Home Theater/Personal audio thread...

[krayzie]

Originally Posted by Clipdat

I only listen to 320kbps MP3s. Do I really need a better DAC than the Dragonfly?

Not sure about MP3s but with old CD Players like from the 80's, there's some emphasis on which DAC chips to go for when choosing a model.

[Clipdat]

Yeah, I already own a Marantz CD6004, I'm good on CD players.

Originally Posted by krayzie

Not sure about MP3s but with old CD Players like from the 80's, there's some emphasis on which DAC chips to go for when choosing a model.

[Vracer111]

Originally Posted by Clipdat

I've been using the Audioquest Dragonfly on my PC for the last few years and generally been pretty happy with it. Wanted a Bifrost for a long time though.

But now I see they have this bad boy (modi 2 multibit) which seems like a great deal: http://schiit.com/products/modi-2

I only listen to 320kbps MP3s. Do I really need a better DAC than the Dragonfly?

The Audioquest Dragonfly is an excellent DAC/amp combo (Dragonfly Red at least, have not heard the earlier ones) that excells at portable use by itself...very good quality sound that can be used with just about any phone, tablet, or laptop. What it doesn't do as well is using it as a DAC and connecting it to a separate headphone amp. The sound just isn't as clear or detailed as it is straight out the Dragonfly.

I don't listen to anything but 16bit/41kHz FLAC or higher, so not sure if the difference would be as big with 320kbps MP3, but there is a noticeable improvement in quality going with the Bifrost DAC (the regular AK4490 version, not sold on multi-bit and I wanted the lower distorsion levels found in the AK4490)/JAZZ-ff amp that is well worth the switch to me. Little details are brought out that simply don't even exist with the dragonfly, and the bass is noticeably increased....my TH-X00 PH's went from 'bass' to 'BAASSS'....and the precision seems noticeably increased as well with individual bass notes in chords much more distinguishable in fast sequences.

Modi 2 Uber has same AK4490 D/A chipset as the Bifrost, and for less than 1/2 the price..

[Clipdat]

Hey, thanks for your reply! I have the very first Dragonfly, have not gotten my ears on the 1.2 or the new red one.

Interesting that you experienced that when using it with a headphone amplifier. When I don't have it hooked up to my original circa 1999 Klipsch ProMedia computer speakers, I have it plugged into my Schiit Asgard 2.

I found it to be very revealing and quite nice to listen to in this configuration. I'm intrigued that I could be getting "better" bass though, since I primarily listen to drum n bass which of course features huge basslines.

Interesting that you did not opt for the multibit Bifrost, any reason for that in addition to distortion levels? It sounds like you're saying the best value is the Modi 2 Uber (non multibit).

Originally Posted by Vracer111

The Audioquest Dragonfly is an excellent DAC/amp combo (Dragonfly Red at least, have not heard the earlier ones) that excells at portable use by itself...very good quality sound that can be used with just about any phone, tablet, or laptop. What it doesn't do as well is using it as a DAC and connecting it to a separate headphone amp. The sound just isn't as clear or detailed as it is straight out the Dragonfly.

I don't listen to anything but 16bit/41kHz FLAC or higher, so not sure if the difference would be as big with 320kbps MP3, but there is a noticeable improvement in quality going with the Bifrost DAC (the regular AK4490 version, not sold on multi-bit and I wanted the lower distorsion levels found in the AK4490)/JAZZ-ff amp that is well worth the switch to me. Little details are brought out that simply don't even exist with the dragonfly, and the bass is noticeably increased....my TH-X00 PH's went from 'bass' to 'BAASSS'....and the precision seems noticeably increased as well with individual bass notes in chords much more distinguishable in fast sequences.

Modi 2 Uber has same AK4490 D/A chipset as the Bifrost, and for less than 1/2 the price..

[Vracer111]

The difference is not thatbig going from Dragonfly Red (DFR) with headphone amp to just DFR as DAC/amp...but you can hear a difference in clarity... seems like a slight veil is introduced with an amp and slightly less dynamics. Replace the DFR with the Bifrost and it is a huge positive difference using the exact same amp, much better than the DFR all by itself in every way.

I went with the Bifrost AK4490 because I wanted a smoother, slighty warmer DAC than the multibits and the price difference ($200). My headphone have highs that ride the line between perfection and overbearing... and my headphone amp is very precise and neutral. I also plan on getting STAX SR-L500 in the future.

[Clipdat]

My primary headphones are also really clinical and lack some bass as a result. I'm looking to purchase a few more pairs in the future though, even though I already own 3 pairs right now

I've wanted the bifrost uber for a while now, interesting to hear that you prefer it over the multibit option. Did you get yours with USB? Do you mind the clicking of the relays?

