Accelerated Performance 2013 BRZ - FRS Turbo Kit Designing

[GirlyScions]

Originally Posted by jedibow

Your simple statement was boost and high RPM don't mix, in that case I could sight any internal combustion engine that uses forced induction

Thanks Dimman you always have a way to elequantly state the point I'm trying to make. HaHa

Actually I think I said it wasn't as safe. The below sentance was refering to the top one seeing how the fa20 is what this fourm talks about. I need to work on stop being so damn confusing

Still skeptical of 300 FI reliable hp particularly after the difference subaru's version is to achieve the same goal. I just assume subaru made those changes because its just that much more reliable.

[jedibow]

Originally Posted by GirlyScions

Actually I think I said it wasn't as safe. The below sentance was refering to the top one seeing how the fa20 is what this fourm talks about. I need to work on stop being so damn confusing

Still skeptical of 300 FI reliable hp particularly after the difference subaru's version is to achieve the same goal. I just assume subaru made those changes because its just that much more reliable.

The end goal of the OEM is, and will be different. They have to have a vehicle and tune that is reliable, emmisions friendly, and can accomodate any driving style first, and then the look at performance afterwards. limiting the RPM on this engine just because of FI seems strange to me, but subaru isn't the only manufacturer that does this. If they were to swap out the crank for a longer stroke, then droping the redline would make sense as the longer stroke would mean the torque peak would happen lower in the rev range, so most drivers wouldn't care. I mean when is the last time you heard somebody with a big block in there car cry about the engine not reving to 10k, it doesn't happen because they have all the power under the curve they need without running the engine to those speeds.

I know you were discussing the fa20, I just wanted to get my point across using engines that most people are familiar with, that is all.

As numerous people have already stated, with the correct amount of fuel, and ignition timing there is no reason (that we know of yet) that this engine couldn't produce 300whp with FI. However through company's like accelerated performance pushing the envelope we will be able to determine, block strength, rod strength, cylinder sealing, cooling strength, oiling strength, and as popular as this platform is I believe that when each limitation is determined, somebody will offer a solution. I have learned a valuable lesson, you learn more from failing, than you do from suceeding. It is from failing that you identify limits, and can plan how to overcome those limits.

[Don@Accelerated]

That's why I'm all over this. Not to mention I bought one myself.

[jedibow]

Originally Posted by Don@Accelerated

That's why I'm all over this. Not to mention I bought one myself.

I know and I appreciate all you are doing!

Good turbo selection, great idea for packaging, I'm excited to see where you take this,

Thanks Don

G

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by jedibow

If they were to swap out the crank for a longer stroke, then droping the redline would make sense as the longer stroke would mean the torque peak would happen lower in the rev range, so most drivers wouldn't care. I mean when is the last time you heard somebody with a big block in there car cry about the engine not reving to 10k, it doesn't happen because they have all the power under the curve they need without running the engine to those speeds.

Errrr only drastic changes in stroke will do that, Toyota noticed a 1% change in fuel economy or so across a huge range of strokes when developing the 1ZZ.

My guess would be they limited revs since the turbo poops out at higher revs, and then they use that to possibly cheapen the engine in other places due to reduced rev requirement.

[Coheed]

true, compressive forces from higher Bmep and boost are less stressful on the rotating assembly than high rpm.

But with a tuner-friendly design, high compression, and relatively lively redline of 7300rpm, I believe the rods have been designed to handle at least 300whp easily... the pistons probably won't handle a lot of detonation too well though.

The last few toyota engines I have torn down have had really spindly connecting rods, with weaksauce bearing sizes. Same with the EJ20. But I still believe 300whp will be achievable and reliable with proper tuning... and it will be a riot to drive!

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Coheed

The last few toyota engines I have torn down have had really spindly connecting rods, with weaksauce bearing sizes.

This was probably just a general comment from you but to make sure, this is a Subaru engine not Toyota, so don't expect this this engine to fail similar to how Toyota engines commonly fail.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by sportsguy83

This was probably just a general comment from you but to make sure, this is a Subaru engine not Toyota, so don't expect this this engine to fail similar to how Toyota engines commonly fail.

The EJ20 he mentioned is a Subaru motor.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Dimman

The EJ20 he mentioned is a Subaru motor.

Fair, and exactly the reason I quoted only the Toyota sentence.

[Exhaust]

Originally Posted by sportsguy83

This was probably just a general comment from you but to make sure, this is a Subaru engine not Toyota, so don't expect this this engine to fail similar to how Toyota engines commonly fail.

face-palm.

[slow_frs]

Originally Posted by sportsguy83

This was probably just a general comment from you but to make sure, this is a Subaru engine not Toyota, so don't expect this this engine to fail similar to how Toyota engines commonly fail.

Hmm odd I've seen more subaru engines have piston ring failures than Toyota think about the design the pistons are sideways, gravity is constantly pulling the piston down on its side mix that with the stroking motion and it's like running something across a file over time the bottom side of the piston will flatten its just physics

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by Exhaust

face-palm.

Originally Posted by slow_frs

Hmm odd I've seen more subaru engines have piston ring failures than Toyota think about the design the pistons are sideways, gravity is constantly pulling the piston down on its side mix that with the stroking motion and it's like running something across a file over time the bottom side of the piston will flatten its just physics

I am not saying that Toyota's engines regularly fail, or making a comparison between Toyota or Subaru engines. All I said was not to compare the possible failures of this engine with Toyota engines because it is a Subaru engine, nothing more.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by slow_frs

Hmm odd I've seen more subaru engines have piston ring failures than Toyota think about the design the pistons are sideways, gravity is constantly pulling the piston down on its side mix that with the stroking motion and it's like running something across a file over time the bottom side of the piston will flatten its just physics

Perhaps you should familiarize yourself with the typical order of magnitude of the acceleration forces pistons see. Gravity is measured in...well, 1g. Piston acceleration is measured in 1000s of gs.

[brewksy]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Perhaps you should familiarize yourself with the typical order of magnitude of the acceleration forces pistons see. Gravity is measured in...well, 1g. Piston acceleration is measured in 1000s of gs.

Then why does Subaru recommend flipping the pistons every 25k miles to offset gravitational distortion of the piston heads. Duh.