Jackson Racing engine oil cooler for NA applications

[ZionsWrath]

Originally Posted by mistople

Right, I understand that there is no modification related to the cooler itself. I'm more talking about the common issue where the BRZ/86/FR-S bumpers sag once you remove them and reinstall them just once. Curious if that's still an issue, and if there are any good solutions?

Doesn't matter at all

The cooler is mounted to the front bumper reinforcement/impact bar. Or whatever the official name is for it.

Your entire plastic bumper could be removed from the vehicle and not even disturb the cooler mounted to the impact beam.

This is particularly important if you cut the grass on track and it rips your bumper off the car but otherwise doesn't damage the chassis.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by ZionsWrath

Hey, any recommendations for a block off?

Been DDing mine for a week now and I know from previous oil temp monitoring it does not get up the temp DDing. I haven't DD it since I got the cooler so would always do some pulls to get it up when I was out. Right now I am shifting at 4k minimum and keeping RPM between 3-4k when crusing, not going into 6th gear ever. A/C use also dramatically drops temps particularly at idle.

Right now I am using a cut out cereal box and painters tape. The way it has been raining it probably fell off by now.

I was thinking cut out a piece of plastic and duct tape/large zip ties. Would a zip lock bag plastic be strong enough/not melt or do I need something else.

I might just disconnect it for the time being and zip tie the adapter in a bag in the engine bay so I don't have to remove the whole thing.

Edit: If I recall my oil temps on the street were 180-190, and 160-170 with air con, less than 170 with air con at a stop. That is just my best recollection Need to run torque app again

Remember those temps are post-cooler, not pre-cooler. It's not overcooled

[Azzudien]

Apparently things are improving at Jackson Racing, Oscar Jackson Jr reach out to me about the issues I was having with their customer service and he wants to try to make things right so +1 to him.
Once I finally have the oil cooler functioning on my car I look forward to coming back to this thread and giving a positive review. I have some big track days coming up VIR and Watkins Glen so it should definitely see some tough usage.

[bmxr]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Remember those temps are post-cooler, not pre-cooler. It's not overcooled

That’s a great point! I’ve been wondering, though... My max temp during my fastest lap on track w/o a cooler, was 258.8, according to the csv file I pulled from Harry’s. Is the “crucial need” for a cooler on these cars a little (a lot) overblown? I’m talking stock compression, NA... I appreciate the insurance and it’s a great kit, but just wondering about the prevailing internet wisdom out there...

[Tristor]

Originally Posted by bmxr

That’s a great point! I’ve been wondering, though... My max temp during my fastest lap on track w/o a cooler, was 258.8, according to the csv file I pulled from Harry’s. Is the “crucial need” for a cooler on these cars a little (a lot) overblown? I’m talking stock compression, NA... I appreciate the insurance and it’s a great kit, but just wondering about the prevailing internet wisdom out there...

I don’t think the concern is overblown. I am not an oil expert, but I do know a thing or two about hydraulic systems and imagine the principles are the same. As pressure increases in a closed fluid system the viscosity of the fluid rises, as temperature increases viscosity falls rapidly. In this case (because it’s what we care about in hydraulics) when I say viscosity I mean kinematic viscosity which is measured in centiStokes (cSt). The kinematic viscosity of water in a closed system at 20C is 1cSt.

Mobil 1 0W20 has a viscosity of 44.8cSt at 40C and 8.7cSt at 100C. 258F is 126C. Think about that for a minute. Now I don’t know for sure what the viscosity of Mobil 1 is at 126C but I know damn sure it’s much lower than it is at 100C. Viscosity matters because it’s basically a measurement of a fluids ability to resist deformation under sheer stress, such as that caused by being squeezed between two tightly coupled surfaces. I absolutely believe that rod bearing failures are partly caused in our engines by high oil temperatures under spirited driving and this causes a loss of film strength leading to the bearings grinding against their channel.

There is also a relationship between viscosity, temperature, and pressure that is obvious from what I’m describing above. We do not have a factory oil pressure sensor other than the dummy light. What we do know is as temperatures increase it can cause a drop in viscosity which can cause a drop in fluid pressure. I am personally not comfortable with the idea of taking my car on the track repeatedly without resolving this fundamental problem. The solution is simple though, install an oil cooler. Frankly the car should have had an oil cooler from the factory.

[gtengr]

And the density goes down as the temperature rises, which reduces the effectiveness of the oil at cooling the bearings. Several things start to work against the engine when oil temp goes up too much.

