Hate in the Car Community

[Taka]

Originally Posted by Cole

Most of the people who get "hated on" do it to themselves.

Either with idiotic mods, a lack of knowledge but presenting themselves as knowledgeable or a combination of both. The kind of person who would shell out big bucks for a throttle body and a new header, but not tune specifically for them.

Idiotic modifications are slamming cars the ground like you had done in the past.

[Cole]

Originally Posted by Taka

Idiotic modifications are slamming cars the ground like you had done in the past.

I don't deny that. The car wasn't fun to drive in that configuration. Good thing I came to my senses and now it's at a reasonable height and is plenty fun to drive.

Good thing tastes change with time.

[mav1178]

it seems this is uniquely limited to North America as far as a problem is concerned.

[Impureclient]

Well at least we can all agree on the deserved hate that this mod gets:

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Attempting to point out an error or disagreeing with sombody is not hating on anything. If everybody just smiled and said "oh that is great" then there would be no point in even having a forum where thoughts can be shared. Just because people don't want to hear it doesn't make it negative.
People can totally dislike something about their own car and publicly state it. I totally rail to see how that is "hating on themselves".
I have frequently been accused of "chasing" individuals around. It is pure paranoia and self righteousness that make them think that. If crap is posted in ten threads then I will respond in ten threads. If sombody thinks every answer I give is somehow angry or negative just because it isn't what they want to hear that is their problem not mine. I had one guy PMing me daily to say "I hope you die soon" because I had the audacity to say I didn't think a Mazda engine would be an upgrade in an FRS. That one simple statement had him calling me the biggest hater ever just because I didn't smile, nod and hand him a participant trophy.
If people come here and expect nothing but support and praise they are going to be disappointed. When they lash out becuas in their own twisted anger they see nothing but anger in everybody else then we are better off without them anyway.


Even then they are usually not being hated on. They just feel that way when everybody doesn't pat them on the head and tell them how great their idea is.

All I can give is an example and then I'll stop talking. I won't discuss about the negative criticism on the lightweight pulleys, bigger throttle body, new factory exhaust manifold. You just don't believe on such kind of mods, you are saying that they are useless and I won't change your mind.

So, I've been accused in the past that removing the factory A/C was a stupid modification, because there is a very minimal weight gain. I agree that a gain of 15 lbs. doesn't change too much the car. But, many times we cannot see the forest for the tree. In the specific case meaning that it was not only about weight savings. It was also a change that would support future modifications. When you remove the A/C condenser, you are freeing air flow to the engine's condenser which is behind. This modification together with a lower temperature thermostat gives you an engine that runs 10C cooler and for a longer period of time (until you reach the limits of the factory cooling system). Again this might mean nothing per se, but the reduced operating temperature improves both engine volumetric efficiency and knock limit and with a tune it can provide a gain of about 3whp (yes for this modification a tune is not a bit better, it is necessary). So, is this change important? For a street car it might not be too much important. However, for a street car that might want to compete also in a NA race class it is important. For a street car that might want to have a better lap time in Nurburgring again it is important. It is all these small details that we are not aware and I agree that we cannot know in a forum, because we don't know each other or we don't know everything! That's why I believe we should not be too much negative and only praise what we think ourselves that is better for a car.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

All I can give is an example and then I'll stop talking. I won't discuss about the negative criticism on the lightweight pulleys, bigger throttle body, new factory exhaust manifold. You just don't believe on such kind of mods, you are saying that they are useless and I won't change your mind.

So, I've been accused in the past that removing the factory A/C was a stupid modification, because there is a very minimal weight gain. I agree that a gain of 15 lbs. doesn't change too much the car. But, many times we cannot see the forest for the tree. In the specific case meaning that it was not only about weight savings. It was also a change that would support future modifications. When you remove the A/C condenser, you are freeing air flow to the engine's condenser which is behind. This modification together with a lower temperature thermostat gives you an engine that runs 10C cooler and for a longer period of time (until you reach the limits of the factory cooling system). Again this might mean nothing per se, but the reduced operating temperature improves both engine volumetric efficiency and knock limit and with a tune it can provide a gain of about 3whp (yes for this modification a tune is not a bit better, it is necessary). So, is this change important? For a street car it might not be too much important. However, for a street car that might want to compete also in a NA race class it is important. For a street car that might want to have a better lap time in Nurburgring again it is important. It is all these small details that we are not aware and I agree that we cannot know in a forum, because we don't know each other or we don't know everything! That's why I believe we should not be too much negative and only praise what we think ourselves that is better for a car.

