Is this engine noise normal? (Consensus - normal)

[ermax]

Originally Posted by mazeroni

Another possible answer is that the engine is supposed to switch from port to DI around 3-4K (I don't think anyone knows for sure). Given the change in fueling method and combustion, it might be that.

Depending on load too. I have basically come to the conclusion that it's related to DI. I read in one thread where someone who had experience with DI seal failure say theirs sounded like this. But after doing a bunch of reading and listening to other cars with DI seal failure it just makes a bunch of popping sounds. Popping like a cork gun. But I'm still tempted to pull my injectors to check the seals anyways. Looks like it's not that bad of a job and the seals are cheap.

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

Originally Posted by ermax

This car sounds like garbage IMO. I can overlook just about every flaw about our cars but they just really sound like crap. Hard to get used to after owning so many other cars that sound amazing.

I agree. It's like farm equipment lol. And yes, this sound is there on a neutral throttle, as you describe it, but as soon as I start accelerating or decelerating, it goes away.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by ermax

I was just looking at the forcast and it will be 80F next Wednesday here in North Florida.

........ don't rub it in!


humfrz

[ermax]

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

I agree. It's like farm equipment lol. And yes, this sound is there on a neutral throttle, as you describe it, but as soon as I start accelerating or decelerating, it goes away.

I think you read what I said backwards. If you only hear it with neutral load and it goes away when accelerating/decelerating then it may be knock. Mine makes the sound without load AND under light to medium acceleration and does not make the sound when decelerating.

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

Originally Posted by ermax

I think you read what I said backwards. If you only hear it with neutral load and it goes away when accelerating/decelerating then it may be knock. Mine makes the sound without load AND under light to medium acceleration and does not make the sound when decelerating.

By neutral load you mean holding at a certain rpm right? Like driving along in third at 3500? If yes, then that's what it does indeed. Light acceleration - also yes. Full balls out acceleration - not so much. Deceleration - I haven't paid attention but I'm leaning towards I don't think so.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by ermax

Rod knock is typically heard when the engine load is netral. Not engine braking but also not accelerating. Typically with rod knock it goes away with almost any acceleration/deceleration. My car makes this sound when load is neutral but also with light to medium acceleration. Off throttle it seems to go away. Rod knock also isn't isolated to one RPM band. Rod knock is also heard like mad on a cold start.

It damn sure "sounds" like rod knock to me but all other symptoms you get with rod knock don't show for me. I've smashed plenty of rod bearing over the years so I'm fairly used to how it sounds. On car I've had in the past the knock sensors pick up the rod knock and think it's detonation and retard the timing dramatically. This also isn't happening on my car. Took me months to rest my mind when getting this FRS.

This car sounds like garbage IMO. I can overlook just about every flaw about our cars but they just really sound like crap. Hard to get used to after owning so many other cars that sound amazing.

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

I agree. It's like farm equipment lol. And yes, this sound is there on a neutral throttle, as you describe it, but as soon as I start accelerating or decelerating, it goes away.

I prefer the term "Russian tractor"


Took me months to get used to the noises these things make. Now I am more afraid that one of the sounds will stop!

[ermax]

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

By neutral load you mean holding at a certain rpm right? Like driving along in third at 3500? If yes, then that's what it does indeed. Light acceleration - also yes. Full balls out acceleration - not so much. Deceleration - I haven't paid attention but I'm leaning towards I don't think so.

Yeah neutral as in just enough throttle to keep the car at one speed. Okay.. so yours sounds just like mine.

Typically rod knock starts as a very faint tapping sound only heard on a cold start (as in rested overnight) for just a few seconds. Then it progresses from a tap to more of a knocking when there is no negative or positive load on the crank. From that point it escalates very quickly until one day you get timing retard, CELs and knocking under all circumstances. Every bearing I've ever destroyed was on cars that were consuming oil and were a quart low and always under high g-load at high RPMs. Lost one at an autox for example.

The way ours sounds I wouldn't expect more than a few weeks before total failure. I got my car in October and it's sounded just like your video and hasn't progressed at all. So I am no longer stressing over it.

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

Originally Posted by ermax

Yeah neutral as in just enough throttle to keep the car at one speed. Okay.. so yours sounds just like mine.