Originally Posted by Vracer111

The difference is not thatbig going from Dragonfly Red (DFR) with headphone amp to just DFR as DAC/amp...but you can hear a difference in clarity... seems like a slight veil is introduced with an amp and slightly less dynamics. Replace the DFR with the Bifrost and it is a huge positive difference using the exact same amp, much better than the DFR all by itself in every way.

I went with the Bifrost AK4490 because I wanted a smoother, slighty warmer DAC than the multibits and the price difference ($200). My headphone have highs that ride the line between perfection and overbearing... and my headphone amp is very precise and neutral. I also plan on getting STAX SR-L500 in the future.

[Vracer111]

Originally Posted by Clipdat

My primary headphones are also really clinical and lack some bass as a result. I'm looking to purchase a few more pairs in the future though, even though I already own 3 pairs right now

I've wanted the bifrost uber for a while now, interesting to hear that you prefer it over the multibit option. Did you get yours with USB? Do you mind the clicking of the relays?

Not Bifrost Uber, that was the model before the 4490...the Bifrost 4490 is the third revision and is above the Bifrost uber. USB is standard and the price is even less than the Uber version was...

http://schiit.com/products/bifrost

I have never noticed any relay clicking except when it is turned on or off.

With the music you seem to like to listen to and wanting some bass in headphones I'd highly recommend trying out the Fostex/Massdrop TH-X00...bass is sublime with it, the mids are great, and the highs are just about perfect. There are 3 versions, Mahogany, Purpleheart, and Ebony...I love my Purplehearts with J-Money lambskin pads (the pads loose a little bass impact [the purplehearts have an EXCESS of bass impact anyways] but improve the bass range, detail, and clarity, and improve the mids and highs likewise as well.)

This song has a pulsing bass on the TH-X00 that really pressurizes and pulverizes your head, starting @38 seconds (unfortunately the audio quality on this video is bad compared to the FLAC rip I made from the CD) :

To kind of get an idea of the TH-X00, put the best, most accurate, precise, and neutral cans you have on and take a listen to Z Reviews demo of the TH-X00 PH:

While not exactly what they sound like, it gives you a fairly good idea of their sound signature. Especially when you compare against other demos with cans you are very familar with. Z Reviews is great to get an idea of the comparitive sound signature between headphones, if you have a favorite headphone you know that is demoed which you can use as a standard. Sometimes though he notes that the recording of certain phones are difficult because of seal issues and that the demo is lacking in certain areas, usually an accurate representation of the bass.

I'm very intrigued by the demo of the Audio Technica ATH-A1000Z...which sounds really good except for bass, which he and others who have the headphone mentioned the bass was not captured accurately at all due to a sealing issue. But still, my real focus is on getting a STAX Lambda series setup (SR-L500), and it has been ever since I heard Z's first demo, and then a pair in real life... A recent demo of the STAX SR-L300:

[Clipdat]

Funny story from a few days ago. I subscribe to Stereophile magazine (like to read about high end gear I'll never be able to afford) and the latest issue has these Focal "Sopra N°3" on the cover: http://www.hifi-solution.com/2886-to...l-sopra-n3.jpg

There's also an advertisement on the back showing the various colors they come in. I explained to my wife "They come in various colors in an attempt to raise the WAF" and then told her what "WAF" means and she remarked "You know what would give it a better WAF? If they weren't so expensive!"

Anyway, I was reading your post and I brought up the Massdrop page for the TX-X00 Mahogany version. She glanced over at the screen and immediately says "High WAF right there!" Got a good laugh out of that response haha!

Anyway each version of it looks very nice, I'll have to do some more reading about the differences between them and also check out that video review. Also I'll need to find out how the comfort is for people who wear glasses. Unfortunately that's always something I have to take into consideration with headphone purchases.

I'll check out that bass demo you linked later. I'm sure I could give you some drum n bass tracks that would blow you away as far as sonics and deep bass.

Originally Posted by Vracer111

Not Bifrost Uber, that was the model before the 4490...the Bifrost 4490 is the third revision and is above the Bifrost uber. USB is standard and the price is even less than the Uber version was...

http://schiit.com/products/bifrost

I have never noticed any relay clicking except when it is turned on or off.

With the music you seem to like to listen to and wanting some bass in headphones I'd highly recommend trying out the Fostex/Massdrop TH-X00...bass is sublime with it, the mids are great, and the highs are just about perfect. There are 3 versions, Mahogany, Purpleheart, and Ebony...I love my Purplehearts with J-Money lambskin pads (the pads loose a little bass impact [the purplehearts have an EXCESS of bass impact anyways] but improve the bass range, detail, and clarity, and improve the mids and highs likewise as well.)

