2020 Toyota GR Supra Revealed!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by krayzie

I think in 5 to 10 years the chart will totally flip as they keep tightening emission standards and everything is going towards hybrid electric.

If there's even a conspiracy, I think the automotive industry saw this future long ago and planned to phase out MT and eventually AT in stages overtime.

Yes sports cars and family sedans are dying, it's a vicious cycle seeing how at least here our local roads have gotten so bad in recent decades, cities cutting cost in snow removal, etc. Of course SUV becomes the choice of the day. Gone is the time when luxury SUVs were strictly reserved for the rich.

No conspiracy. Just advances in tech and ever tighter government regulations. Remember the MT is alive and well everyplace else in the world.
SUVs are a success in marketing and promotion more than anything. When the masses get convinced they need something they buy it in droves. Also keep in mind that the true luxury SUVs are still the realm of the rich. The much more mundane ones that pretend to be luxury out sell them by the millions.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by krayzie

Yes sports cars and family sedans are dying, it's a vicious cycle seeing how at least here our local roads have gotten so bad in recent decades, cities cutting cost in snow removal, etc. Of course SUV becomes the choice of the day. Gone is the time when luxury SUVs were strictly reserved for the rich.

We had some heavy snowfall the last few weeks. Many sedans could not even get out of the parking lots because of the excessive snow and their low height. Winter tires are mandatory, but they can help up to a point. Same with the quality of local roads. I agree that the SUV becomes gradually the choice of the day.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

We had some heavy snowfall the last few weeks. Many sedans could not even get out of the parking lots because of the excessive snow and their low height. Winter tires are mandatory, but they can help up to a point. Same with the quality of local roads. I agree that the SUV becomes gradually the choice of the day.

I disagree. The sedans are stuck because the drivers don't know how to handle deep snow or the "snow" tires they have are well beyond their useful life. I have driven one model or another lowered car in the snow for 20 years and have not been stuck. The FRS has about 3" of clearance and I drive it every day even through deep snow with zero issue. Ironically the cars I see stuck the most are SUVs! More than once I have had to stop my lowered car on a snow covered road just to get out and help push one out of my way.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

The AT vs MT discussion will have zero net impact on the sale of the Supra. It may change WHO buys it, but they'll still sell every one they intended to sell. If it flops it will not be because of the transmission.

Agreed. They've said so many times that the plan all along has been for low sales. They could sell every single one regardless of transmission choice. Given their production target it shouldn't be a flop because it's an easy figure to reach.

Unless it's an NSX level flop. Then it's a flop.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by krayzie

I think in 5 to 10 years the chart will totally flip as they keep tightening emission standards and everything is going towards hybrid electric.

If there's even a conspiracy, I think the automotive industry saw this future long ago and planned to phase out MT and eventually AT in stages overtime. The easiest way to phase them out is to force the replacement tech onto the halo exotics first, changing the minds of the public into thinking what should be best for them.

Yes sports cars and family sedans are dying, it's a vicious cycle seeing how at least here our local roads have gotten so bad in recent decades, cities cutting cost in snow removal, etc. Of course SUV becomes the choice of the day. Gone is the time when luxury SUVs were strictly reserved for the rich.

Some things in the governments may be a conspiracy in the way you're thinking (and the UN without question), however even those motives aren't targeted to sports cars and fun to drive cars

However their demise is an unfortunate side effect of many of the regulation and policy changes.


Also, backing up a bit. Wallyworld is a nickname/slang for Walmart.

[krayzie]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

The sedans are stuck because the drivers don't know how to handle deep snow or the "snow" tires they have are well beyond their useful life.

They are in Munich, that Central European snow tire isn't designed for "deep" snow.

Besides it's Germany they have mandatory annual inspections. Where you come from had Johnny Cash Machines. We live in a 4th world farm country by comparison.

I used to work with this German dude that complained about the aging infrastructure of West Germany compare to all the money they poured into propping the East since reunification. But I digress.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by krayzie

They are in Munich, that Central European snow tire isn't designed for "deep" snow.

Besides it's Germany they have mandatory annual inspections. Where you come from had Johnny Cash Machines. We live in a 4th world farm country by comparison.

I used to work with this German dude that complained about the aging infrastructure of West Germany compare to all the money they poured into propping the East since reunification. But I digress.

I was stationed in Germany for two years with the Army. I have worked for German owned companies for 12 years. I know how they work!

[krayzie]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

I was stationed in Germany for two years with the Army. I have worked for German owned companies for 12 years. I know how they work!

Next time come to Toronto when they don't plow 10+ cm see how good your FRS will fair with the inclines and hilly sections.

BTW I'm only driven these relatively low clearance cars for 20+ years and I also have not gotten stuck once. But I don't claim it's because of purely skill or tire selection even though they are contributing factors.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by krayzie

Next time come to Toronto when they don't plow 10+ cm see how good your FRS will fair with the inclines and hilly sections.

It is no better here I assure you. I did the twice a week commute to Windsor and back for 2 years with no problems. People managed for decades in worse cars and worse weather conditions with no problems. The whole "buy the SUV for snow" thing is the successful marketing I spoke of earlier.

[unhappymeal]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

It is no better here I assure you. I did the twice a week commute to Windsor and back for 2 years with no problems. People managed for decades in worse cars and worse weather conditions with no problems. The whole "buy the SUV for snow" thing is the successful marketing I spoke of earlier.

I had the Miata out two weeks ago in the 40 cm downfall that hit Ancaster to get gas for the snow thrower--zero problems. I was passing lifted Wranglers that were trundling along at 15 kph.

[Captain Snooze]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

From an fuel economy and emissions standpoint there is not much that can beat the newer CVTs.

I thought that cvts suffered from high friction/low efficiency.

Despite spending 43 seconds looking for information about a modern cvt I failed to find anything revelatory.

Could you suggest any websites to me that would explain advances in cvt technology?

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Captain Snooze

I thought that cvts suffered from high friction/low efficiency.

Despite spending 43 seconds looking for information about a modern cvt I failed to find anything revelatory.

Could you suggest any websites to me that would explain advances in cvt technology?

With the rider that they are marketing sites as well as info.
https://www.nissanusa.com/experience...nsmission.html


https://www.subaru.ca/WebPage.aspx?W...ebPageID=20182


https://www.toyota.ca/toyota/en/conn...t-transmission


They have come a long way.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by krayzie

Next time come to Toronto when they don't plow 10+ cm see how good your FRS will fair with the inclines and hilly sections.

BTW I'm only driven these relatively low clearance cars for 20+ years and I also have not gotten stuck once. But I don't claim it's because of purely skill or tire selection even though they are contributing factors.

I didn't make any claim about not being stuck due to skill or tires with the lowered car. I said the sedan drivers get stuck because they don't know how to drive in deep snow and their tires are not suitable or are worn. That does not mean they are the only reasons but they are the major ones.

[Captain Snooze]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

With the rider that they are marketing sites......

Lol, you're not wrong.
"D-Step Logic Control", "Lineartronic CVT", “Launch Gear”, "Direct Shift-CVT".
Ffs, I didn't realise I needed all of this stuff.