03-13-2019, 09:41 PM | #99 |
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The 4.3 FD in the 17+ MT cars definitely help with the torque dip. Believe me its there but way less noticeable.
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03-13-2019, 09:41 PM | #100 |
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I sold my 05 MX5 Mazdaspeed with countless modifications when I bought my 14 monogram addition. I wish I hadn't done it. The FRS is a great car, but I've never captured the tossable feeling that I had with the Mazda. There are also many more modification options available for the Mazda. Flyin' Miata alone is a marvelous resource.
I like the FRS, and bought it because Mazda refuses to bring a hardtop coupe to the states. I have no use for ragtops. I also admit that some of my regret is in buying a black car. If I had a silver one, I might feel differently. I'll never buy a black car again. |
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03-13-2019, 10:01 PM | #101 | |
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The reasons why the people can get over the practicality advantages have done so with logical reasoning, and that's the convincing. Not someone telling me the car is clearly better. However, the same advice was said here too. You can simply rent a truck. The fact that you can't simply just go out to buy a MX-5 whenever you want is also very real. You must fit a very strict criteria for it to be feasible as a purchase. Where the BRZ would be a lot easier to pull the trigger on unless you're really in need of a truck / van. Right now, I can actually live with a MX-5, and that might not be the case if I was a DJ or something. The BRZ would be practical enough to allow a DJ to live and still have a fun car to drive. Either way, I've not signed anything yet, and the deals coming in for the BRZ is clearly lower cost, and has more to offer. The Carplay / Android Auto is better implemented in the BRZ, the creature comfort things are better. I can get the performance package while the MX-5 won't sniff it. I probably don't need it, but the value is great. I'm literally $500 away from signing on the MX-5, but if that does not go through, I'm $500 away from the BRZ with PP. These cars are very close, and it is really hard to choose. As for the power argument. This is the exact same thing about the S2000 people talked about. I'm not saying you can't drive around it. However to say that the S2000 power curve didn't show itself would be downplaying it. In a vacuum, the dip is fine, I wouldn't care honestly. However, when compared to the experience of the MX-5 drive, it's just "different" and I'll leave it at that. I personally do not like when reviewers talk about it, so I can only imagine how sick everyone here is of hearing it as well. I just brought it up because I finally felt it in my limited driving time. I didn't get to drive "around" it during my test drive, so all points given to me here are valid that I did not judge the BRZ in the best light possible. |
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03-13-2019, 10:16 PM | #102 | |
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Your choice is clear to me and to many others here. If for whatever reason you bought the BRZ, you would regret it.
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03-13-2019, 10:17 PM | #103 | |
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I currently am looking to close on the MX-5 pending a free Android Auto retrofit. If I get that worked in, I'm going to sign it. If not, I'm looking to see if I can get a few hundred more off on a 19 BRZ limited with PP. The way I'm seeing it now, I'll give up the throttle response of the ND for more practicality (I'm not comparing to a mini van) in the BRZ. Both cars will be fun to drive. Just that there are the fractions more on the MX-5 to me. The torque dip here is literally the same as saying the MX-5 has a lot of body roll. You can drive around both, and be fast in both. It's just some will be completely turned off by body roll, while some would be turned off by a weird gap in power. I can put up with either honestly, but do find the throttle response more fitting to my wants. The BRZ is not a bad drive at all. I also like the fact that it encourages shifting, but sometimes, that encourages me to "other" things once I start flooring the pedal. This is why Goku don't go Super Saiyan everywhere he goes. You gotta pick and choose your fights. I think flat out both cars are stupid quick for what I'll plan on doing with it. |
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03-13-2019, 10:18 PM | #104 |
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whew, just get the Miata or better yet a Mustang o.O I can't imagine there's anyone out there who has complained this much about the torque dip and power in NA 4 bangers before buying the car and end up being satisfied. I've driven a NC & ND (old engine) and besides the more visceral sensation with the roof down, never once did it feel more powerful than the twins. I'm sure the updated engine makes it better but it is still driving an "underpowered" NA 4 banger. Too many folks do not get the proper test drives of these cars and they end up shifting way too early or they never downshift..