[bmxr]

No one disputes what temp does to oil in general but a)the specific engine design matters , and b) 260 is not that hot. Where I think the discussion needs to start, is with pre-cooler temp data...

[churchx]

Frankly the car should have had an oil cooler from the factory.

Or not.
I wildly guess, that not even 1/50 twins owners go to track (though more then possible percentage of track day enthusiasts is higher then for many other car model owners). And one of most distinguishing features of twins from rest of sporty coupes is it's relatively cheap price. Hence i totally understand toyobaru possible reasoning for not installing it in every stock twin. Same for few other handy features i'd wish for in tracked car, such as stock camber adjustment, less understeery stock alignment, even beefier stock brakes, different FD ratio, closer ratio gears as stock, clutch diff instead of Torsen and such. Those who need those, will install those. No need for other 49 owners to pay premium for that, when they will never really push that hard on public roads with few exceptions that still most probably will be far from real track abuse, just a bit more often flooring for short amount of time and a bit faster in bends vs driving in generic cars. Temps will rise also during idling in standstill trafic? True. But how many do redline engine and hard launches while in traffic jam? How many go on highway on redline in 2nd gear for long periods of time? How many will do hard braking passengers will curse one for and with high chance someone rear ending one's car?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by bmxr

That’s a great point! I’ve been wondering, though... My max temp during my fastest lap on track w/o a cooler, was 258.8, according to the csv file I pulled from Harry’s. Is the “crucial need” for a cooler on these cars a little (a lot) overblown? I’m talking stock compression, NA... I appreciate the insurance and it’s a great kit, but just wondering about the prevailing internet wisdom out there...

It is mandatory to preserve your engine.

It's like saying you would be OKAY doing manual labor in 115F ambient temps, but you'd certainly be much better off if you had some shade, or water misters cooling you off, or a fan blowing in your direction. You'd be okay, but eventually succumb to heat stroke, without cooling.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by bmxr

No one disputes what temp does to oil in general but a)the specific engine design matters , and b) 260 is not that hot. Where I think the discussion needs to start, is with pre-cooler temp data...

No, 260 is not that hot. These temps are after the oil leaves the engine and before entering the oil sump. Other manufacturers place the thermostat within the sump where the temperatures are lower. I believe the same holds about oil manufacturers that post tests relevant to oil sump temps.

[steve99]

Measure your oil pressures when your oil is at 260F, you will find a significant reduction in pressure as the oil exceeds 200F.


http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91820

[gtengr]

Originally Posted by bmxr

No one disputes what temp does to oil in general but a)the specific engine design matters , and b) 260 is not that hot. Where I think the discussion needs to start, is with pre-cooler temp data...

What other cars besides cheap ones like the 86 are designed with some road course abuse in mind but don't include an oil cooler?

260 is getting hot, and it gets hotter than that. Several owners have shown the drop in oil pressure due to higher temps with datalogging. Maybe that's acceptable for your engine, but it's not a risk-free thing to do.

[nikitopo]

When the oil pressure is going low, then you change to a higher viscosity oil. You can use a 5w30 grade or even higher. If you still see a low oil pressure, THEN you install an oil cooler. This is how common sense should be and what an experienced tuning shop that doesn't want to "sell" should suggest. Oil temperatures depend on car usage, weather temperatures and so on. Factory didn't think a cooler was absolutely necessary and it was not about keeping the costs down. The tS car is not really a cheap car and doesn't include an oil cooler either.

[Azzudien]

Back on topic, since this thread original started with a review of the JR na oil cooler. After a lot of back and forth JR made amends with me and I was able to install the oil cooler on my car.
So off to the track I went. Air temperature on 2 hour drive to track was 70-75, Oil temp stayed pegged 185-190 with no fluctuation outside that range.
4 Sessions on the track, two 30 minute sessions, one 25 minutes, one 20 minutes. Air temps from 75 in the first session to 85 in the last session. This was at Palmer Motorsports and pre oil cooler I had spike at 280 degree oil temps in the past.
This time my max oil temp never spike over 240, and only hit 240 in the last session when the air temp was highest, and only 6 cars on the track so I was pushing as hard as I could with no traffic.

Final impression:
Very happy, not a single drip or seepage out of any connection with 4 hours of highway driving and 1:45 minutes of track time. Definitely going back to 0-20 oil, was using 5-30 due to the high oil temps previously.
I think this is a solid investment, and a good modification for our cars.

Thanks to Oscar Jackson Jr for remedying my customer service issues and helping me finally check this one off my to do list for my car.

Onward to my next thing on the to do list, suspension. My wallet is already screaming at me knowing whats coming.