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View Poll Results: How many 86 owners are planning on getting the Supra? | |||
I'm definitely getting one | 32 | 12.12% | |
I might get one if they offer a MT | 100 | 37.88% | |
No, not me. | 132 | 50.00% | |
Voters: 264. You may not vote on this poll |
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05-11-2020, 01:55 AM | #2381 |
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Wow! Those $77K and $78K LEs! That's insane!
I realize dealers are allowed to set their own prices, but that's robbery. Reminds me of that Martin Shkreli "Pharma Bro" who jacked up the price of that drug 5000%... The Supra's design has grown on me during the past year or so. I don't care that the vents are fake. There have been so many cars over the years with scoops and spoilers that did absolutely nothing except as a visual characteristic - nobody complained this much before. I just wished Toyota would've gone as bold with the interior as they did with the exterior - something along the lines of the Alpine A110. I get the 2.0 version is the "ideal" balance with possibly better handling thanks to the less weight. But it does nothing for me. Everyone complains about the 3.0 not having a manual, but that's a much bigger mistake when it comes to the 2.0! I've got my BRZ set up to my liking now - FI and manual - for way less than the anticipated $40K+ 2.0 Supra. I agree, the 2.0 should be incorporated into the industry, but they should've made it more visually distinguishable to the 3.0 - maybe delete all the black trim around the front lip, side skirts and rear diffuser? Also, it should've been called something else - Celica? Lastly, personal opinion - a true Supra is an inline-6 turbo. Adding a 4-pot in a Supra seems way more contradictory to its heritage than having a partnership with BMW. If I were to upgrade from my FI manual BRZ, it would definitely be the 3.0. |
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05-11-2020, 02:00 AM | #2382 | |
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for those that missed it. interview done by @ichitaka05
https://www.supramkv.com/threads/sup...gr-supra.3445/ Quote:
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05-11-2020, 09:26 AM | #2383 | |
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https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ckType=listing
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05-11-2020, 09:56 AM | #2384 | |
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In that case, I think one area that Toyota completely missed the boat was by not offering a manual. I think the take rate for the MT with the Twins is pretty significant, probably close to 50% averaged between the two models. And it's probably close to 100% for the performance-oriented buyers (i.e., the ones that would likely want more power and might upgrade to the Supra 2.0T or 3.0T). From personal experience at the track, I've seen plenty of Twins and NONE were automatic. Zero. So why didn't Toyota offer the 2.0T, the supposed performance bridge between the Twins and the Supra 3.0T, with a manual? I can only speak for myself, but I wouldn't even consider one due to the lack of a MT option. I can sort of understand for marketing purposes if they were chasing laptimes and 0-60/quarter times in the 3.0T and only wanted an automatic offered in that car, but in the 2.0T who cares?
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05-11-2020, 10:42 AM | #2385 |
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I didn't say that, I just said of the ones I know, I don't believe any of them would move to a Supra, or any other two seater because they use the back seats in their cars, or at least like that flexibility. It's also one of the primary reasons I wouldn't own one. (And yes, I have used the back seats in my 86 on more than one occasion).
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05-11-2020, 11:26 AM | #2386 | |
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05-11-2020, 11:40 AM | #2387 |
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The point is, I don't think Toyota can depend on there being a huge market in the Mustang/Camaro crowd for a Supra. Yes, there may be some, just as there some in the 100s of thousands of truck buyers every year, but its not the target audience.
The Supra is Toyota's lowest volume mainstream car in the US. I doubt they really care how many they sell, it's a prestige thing more than a volume thing. I personally also think they screwed up the opportunity, and lost a lot of potential buyers along the way. Add to that the dealerships trying to make a fortune off each car and it all adds up to an opportunity lost. Your opinion, not doubt, varies.