Typically rod knock starts as a very faint tapping sound only heard on a cold start (as in rested overnight) for just a few seconds. Then it progresses from a tap to more of a knocking when there is no negative or positive load on the crank. From that point it escalates very quickly until one day you get timing retard, CELs and knocking under all circumstances. Every bearing I've ever destroyed was on cars that were consuming oil and were a quart low and always under high g-load at high RPMs. Lost one at an autox for example.

The way ours sounds I wouldn't expect more than a few weeks before total failure. I got my car in October and it's sounded just like your video and hasn't progressed at all. So I am no longer stressing over it.

excellent. The reason why I'm paranoid is that my last car, a 2007 mini cooper s, which were known for being fantastically unreliable (alas, I only found out after I bought it) had all kinds of knocks and taps. "Normal Mini engine sound" they said. That was partially true. Then the knocking increased one day, and I had to replace the timing pulley or I can't remember what. Then again the knocking came back, this time something else was wrong. Then one day I was driving on the highway (going very slightly uphill) and the rpms all of a sudden started fluctuating wildly, with a cel, no smoke. Mechanic ran a compression test and said there was zero compression in one of the cylinders and 50 in the other. So I'm guessing the knocking I was hearing in that engine was a ticking time bomb. The pain lives on inside lol, so I overanalyze every sound now.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by ermax

Depending on load too. I have basically come to the conclusion that it's related to DI. I read in one thread where someone who had experience with DI seal failure say theirs sounded like this. But after doing a bunch of reading and listening to other cars with DI seal failure it just makes a bunch of popping sounds. Popping like a cork gun. But I'm still tempted to pull my injectors to check the seals anyways. Looks like it's not that bad of a job and the seals are cheap.

My wife's Impreza has the FB20 engine in it and it does not make the same sounds at all as the FA20. The biggest difference is that our cars have both the direct and port injection from the Toyota system whereas the FB20 is just direct. I think that accounts for the difference in sounds.

[ermax]

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

The pain lives on inside lol, so I overanalyze every sound now.

I'm in the same boat due to my past experiences with actual rod knock. I had two cars that I managed to hydrolock. One day in my 1995 Integra GS-R I got on an onramp which goes down a little before going back up which turned out to be flooded. I was already committed to the ramp and couldn't turn around so I pushed through but it was too deep for the CAI I had. Once that think hydrolocked it only went about a year before smashing a bearing. Luckily you could reach all 4 by simply dropping the pan. Swapped them all and went about 3 years. Then spun one again. Dropped the pan, swapped them out. Didn't make it to the end of my road before it was going nuts again. I retired it at the point. I also have an IS300 which I hydrolocked in a parking lot. I was driving through the lot, made a left hand turn and found myself with water rushing over the hood. Freaking Florida. That car went about 2 years before smashing a bearing. Unlike the Integra it was a bitch to get to the bearings. It has a small pan #1 which only exposes the front 3 bearings. If you need to get to the other three you have to drop the main pan #2 which involves dropping the lower subframe, rack, ect ect. That After swapping the bearings it went about 2 more years... then 1 year and the last time only 8 months. So I sidelined it and got the FRS. I plan to get a new crank and rods and do a full rebuild. But anyways.. I am PARANOID! hahahaha

[ermax]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

My wife's Impreza has the FB20 engine in it and it does not make the same sounds at all as the FA20. The biggest difference is that our cars have both the direct and port injection from the Toyota system whereas the FB20 is just direct. I think that accounts for the difference in sounds.

Well that is good to hear. I believe the VVT on your wifes works the same as the FA20 so that narrows it down to the Toyota DI/PI cluster fuck.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by ermax

Well that is good to hear. I believe the VVT on your wifes works the same as the FA20 so that narrows it down to the Toyota DI/PI cluster fuck.

There may be minor differences but overall I believe they are identical. When you hear the two run side by side the difference is startling.

[DandoX]

I don't claim to be an expert but I listened closely with headphones and I was unable to hear anything abnormal.

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

Originally Posted by DandoX

I don't claim to be an expert but I listened closely with headphones and I was unable to hear anything abnormal.

Thanks for taking the time!