Official: Toyota FT-1 Concept / First New Supra Prototype Spotted!

[dtbdan]

Originally Posted by rvoll

So you're familiar with Pahrump. Must be that chicken ranch place you visited there.... We'll see if you're right about the 86 continuing in the next year or so. Every piece of data we see shows it won't. But I'm sure you and @Tcoat, being kings of the forum, know a lot better. Working with an automotive supplier certainly makes you an expert on everything automotive, especially corporate strategy. My background is in corporate strategy, so we shall see who is right.... From a strategic perspective, this is an easy call. The only question I have is about the BRZ. I don't know the financials and have no idea about profit levels and breakeven calculations as well as relative Subaru corporate ROI's for competing projects or other uses for the manufacturing space. If the 86 is discontinued, the BRZ may even get a slight bump in volume. I suggest we leave this topic alone until the next piece of information comes in. I know you'll never admit I'm right about this even when it happens..... Your turn.....

Let me swing MY big **** around for a second. My father has worked in product strategy at seperate OEMs, engineering at one of those and is currently the head of product strategy for an OEM of which I will not disclose cause I do value both his and I's privacy a little bit. I work in communications on the motorsport side of a different OEM. Granted neither of us has worked for toyota or subaru but I have had more unfiltered conversations with product people in the AUTOMOTIVE business than almost any journalist, I guarantee that fact. The automotive world is one of the weirdest marketplaces because you have real emotional attachments between your product and customer, but you also have to make money, you're a business after all. Also the people in these companies are just that, people, not boogeymen. If enough people within a company, or a single powerful person wants to build a specific car, that car will be built. Billions of dollars can be spent on a single or a small group of people's pet project just because they wanted to see it happen. "Oh the data doesnt show", that's not all there is. Data helps make a case as to why you should do something, but a lot of people who work in automotive product create what they intuitively think people want to buy, or what will bring people to your company to look at other, more profitable product. Sometimes that is manifested as a rotary shifter because someone thought that lazy people really want a dial to select gears and not a lever, other times its manifested as a stick being offered on a car, and sometimes it's an entire car being created from scratch like the twins. No business is exactly alike, so unless you have actually worked in the automotive business, for an OEM. Do not assume you know what goes on inside, because a lot of times clear logic is not the main factor, personal preferences are what guides special products like the twins.

[vh_supra26]

http://media.toyota.co.uk/2018/07/fi...he-first-time/

• World first as all five generations of Toyota Supra come together
• British Toyota Supra owners get exclusive access to new A90 Supra prototype
• Sports car introduced by Chief Engineer Tetsuya Tada
• A select group of classic Toyota Supra owners from the UK have become amongst the first car fans in the world to get close up and personal with the all-new version of the iconic sports car.

The behind-closed-doors event in Sussex saw all four famous generations of the sports car brought together with the new fifth generation car for the first time anywhere in the world.

Toyota invited a group of Supra super-fans to an evening event with Tetsuya Tada, in which the chief engineer of the new A90 Supra gave owners of all four previous generations an exclusive introduction to the camouflaged prototype.

The top secret, invite-only event occurred during the long weekend of the 2018 Goodwood Festival of Speed, where the keenly anticipated new fifth-generation Supra made its world debut.

Earlier in the day, Tada-san had given thousands of enthusiasts an early taste of the vehicle’s dynamic performance by driving up the famous festival hill course, after which the prototype was whisked away to another location in West Sussex for its exclusive static showing.

A total of 50 immaculately presented Supra models from all four generations had been invited to attend in anticipation of the new A90 Supra’s arrival.

The majority of the 84 owners and guests arrived in fourth-generation models, from highly sought-after UK-specification models with manual gearboxes, to examples that illustrated the enduring popularity and immense tuning potential of the iconic 2JZ straight-six engine. Also in attendance were eight third-generation models in both original and facelifted guise, four angular second-generation models, and a single first-generation model – one of only two examples of the Celica Supra known to exist in the UK.

Tada-san drove the new A90 Supra into the building to rapturous applause from the enthusiasts. He positioned it on a rotating stand and then proudly introduced his “new baby” to the crowd as the culmination of six years of development. It was a moment that marked the first time that all five generations of Toyota Supra had ever appeared together in public.

During the course of the evening, Tada-san was eager to mingle with the guests and chat openly about the A90 project. As an enthusiast himself, he was equally eager to hear from existing owners about what Supra means to them and gain a greater understanding of their expectations for this next chapter in the model’s history.

Commenting on the weekend, Tada-san revealed: “I’m just so happy that we’ve made it to this point. I’ve finally been able to reveal the car to the UK; it’s the happiest day of my life. And to drive it up the hill at Goodwood was a really exciting experience.”

Toyota expects its new Supra to reach the market during the first half of 2019.

EDITOR’S NOTES:

The first Supra was produced in 1978 as the flagship derivative of the contemporary Celica but it was never sold in the UK. The second-generation Celica Supra arrived in the UK in August 1982 and was replaced by the standalone third-generation Supra model in July 1986. The fourth-generation Supra was launched in August 1993 but discontinued in the UK in 1996. Low-volume production of the Mk4 Supra continued in Japan for the domestic market until July 2002.

UK sales figures:

1982-1985 Celica Supra (4,132 units)
1986-1993 Supra (11,551 Units)
1994-1996 Supra (623 units)

[Impureclient]

Opens thread...

Why is everybody so mad!

