than 300 HP. I guess I am moving on from this platform for the next sports car.

[g e]

Originally Posted by Cephas

Mine holds one chapstick.

Maybe we should have a poll of what people put in there... or maybe not....

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

Depends on the build. At modest levels, there is no reason FI on E85 can't last the typical lifecycle of a car; ie, 150k-200k or 10+ years. Quality compoenents on a good tune. I'm on E85 with a bar of boost on stock internals. If I had a built FA20 engine or the FA24 stock then 400-450whp would likely be easily achievable and reliable. That is a very respectable amount of power for 2800lbs.

The cost of rebuilding the engine and adding FI plus E85 is not worth it for me. I would just buy Supra 3.0 for $51K.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by mrg666

I am only referring to default power level of most FI kits around 300HP on the stock FA20 engine. I agree E85 can yield more power with 13.5 compression. But it will probably be still less than 300HP. I am not interested in E85 due to its much lower mpg and availability. I am not interested in a power level less than 300 HP. I guess I am moving on from this platform for the next sports car.

The FA24D will likely not reach a knock limit on pump gas until at or exceeding the power levels of the FA20D. It sounds like you are arguing the opposite, that the FA24D will reach a sub 300hp knock limit because of the higher static compression, as if the FA20D could gain 100hp from 200hp to 300hp, but the FA24D could only gain say 50hp from 223hp to 273hp. Is that what you are trying to say would happen?

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by mrg666

The cost of rebuilding the engine and adding FI plus E85 is not worth it for me. I would just buy Supra 3.0 for $51K.

Maybe you missed my point, but the point is that the FA24D will likely be capable of 400-450whp with only bolt-on and without having to open up the motor. This puts the car into serious competition with other vehicles. While the FA20D could get to 350whp without opening the motor, that power level is good, but adding another 50-100hp would put the car in a bracket that would make it competitive to much more expensive cars. A stock Mustang GT dynos around 400-450whp, so this would have that type of power at 800lbs less weight. It also would eliminate the need for some swaps because a LS swap will look less appealing if power can get into the 400whp level on stock internals.


https://www.autoblog.com/2014/07/02/...atios-feature/

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

The FA24D will likely not reach a knock limit on pump gas until at or exceeding the power levels of the FA20D. It sounds like you are arguing the opposite, that the FA24D will reach a sub 300hp knock limit because of the higher static compression, as if the FA20D could gain 100hp from 200hp to 300hp, but the FA24D could only gain say 50hp from 223hp to 273hp. Is that what you are trying to say would happen?

I would rather wait and see what Jackson Racing and/or Edelbrock will do with instead of going back and forth with you here. 13.5 compression will be an interesting challenge for designing the FI kit for sure.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by mrg666

I would rather wait and see what Jackson Racing and/or Edelbrock will do with instead of going back and forth with you here. 13.5 compression will be an interesting challenge for designing the FI kit for sure.

A tuner can adjust the dynamic compression ratio by managing valve overlap.

[mrg666]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

A tuner can adjust the dynamic compression ratio by managing valve overlap.

Why does Subaru reduce FA24 compression ratio to 10 for turbo version? Or, Mazda does the same for Skyactive G 2.5 on Mazda 3 turbo. I am just asking your insight, not making a counter argument.

[gymratter]

until we get some hands on reviews im gonna toss all the ride along stuff here.

Riding Shotgun In The New 2022 Subaru BRZ
http://www.superstreetonline.com/fea...brz-first-ride

Rodrez of Super Street: If the "swoosh" of the front fenders and pontoon-like sideskirts bolted to a FR platform that promises a sporty experience from behind the wheel doesn't scream "turbo" then we don't know what does. No matter what we think, Subaru's 2022 BRZ, unveiled this week in its final form, isn't packing the huff and puff of forced induction, unfortunately. We know, we know, it's a driver's car and all about balance and outstanding handling characteristics and all of that sounds good but after quite a long run of basically the same design and very little changes, the enthusiast circle was begging for boost and they certainly made their opinion known.

Well, here we are getting a snapshot of the 2022 line up and the new standard Civic will be boosted while the Subaru sports car remains naturally aspirated. Hold on, let me read that last sentence again ok, yeah, that's what's going on as the Bizarro world continues to spin. How does this updated BRZ handle on the track? Well, we're glad you asked

Jonny Lieberman of MotorTrend: Since its debut in 2012, the Subaru BRZ has been a great-handling car. We've heaped piles of praise upon it—and rightly so. Small, light, agile, great suspension, great balance, low price, the ability to carry four tires with the rear seats folded flat—those are the ingredients that make up a great sports car. Remember, we put it one place ahead of a McLaren (and way ahead of a Lamborghini) at the 2012 Best Driver's Car.

That out of the way, the Subaru BRZ has long had two flaws. One, the design was a missed opportunity. Front-engine, rear-drive coupes lend themselves naturally to sleek, sexy shapes (Jaguar E-Type, Shelby Cobra, Datsun Zs, almost every Aston Martin ever built). Sadly, the first-generation BRZ had weird headlights, fake vents, and a softness to the rear end that read front-wheel drive.

