New internal combustion car sales to be banned in UK in 15 years

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

Do we NEED to get rid of ICE cars? Or will reducing them to a certain number suffice? I imagine it’s the latter.

It would but governments don't play that way. The sad part is that the fewer ICE cars there are and the less fuel they burn the higher the costs are going to climb for what is left. In countries such as the UK where gas prices are already two or three times the cost per gallon of the US there will be some pretty stiff incentives to go EV.

[mav1178]

Originally Posted by alan.chalkley

Is this not an international forum about discussing car stuff anywhere on this planet?
My wife drives a boringly reliable reliably boring AU camry.
Is this not similar to a US camry?

The point I'm making is that individual needs for vehicles and capability vary greatly between the UK and Australia. What works for them doesn't mean it will work for you.

Your point about unpaved roads in AU illustrates what I am saying... EVs are not practical in its current state for usage in Australia, and the same can be said for rural parts of the western US.

I should have emphasized your comment about "waiting for solar panels to recharge electric cars", that's the impractical part that does not apply to you.

[NoHaveMSG]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Far far less parts. No valving, lifting, camming, oiling, liquid cooling, charging, exhausting, vacuuming, fueling (well sort of fueling), all of which can break.

Not to mention they are better at converting their energy into motion rather then just heat. Which is also hard on components.

[mav1178]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

It would but governments don't play that way. The sad part is that the fewer ICE cars there are and the less fuel they burn the higher the costs are going to climb for what is left. In countries such as the UK where gas prices are already two or three times the cost per gallon of the US there will be some pretty stiff incentives to go EV.

the best way is to have a per-mile tax based on your vehicle weight (and do away with all gas taxes of any kind), but governments will be overthrown before that happens.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

The biggest problem with mainstream acceptance is range anxiety, which is largely just that, anxiety and not an actual issue for the majority of people, and the other problem is the infrastructure. One of the biggest hurdles in the infrastructure is overnight charging, since many people rent homes or live in apartments, so they would be reliant on chargers/superchargers, and we just don't have enough superchargers for mass adoption. Current tech is V3 superchargers. If battery technology didn't improve, but those superchargers were everywhere then it wouldn't really be an issue. It only gets better in time.

Climate change deniers are like ostriches with their head in the sand. What is amazing is how fast the world was able to react to the destruction of the ozone layer in a bipartisan way and make real changes, but many choose not to see the damage of releasing 6.8 billion metric tons or 6.8 gigatons (15.1 trillion pounds) of CO2 into the atmosphere each year (in the US alone). The world does over 25 gigatons. Smog is visible in areas like LA, and that is at a time where cars have catalytic converters. Imagine if we didn't have those. Imagine if the smog was twice as bad, four times as bad, twenty times as bad. LA already has air warnings for outdoor exercising and recreation and people die because of it, so the issue of emissions is already real. Even republicans in office are starting to acknowledge climate change (maybe big oil isn't paying them enough, or they are starting to look like fools in the face of the evidence or their inaction or in light of the actions they need to take which may be in contrast to what they deny).

The issue (and science) is nowhere near clear cut as aerosol chemicals or refrigerants being released into the atmosphere. And your description of the amount of CO2 being added to the atmosphere is misleading to the ignorants that have no clue how to put that in perspective. CO2 concentration in the atmosphere is currently around 400 ppm. Before the industrial revolution it was around 300 ppm. So we're talking about an increase of CO2 in the atmosphere from 0.03%, to 0.04%...over the span of more than 100 years. That's close to meaningless. CO2 is not that powerful, and the atmosphere is not that fragile.

Toxic chemical pollution, intentional burning down of rain forests, clear cutting of forests and urban island heat effects are all far more impactful on the environment with negative consequences for nature (and humanity).

And it certainly doesn't help that the most vocal (and high profile) proponents of AGW all preach do as I say, and not as I do. A recent poll stated that while a lot of people wanted something to be done about AGW, they didn't personally want to do anything or change their lifestyle. Obama was the most AGW friendly/convinced president the US has had so far and he bought a huge water front vacation property just last year. Guess he's not too worried.

Don't take the above as me not caring about the environment or not wanting to leave the world a better place for my children. Being wasteful is no way to live. I pride myself on efficiency. And reducing reliance (and value) on oil is a good thing to help remove involvement from the Middle East (and fund terrorists, etc etc). But save the snake oil for the gullible.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by mav1178

the best way is to have a per-mile tax based on your vehicle weight (and do away with all gas taxes of any kind), but governments will be overthrown before that happens.