[chaoskaze]

Zzz.......... I don't know why but I think this shared platform supra between BMW & Toyota looks like a huge disaster except ppl who likes z4 & wants cheaper Z4 parts/labor.

[Stang70Fastback]

I agree with rvoll.
(This seemed easier than arguing with a brick wall.)

[Jordanwolf]

Originally Posted by Impureclient

Opens thread...

Why is everybody so mad!

Looks at gif, imagines tcoat in the 70's, proceeds to say WHHOOOOOAAAAAA in a psychedelic voice

[FRSBRZGT86FAN]

Originally Posted by Stang70Fastback

I agree with rvoll.
(This seemed easier than arguing with a brick wall.)

Honestly, I'm pretty sure I've seen rvoll on this forum in other parts saying he knows corporate strategy or something similar before.

He just posted a click baity road and track article, with a click-baity thread title and is now angry people are disagreeing with him

[FRSBRZGT86FAN]

Originally Posted by DesertLava

I agree with this logic. 4 cyl 86, 4 cyl Supra, 6 cyl Supra. Something has to give. The 6 cyl Supra is obviously confirmed... The leaked document leads me to believe the 4 cyl Supra-GT86 will replace the current 86. However, I don't know if thats a good thing. Only so much weight can be reduced from the 6 cyl Supra. It will likely be heavier than the current Toyota 86... But it will have more power too. Could be a similar power to weight ratio at the end of the day, but with the turbo feels.

Originally Posted by BigHugeFatGuy

Nah. Everything I've read says the Supra be ~3,400 lbs. With an estimated 350 hp, that's 4th gen Camaro performance (better handling and interior of course, but not great).

I'm late to this thread but Tada-san said he hopes those planning to do engine swaps buy the 4 cylinder supra, so it's pretty much confirmed on that front

[FRSBRZGT86FAN]

Originally Posted by rvoll

I would tend to believe internal company documents more than the Japan Times which just deals with rumors. As I understand the history, the 86 was the name for Toyota's front engine/rear wheel drive sports car over the years. The FT stood for "Future Toyota". So using the FT86 designation internally makes sense to me. Could there remain the current version as well? Perhaps, but having three sports cars, which sell at low volumes, at a Toyota dealership just doesn't translate. Especially when two of them have 4 cyl engines.

Have yet to have substantial proof that that is a legitimate company document. Lemetier on the bmw forums has yet to comment on that as well. I think it's quite obvious road and track has someone perusing forums, found that image and then ran a story with it making an assumption with it. Nothing else as, the original poster hasn't been online on the forum in over 5 days....

[OMEN]

if the new gen will have the 4cyl turbo, im gonna trade mine


sadly the rumors say it will have 2400cc

[abraxis]

Originally Posted by chaoskaze

Zzz.......... I don't know why but I think this shared platform supra between BMW & Toyota looks like a huge disaster except ppl who likes z4 & wants cheaper Z4 parts/labor.

Maybe cuz you're ill informed. The only reason this new Z4 and BRZ even exist is because Toyota pushed them to join in on their vision. Regardless, don't let me get in the way of any of the usual Toyota bashing or historical revisionism. Please continue....

Oh btw, the Z4 prototype has already been hailed as the best handling Z BMW prob has ever produced (Toyota says you're welcome) by auto journalists driving it on the track, and the Supra will be even sharper and more aggressively tuned as a real sports car, not a GT car.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjw5VAmV9bs"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjw5VAmV9bs[/ame]

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Oh and say hi to your mother for me. No doubt she will be glad to hear from you.

I am sure your parents will be very proud about you. This had no relation with the discussion.

Originally Posted by Shark_Bait88

Subaru would never have made the BRZ if Toyota hadn't approached them about it. And I find it HIGHLY unlikely they'd continue making the BRZ on their own, especially without the big bucks funding coming in from Toyota. Let alone invest millions into R&D into an upgraded version to compete with the Supra. Do you really think Subaru can afford to compete with the joint power and funding of BMW and Toyota using an older chassis that Toyota helped them develop? And what about WRX/STI sales? A car like that would be placed squarely in the same range as an STI.

It would be very interesting to see what Subaru will do if Toyota goes with BMW for the GT86. All speculation here, but you know that Subaru is a small company and is doing very well with the rest of their car line-up. The current chassis has not any issue nor is outdated and just imagine the possibilities if they go forward with their own 2.4 NA motor ...

[Adam_L]

Originally Posted by funwheeldrive

If the 4 cylinder supra weighed around 3000lbs and makes 260hp it would be a much better p/w ratio than the gt86. Also, it wouldn't have torque dip. And it would be much easier to get more power out of compared to the 86.

Correct, but at what price? The FR-S / BRZ was/is the "affordable RWD sports car". What will the '19 Supra be? The new Toyota sports car, time to bend over and spread 'em ?! I don't want any piece of that action. Plus it will surely have the new software set up ( post 2016-'17) that lets everyone know if you've been picking your nose while driving.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by rvoll

Good to know.... So we don't know for sure whether he's arguing generally or trying to quell a leaked internal document so the damage will be minimalized. Normally, if he works for the company, he should stay out of the discussion because involvement only makes it worse. If he says anything that supports the document, he is a leaker and if he argues against it, he only increases the perception that it is true.

Yes, that is what companies are saying in such cases to their employees. You just stay out of the discussion either you know something either you don't. In fact joining a forum and implying your position on a specific company either directly or indirectly is also not the best thing to do.