The other issue was of course power—the little Subaru never had any. Case in point: Two years ago, Subaru released the 2018 BRZ tS, a car the brand claimed was "pure handling delight." I just reread the review I wrote of that one, and the salient point is: "I've never met anyone who has driven a BRZ and asked for more handling. All anyone has ever said is 'More power.' As in, can we please have more power?" As you may have guessed, the answer was no. Well, guess what?

Meet the 2022 Subaru BRZ. Not only is the car all new, but so is the sheetmetal. Better yet, it's got more power! Let's start with all 28 extra horsepower. The engine remains naturally aspirated but grows from 2.0 to 2.4 liters. The first-gen BRZ had the Subaru WRX's engine with the turbocharger removed, whereas the new car has the Ascent's 2.4-liter flat-four sans turbo. The result is 228 horsepower at 7,000 rpm and 184 lb-ft of torque at 3,700 rpm, up from 206 hp and 156 lb-ft of torque in manual transmission cars and 200 hp and 151 lb-ft of torque in automatics. Why no turbo? Subaru says to keep the BRZ's price down. That's probably most of it, though you have to assume that to some degree Subaru is protecting the WRX while Toyota's safeguarding Supra sales.

In the Age of Hellcat, the BRZ no doubt sounds underpowered. Keep in mind, however, that Subaru says the new BRZ weighs less than 2,900 pounds, which would be up around 100 pounds from the last one we weighed, a 2016 Series.Hyperblue that checked in at 2,763 pounds. Do the math, and the weight-to-power ratio still improves by over a half pound per horsepower on the new car. You can have your 2022 BRZ with either a six-speed manual or a six-speed automatic. Why still a six-speed auto? Remember that Subaru relies on Toyota's huge profits and massive supply chain to get the BRZ (and its ToMoCo twin, the 86) built, and Toyota supplied the project with a six-speed Aisin slushbox. As ever, get the manual.

As for the chassis, it's all new, though Subaru built it with lessons learned from the brand's Global Platform. The top of the boxer engine block sits lower than the top of the tires, and as such, the center of gravity remains quite low. The front suspension is made up of long-travel MacPherson struts and coil springs, whereas the rear sports dual control arms and coil springs. A classic, sporty recipe for sure, as well as identical in setup to the previous car. The BRZ has grown fractionally in terms of wheelbase (101.2 inches to 101.4 inches) and length (166.7 inches to 167.9 inches) but is unchanged in width (69.9 inches), and the new one is actually shorter in height than the car it replaces (52.0 inches versus 51.6 inches). There are five driving modes, and if you place the stability control in Track mode, the digital tachometer reconfigures itself into a line graph just like a Mustang or a McLaren 570S.

As for the looks, I think the 2022 Subaru BRZ is a big improvement over the old car. From the front there's a bit of a mini-Corvette vibe happening, in a good way. Those black, penguin-shaped things below the headlights are functional vents that bring cool air in. Hot air exits from under the front fenders via functional side vents just in front of the doors. The new BRZ almost looks like its smiling, a Mona Lisa sort of vibe. The headlights are a massive improvement from the last version. A little bit of Mazda? Sure, but Mazdas are by and large great looking. For you design nerds out there, the new BRZ loses a degree or two of tumblehome, the idea being that doing so would make the fenders look more square and therefore tougher. I think it works. I actually see a bit of Infiniti Q60 in the side profile, minus that car's terrible C-pillar. From the rear, I'm seeing a nice mashup up of a Honda Civic and Aston Martin Vantage, largely because of that kicked-up, mini-ducktail spoiler. You know what? It all works.

How's the 2022 Subaru BRZ drive? Dunno. Despite (a bit of) begging, I wasn't allowed to drive the car. Why not? Dunno, again. However, Subaru was nice enough to trek former F1/NASCAR and current Subaru rally driver Scott Speed out to the Thermal Club near Palm Springs to give yours truly some hot laps. "It's my mission in life," Speed said, "to get a one-make race series going with this car." His reasoning is sound. Although it's not a drag racer, 0-60 mph should happen in the low 6-second range. More important, not only is peak torque up, but from the seat of my pants, the torque curve is also up throughout the rev range. Unlike in the previous car, it felt as if the 2022 BRZ was blasting out of corners. In the first-generation BRZ, well, you never felt that. Is that notorious flat spot in the middle of the rev range gone? Again, didn't drive it, but it feels like it's mostly gone, not totally gone. The new BRZ felt as balanced and as neutral as ever, with a hint of oversteer on turn in. Understeer basically doesn't happen, due mostly to the suspension tuning, though I'd guess the sticky Michelin PS4S tires help some, too.

Speed's reasoning for the racing series is that modestly powered sports cars like the BRZ will result in more of a pack or group on the track, and that will allow for more passing opportunities, and passing is more fun than not. The new BRZ is the perfect tool for the job because it behaves so well on the track. Who am I to argue with Mr. Speed?

Subaru hasn't announced pricing yet but expect it to be in line with current BRZ prices when the new sports car goes on sale this fall, so just a hair under $30,000.

[wbradley]

I gather that the high compression will limit the amount of boost pretty low, maybe 8.5 lbs.

The monster power will need Ascent pistons or even better, 2022 STI pistons.

This car is actually getting he same engine as the next STI!