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03-13-2019, 10:23 PM | #105 | |
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Though I think many here are starting to feel that my choice is 1 and 3 instead of 1a and 1b. I'm seriously looking at both, and I've followed this car since it was in concept. I actually was around when this forum was new. I've wanted this car for a LONG time now. I just wanted the MX-5 a little longer. |
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03-13-2019, 10:27 PM | #106 | |
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Again I apologize if this triggered people. I just felt that I had to at least be honestly in my opinion of both vehicles in my a / b test. Bottom line is, the forums both have contributed in tipping the scales, and as more posts get typed, the more it's evident where my heart is. |
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03-13-2019, 10:33 PM | #107 | |
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I can also understand why the criticism is such a trigger, and for that I'm just going to leave it where it is. I'll watch that video too. I think I've watched every video about the two cars the last couple weeks. I also agree the BRZ is a better highway cruise control machine. I know I'm giving something up to get the MX-5 on that comparison. In fact, it's all about what I'm willing to sacrifice in this conversation so far. Right now, it boils down to me being able to afford / cope with the sacrifices. It's purely what it is. Owning a MX-5 is a compromise to owning a BRZ. I think that's probably a more acceptable POV instead of using the power angle to justify for both arguments. Edit: I actually saw Topher's videos on all three of his drives. Even the night one. What he summed it up to be was that he clearly does not know which car he'd rather have. I'm EXACTLY feeling the same. Again, he has modded his car to fit his driving, and even he as a owner have criticized both cars rightfully so on their shortcomings. I took his POV in to account and honestly, I find most people end up in this camp than not when comparing these cars. Last edited by KAuss; 03-13-2019 at 10:46 PM. |
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03-13-2019, 10:52 PM | #108 |
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For me I was sucked into the story a bit at first, I mean a lot of things had to align for Subaru and Toyota to build the 86 platform in the first place. I bought one of the first ones back in 2012, it was the first year made a 2013, Hot Lava, 6 speed. They were really quite rare back then. I could not go anywhere with out someone taking pictures of it or talking to me at the lights.
I even got pulled over by a cop once and I honestly think he just wanted a closer look. He asked me who makes this? and what color is this. (I don't think he seen one before that moment). Driving it for me was about how I was always in control, how I was at the center of the car. What ever I did to it, no matter how hard I pushed it, I never got queasy and never got scared that the car was doing something I did not want. The 2013 models with eco Prius tires were very happy to get loose and I just turned in every time and the car corrected. It's quite fun to do. I got rid of it in 2016ish (wife/new kid) then found I still wanted it so I bought another one this time a used 2014, Hot Lava, 6 speed. The Miata looks fun too, but I also like how much community and aftermarket their is for the GT86. I don't plan on getting rid of it for quite some time. Docdoc
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03-13-2019, 11:13 PM | #109 |
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I mean on paper i see why they're cross shopped, but in reality it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Miata is a toy. It's also miserable unless the top is down..which frankly i wouldn't want to do every time i drive a car. A great, fun toy but i wouldn't want one as my only car. I also wouldnt want to subject the wife to a road trip in it due to that idiotic design with the transmission tunnel eating into the passenger side footwell. Torque dip is annoying but not a big deal in every day life. The power off idle is actually pretty damn good for a NA 4 banger. You have the dead spot then it picks up again at 5k for another 2000 rpm. Ergonomics are just so much better in the BRZ/FRS for me and i bet most would feel that way unless you're short. Better driving position, more leg room, more hip room, better seats (havent tried the ND's recaros though). For a daily driver these things matter big time.
Miata has a nice advantage in that its suspension is adjustable so you dont necessarily have to add camber plates or bolts, nor adjustable control arms. For me i'd want coilovers still. edit: regarding the fuel economy, i wouldnt worry about the twins, lowest i've ever gotten is 27. I used to get 32 mpg driving like an asshole all the time, but once i changed out the stock low rolling resistance tires you will drop 2-3 mpg. Last edited by Decep; 03-13-2019 at 11:30 PM. |
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03-13-2019, 11:31 PM | #110 |
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Well the only dealer working with me today was the Subaru dealer. I might end up with a quote of a Limited with PP in metallic grey under $27,000 or right at $27,000. If I can't get the Android Auto retrofit from Mazda, I might bite on that. Car is going to be fresh off truck in April, and I think the extra $3.5Kish I save initially can be used towards mods immediately. I think the Mazda guy was off today.
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03-14-2019, 12:04 AM | #111 | |
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what is triggering is how often you're bringing up torque dip/power when you're getting into the wrong class of cars if it means that much to you no one gets a S2000, Miata or 86/BRZ if power is a concern otherwise you'll end up in one of the many "bye ft86club" threads where they end up talking shit about how crappy the 86 platform is ...really the only worthwhile difference to discuss between a Miata and 86/BRZ should be whether you want a drop top or practicality...body roll can easily be removed with coilovers.. |
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03-14-2019, 12:16 AM | #112 | |
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selling price 27,500 tax 2,344 license 406 tire fee 8.75 Electric reg 30 Total: 30,374 It all boils down to money. If you guys are seriously that defensive about the topic, it's fine, I respect that. Again, someone talking about the S2000 will always mention about the power. Someone talking about the MX-5 ND will talk about the body roll. I'm not going to mention it again, because of how touchy it has become, but yeah, there's still a chance I end up with one. So we'll see. If not, just note that you all have helped me make the decision, I just know how to value it better. |
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