I believe most but maybe not all areas have already taken this step with pure EVs. I know in Georgia there is an annual fee for pure electric vehicles. It also applies to some other types of alternate fuel vehicles as well.

The flat fee in 2016 for non-commercial vehicles was $204. In 2019 it was $212.

In 2019 I paid $205 in fuel taxes with my FRS so that amount seems relatively fair. Obviously someone who drives less than I do, or gets different fuel mileage would have paid a different amount.

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

It would but governments don't play that way. The sad part is that the fewer ICE cars there are and the less fuel they burn the higher the costs are going to climb for what is left. In countries such as the UK where gas prices are already two or three times the cost per gallon of the US there will be some pretty stiff incentives to go EV.

but you already know what's gonna happen. Right now, from what I've heard, it costs less than $10 to fully charge your EV and at some places (eg. work, shopping malls) you can do it for free. As the number of EVs rises, electricity costs will shoot up through the roof in the name of infrastructure advancement and as the existing players in oil etc work to modernize (i.e. electrify) their power production, and before you know it, it'll cost the same to charge your car as it did to fill it up with gas.

Or is that the glint of aluminum foil on my head I see.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

The issue (and science) is nowhere near clear cut as aerosol chemicals or refrigerants being released into the atmosphere. And your description of the amount of CO2 being added to the atmosphere is misleading to the ignorants that have no clue how to put that in perspective. CO2 concentration in the atmosphere is currently around 400 ppm. Before the industrial revolution it was around 300 ppm. So we're talking about an increase of CO2 in the atmosphere from 0.03%, to 0.04%...over the span of more than 100 years. That's close to meaningless. CO2 is not that powerful, and the atmosphere is not that fragile.

But save the snake oil for the gullible.

Scientists are overwhelmingly in agreement that the cause of climate change is entirely man made and linked to greenhouse gas emissions, which principally is CO2.

Even the agencies operating under Trump say climate change is from humans.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four...ate_Assessment

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

It’s not just CO2. Methane emissions are HUGE. Infrared detectors (since methane is invisible) have been invented which catch methane leaks around factories and various industrial complexes. Some companies literally don’t know there’s methane leaking. Then there’s the methane emitted by livestock. Then there’s the methane escaping from melting arctic ice.

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

It’s not just CO2. Methane emissions are HUGE. Infrared detectors (since methane is invisible) have been invented which catch methane leaks around factories and various industrial complexes. Some companies literally don’t know there’s methane leaking. Then there’s the methane emitted by livestock. Then there’s the methane escaping from melting arctic ice.

See post 56 below:

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=56

[Irace86.2.0]

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

but you already know what's gonna happen. Right now, from what I've heard, it costs less than $10 to fully charge your EV and at some places (eg. work, shopping malls) you can do it for free. As the number of EVs rises, electricity costs will shoot up through the roof in the name of infrastructure advancement and as the existing players in oil etc work to modernize (i.e. electrify) their power production, and before you know it, it'll cost the same to charge your car as it did to fill it up with gas.

Or is that the glint of aluminum foil on my head I see.

This depends. The price to fast charge versus recharging at home at night is much different. And charging costs at home will vary depending on if someone has solar and where they live. Realistically, the price of electricity will increase with increased demand, but then it should go down over time as we move to renewables like wind, solar, geothermal, hydro, etc.

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

See post 56 below:

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=56

well this is bad cause methane is 34 times worse than carbon dioxide when it comes to the greenhouse effect properties. So 10% is pretty horrific, and that's just US. I don't even wanna know when China is at

[alan.chalkley]

Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0

Scientists are overwhelmingly in agreement that the cause of climate change is entirely man made and linked to greenhouse gas emissions, which principally is CO2.

Even the agencies operating under Trump say climate change is from humans.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four...ate_Assessment

Lightning strikes contribute to CO2 levels , particularly when they ignite bush fires on the east coast of AU.
Ironically , the rain that is here is now flooding the scorched east coast.
We need to develop technology that captures and stores the power of lightning strikes into EV batteries.

[mav1178]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

I believe most but maybe not all areas have already taken this step with pure EVs. I know in Georgia there is an annual fee for pure electric vehicles. It also applies to some other types of alternate fuel vehicles as well.

The flat fee in 2016 for non-commercial vehicles was $204. In 2019 it was $212.

In 2019 I paid $205 in fuel taxes with my FRS so that amount seems relatively fair. Obviously someone who drives less than I do, or gets different fuel mileage would have paid a different amount.

you're forgetting the most important tax: the federal gas tax, which hasn't changed one bit since the mid 1990s. it hasn't even been adjusted for inflation...

people don't want to pay taxes but they complain about lack of money to fix roads. oh well.