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05-11-2020, 12:53 PM | #2388 | |
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05-11-2020, 01:03 PM | #2389 | |
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05-11-2020, 01:25 PM | #2390 | |
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05-11-2020, 01:25 PM | #2391 | |
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yeah a lot of people feel the same way. one guy even used Tada's own words against him about how a Supra "must have an I6". so does that mean the 2.0 'Supra' isnt a real Supra? before people start jumping on my back, im not anti 2.0. but maybe the execution could have gone a little better. now playing devil's advocate, i do understand that cost, market condition, and board members do make things a littler harder to achieve. |
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05-11-2020, 03:44 PM | #2392 |
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Most manufacturers have downsized displacement and added a turbo for emissions. BMW doesn’t even have a NA I6 in production. The Supra wouldn’t be immune to the industry changes. I see no need why the SZ or SZ-R needs to have a six cylinder to be a Supra, and I think the only reason they considered a separate model wasn’t because of the engine, but because they could make the quality of the model less than the Supra, so it could be priced lower. As it is, the Supra SZ-R will probably be priced in the high thirties to low forties, so something could have existed in the $32k-$40k range.
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05-11-2020, 04:00 PM | #2393 |
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Man, after re-reading that interview, I swear I did proofread before publishing, but so many errors (my bad).
To answer few things. From the beginning, 2.0L 4cylinder Supra wasn’t in Tada-san’s mind. He was only focusing only inline 6 RWD Supra. More than half way through the development, 2.0 came along (prob from BMW side). After much debate, Toyota side tested out 2.0L ver and enjoyed it a lot more than they expected. Then Tada-san took it as step latter for current 86 owner, instead of having a huge step going from 2.0 NA 86 to 3.0 Turbo Supra. Now, everyone will think “Well if that’s the case, they should of brought it in MT.” I hear ya. But keep in mind, 2.0L Supra wasn’t in the development time sheet. Plus MT isn’t in there as well, so they can’t just LEGO things together & call it good. Another thing I hear is “Why they brought more hp ver yr after the launch? They could of just do that from first yr.” That’s another thing need to keep in mind. Tada-san IS Chief Engineer, but still need to get approval. Within Supra project, he decide, from there, he need to present to the board & Morizou. If they approve, Tada-san can keep going to next phase of the project. B58 engine they were giving, tested, developed, presented & approved by the board was the first gen Supra engine. Almost the end phase, BMW showing off their version. It’s not like they can just swap em in there w higher hp B58 & call it good. They need to be tested, developed, improved, presented & approved before make it into the production. Biggest question I still hear is “Why didn’t they make MT?” and sadly, I don’t have answer to this. Maybe they have some deal w BMW. Maybe upstairs Toyota said something. Maybe Tada-san didn’t want to kill off 86 sales. Truth of matter is, I don’t know the reason why and prob won’t find out. ...From here, it’s just me rambling, so take it as a grain of salt & nothing official. Later that day, I had a chance to go to PEC in LA w 3 other men. There, we learn what makes Porsche the Porsche. Me & friend were explaining to other person that even now, Porsche makes MT, lighter driver oriented sports car within all the PDK sports cars they make. Even limited amount and might be lil bit expensive than other models. Maybe be lil bit slower 0-60 than PDK, they still make one. Why? Because they know that, there are buyer who’s interested in those kind of niche car, even though Porsche sports car is already a niche car as is. There a buyer who like shifting through the gear, because that’s part of driving. Part of owning sports car that talk to you more. Not about can shifting 0.1 sec. it’s about knowing you’re shifting through the gears... & all sort of gearhead talk. After experiencing through PEC, one of them really rethink how important of having MT & driver oriented car. There’s also rumor saying, riding Porsche Taycan Turbo I almost shit brick from doing the 1/4 mile... it’s only a rumor lol Last edited by ichitaka05; 05-11-2020 at 04:34 PM. |
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05-11-2020, 04:37 PM | #2394 | |
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I question the notion that the car wouldn't come with a 2.0T, and then when that was determined, they decided to release two versions of the 2.0T (SZ and SZ-R). It seemed like there are always multiple engines available in Japan and in Europe for insurance, registration and fuel costs. Why those versions didn't have the manual transmission is beyond me, especially when the manual transmission is so popular in markets like Japan and Europe and even more for sports cars. It also eliminates the Supra from drifting unless someone swaps in a manual. Just annoying.
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