This song has a pulsing bass on the TH-X00 that really pressurizes and pulverizes your head, starting @38 seconds (unfortunately the audio quality on this video is bad compared to the FLAC rip I made from the CD) :

To kind of get an idea of the TH-X00, put the best, most accurate, precise, and neutral cans you have on and take a listen to Z Reviews demo of the TH-X00 PH:

While not exactly what they sound like, it gives you a fairly good idea of their sound signature. Especially when you compare against other demos with cans you are very familar with. Z Reviews is great to get an idea of the comparitive sound signature between headphones, if you have a favorite headphone you know that is demoed which you can use as a standard. Sometimes though he notes that the recording of certain phones are difficult because of seal issues and that the demo is lacking in certain areas, usually an accurate representation of the bass.

I'm very intrigued by the demo of the Audio Technica ATH-A1000Z...which sounds really good except for bass, which he and others who have the headphone mentioned the bass was not captured accurately at all due to a sealing issue. But still, my real focus is on getting a STAX Lambda series setup (SR-L500), and it has been ever since I heard Z's first demo, and then a pair in real life... A recent demo of the STAX SR-L300:

[Vracer111]

Don't take that song I linked as a demo...I probably shouldn't have linked to it because its practically nothing of quality unlike the actual CD track. That youtube video is pretty lousy quality actually. The actual CD track played through my DAC/amp is something else entirely...

I wear glasses...thin ones.

[Clipdat]

In case anyone else reading this thread doesn't know: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wife_acceptance_factor

[Vracer111]

Just hooked up the Bifrost to my HT system to test it out:

Laptop -> Schiit Bifrost AK4490 -> NAD T747 receiever (used as a preamp only, direct analog through from the Bifrost) ->NAD C 275BEE 2 channel amp (THD 0.008%, +/- 0.1dB frequency response 20Hz-20kHz, and S/N ratio of 123dB) -> the front Polk RTi A5 speakers (35Hz - 27kHz frequency range) ....

I wish movies sounded as good on my HT system.... speakers are beautifully singing thanks to the Bifrost and the absolutely spectacular C 275BEE speaker amp. So clean, so TIGHT, MUCH DYNAMICS, MUCH BASS! WOW!
LOL

Currently streaming (checking out albums on bandcamp) and having a blast listening. This track was just on:

http://store.vocallective.net/track/edge

[Clipdat]

Nice! Love my NAD C316BEE!

Originally Posted by Vracer111

Just hooked up the Bifrost to my HT system to test it out:

Laptop -> Schiit Bifrost 4490 -> NAD T747 receiever (used as a preamp only, direct analog through from the Bifrost) ->NAD C 275BEE 2 channel amp -> the front Polk RTi A5 speakers (35Hz - 27kHz frequency range) ....

I wish movies sounded as good on my HT system.... speakers are beautifully singing thanks to the Bifrost and the spectacular NAD C 275BEE speaker amp (THD 0.008%, +/- 0.1dB frequency response, and S/N ratio of 123dB). So clean, so TIGHT, MUCH DYNAMICS, MUCH BASS!

Currently streaming (checking out albums) this and having a blast listening:

http://store.vocallective.net/track/edge

[Vracer111]

Originally Posted by Clipdat

Nice! Love my NAD C316BEE!

YAY for NAD amps!

Right now I'm dissapointed in their HT receivers though.... can't believe how great the Schiit Bifrost paired with the C 275BEE sounds - absolutely stunning! Have a Josh Groban CD in the laptop now and I have NEVER heard it sound so good. The T747 receiver has never been able to get the C 275BEE to sound this good on its own ... it's so lacking in dynamics, detail, and impact in comparison

Would love to get a high end dedicated surround sound preprocessor .... so much money though! Guess I can only have my music sound like it should by bypassing the NAD processing and using a stand alone DAC through the analogs... would really like the HD audio tracks on Blu-ray movies to sound good too ...

[Clipdat]

Hm, you might consider upgrading to a Marantz SR6011/SR7011 or even an Anthem MRX720/MRX1120.

Originally Posted by Vracer111

YAY for NAD amps!

Right now I'm dissapointed in their HT receivers though.... can't believe how great the Schiit Bifrost paired with the C 275BEE sounds - absolutely stunning! Have a Josh Groban CD in the laptop now and I have NEVER heard it sound so good. The T747 receiver has never been able to get the C 275BEE to sound this good on its own ... it's so lacking in dynamics, detail, and impact in comparison

Would love to get a high end dedicated surround sound preprocessor .... so much money though! Guess I can only have my music sound like it should by bypassing the NAD processing and using a stand alone DAC through the analogs... would really like the HD audio tracks on Blu-ray movies to sound good too ...