You can't have positives without some negatives.

[Summerwolf]

Errbody tryna get dat youtube skrilla.....

[Kids Heart]

My old sr20det sil-80 was never hated on and my BRZ has never been hated on. Why? good tasted, managed expectations. If your car is a corner demon don't try to present it as a drag or highspeed monster.

[Cole]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

All I can give is an example and then I'll stop talking. I won't discuss about the negative criticism on the lightweight pulleys, bigger throttle body, new factory exhaust manifold. You just don't believe on such kind of mods, you are saying that they are useless and I won't change your mind.

So, I've been accused in the past that removing the factory A/C was a stupid modification, because there is a very minimal weight gain. I agree that a gain of 15 lbs. doesn't change too much the car. But, many times we cannot see the forest for the tree. In the specific case meaning that it was not only about weight savings. It was also a change that would support future modifications. When you remove the A/C condenser, you are freeing air flow to the engine's condenser which is behind. This modification together with a lower temperature thermostat gives you an engine that runs 10C cooler and for a longer period of time (until you reach the limits of the factory cooling system). Again this might mean nothing per se, but the reduced operating temperature improves both engine volumetric efficiency and knock limit and with a tune it can provide a gain of about 3whp (yes for this modification a tune is not a bit better, it is necessary). So, is this change important? For a street car it might not be too much important. However, for a street car that might want to compete also in a NA race class it is important. For a street car that might want to have a better lap time in Nurburgring again it is important. It is all these small details that we are not aware and I agree that we cannot know in a forum, because we don't know each other or we don't know everything! That's why I believe we should not be too much negative and only praise what we think ourselves that is better for a car.

Care to share the dyno that shows your 3 whp gain?

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Cole

Care to share the dyno that shows your 3 whp gain?

No, I won't share a dyno because I don't care to prove anything. The finding with the low temperature thermostat and the tune was provided already by Cosworth some time ago. It is not a new thing. If you don't believe them (not me), it's another story.

[Cole]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

No, I won't share a dyno because I don't care to prove anything. The finding with the low temperature thermostat and the tune was provided already by Cosworth some time ago. It is not a new thing. If you don't believe them (not me), it's another story.

So as usual, you only have your word, and an aftermarket company's marketing material to quote.

I wonder how that 3hp was measured? Does Cosworth have a dyno that doesn't change its reading from run to run?

You're kind of the exact person I mentioned in my first post in this thread. A multitude of ridiculous mods, and not a whole lot of knowledge to go along with them

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Cole

So as usual, you only have your word, and an aftermarket company's marketing material to quote.

I wonder how that 3hp was measured? Does Cosworth have a dyno that doesn't change its reading from run to run?

They made an engine dyno the same way factory does, which means they measured the power at the crank. It has a much smaller tolerance since you have less variables in the measurement (no flywheel, no gear box, no driveshaft, no rear differential or axles, no tires etc). They said that this change was measurable which means it was above the expected dyno tolerance. This is enough for me.

Originally Posted by Cole

You're kind of the exact person I mentioned in my first post in this thread. A multitude of ridiculous mods, and not a whole lot of knowledge to go along with them

This was exactly my intension when I posted in this topic. To show a few of the haters over here

[shiumai]

'Hate' is an "intense or passionate dislike".

I think that a lot of people are misusing the word 'hate' and using it as a substitute for dislike or even ambivalence. Calling people 'haters' is a way of implying that they're close-minded to anything different, when the person who's calling them 'haters' is just trying to justify his own choices (and is more often than not, butt-hurt).

There are a lot of mods that people do to their twins that I wouldn't do to mine, simply because they're not my style or personal preference. Just because I care enough not to spend my money to do the same mod doesn't mean I care what someone else does to their own car. I really don't - at least not enough to qualify it as 'hate'.

[Twinz]

I thought "hate" in this context implied some level of jealousy.

People who can't have something they otherwise want may try to make themselves feel better about it by highlighting and/or even fabricating some sort of fault with what they are unable to attain.


But when a negative opinion of something is truly based solely on personal preference, I don't consider it "hating" in the way I have always understood the use of the term.

If someone drives by in my dream car and I feel the need to only voice whatever flaws I can find with it...I would consider myself to be "hating".

But if I voice a negative opinion of something that I don't like simply because...well...I don't like it, then that's just my opinion.