BRZ vs Cayman/Corvette

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

I do wish the Cayman wasn't as isolated as it is, but the 987 is far less isolated than the 981. And it's not isolated where it counts, with steering wheel feedback.

Really the only mod I'm desperate to perform on my car is a more free flowing exhaust with a louder, more exotic engine note.

I sat in a friend's 987.1 Cayman S at an autox, and I felt like the comfort/handling was essentially the same as the 981. The 981's interior is more luxurious though, so you feel a bit more coddled, despite the car giving off an equally audible growl from the engine.

If I were "forced" to drive a 981 (hehe), I would probably take a look at the suspension geometry and open up the power steering unit to see what I can do to make the steering a bit better, when the warranty is up. Hopefully it's just a software change?

[WolfpackS2k]

To improve the 981's steering? I don't know. The 981 has an EPS unit, while the 987 is hydraulic.

The 981 is a larger vehicle with a longer wheelbase. It's handling only trumps the 987 if you equip it with the torque vectoring LSD.

[WolfpackS2k]

To improve the 981's steering? I don't know. The 981 has an EPS unit, while the 987 is hydraulic.

The 981 is a larger vehicle with a longer wheelbase. It's handling only trumps the 987 if you equip it with the torque vectoring LSD.

[brzaapi]

The feedback to the driver is very different from 987 to 981. In fact its the chief complaint from 987 owners deciding to move up to the 981. And yes the 981 is bigger and feels it.

So although they may both feel refined at a similar level while riding around. The 987 offers a much more raw experience to the driver while on the track.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

To improve the 981's steering? I don't know. The 981 has an EPS unit, while the 987 is hydraulic.

The 981 is a larger vehicle with a longer wheelbase. It's handling only trumps the 987 if you equip it with the torque vectoring LSD.

Improve it by loading the GT3 steering software, if someone will ever figure that out or if Porsche will ever agree to do it for you. If that's not possible, tear into the motor and physically modify to reduce assist.

But yea, the longer wheelbase is part of it too.

[MarkR171]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I also have this feeling like I would like a Alfa 4C more than a Cayman before driving both.

So... I drove both. As well as autocrossing a 600whp 997 turbo and driving a friends 991 GT3. You can see what I bought.

I also prefer the 987 to the 981 because of size and feel. The 981 is a great car, but the 987 just feels better and fits better for me. I had decided to find a 2012 Cayman R, and found a decent deal on a silver one 150 miles away from me... then saw the shift linkage had been changed three times in the past year, so I decided not to take the chance on it.

That's when I had a change of heart. The Caymans, while absolutely brilliant cars, are just better FRS/BRZs. The feel and drive is similar, but dialed up. The 4C on the other hand, doesn't feel like a regular sports car - it feels more exotic. The Cayman is a better car objectively. The 4C feels more special subjectively. The Alfa is also a lot more ridiculous - hood that doesn't open, requiring bespoke funnels to fill the brake fluid or washer fluid... Subpar speakers, no sound insulation (3k-3.5k rpm drone)... and not the greatest albeit livable rear visibility. And loud. Windows down, driving downtown you can hear the car echoing off the buildings. My old SLK55 AMG with a secondary cat delete and x-pipe was quiet in comparison driving around town.

All that being said, I just noticed the SCCA bumped the 987.1 Cayman S and 987.2 base Cayman down from A-Street to B-Street class. My FR-S just had a short block replaced under warranty and has me hesitant to compete with it this year. A 987.1 Cayman S with an extended warranty may be in my future, alongside the Alfa.

[MarkR171]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Improve it by loading the GT3 steering software, if someone will ever figure that out or if Porsche will ever agree to do it for you. If that's not possible, tear into the motor and physically modify to reduce assist.

But yea, the longer wheelbase is part of it too.

I drove a 2015 911 GT3. Wasn't all that impressed by it. Good car, but unless you're going to compete in a specific class... not worth spending more for it. 911 GTS or probably even Cayman GTS is just as good for the road.

[prj3ctm4yh3m]

Originally Posted by MarkR171

So... I drove both. As well as autocrossing a 600whp 997 turbo and driving a friends 991 GT3. You can see what I bought.

I also prefer the 987 to the 981 because of size and feel. The 981 is a great car, but the 987 just feels better and fits better for me. I had decided to find a 2012 Cayman R, and found a decent deal on a silver one 150 miles away from me... then saw the shift linkage had been changed three times in the past year, so I decided not to take the chance on it.

That's when I had a change of heart. The Caymans, while absolutely brilliant cars, are just better FRS/BRZs. The feel and drive is similar, but dialed up. The 4C on the other hand, doesn't feel like a regular sports car - it feels more exotic. The Cayman is a better car objectively. The 4C feels more special subjectively. The Alfa is also a lot more ridiculous - hood that doesn't open, requiring bespoke funnels to fill the brake fluid or washer fluid... Subpar speakers, no sound insulation (3k-3.5k rpm drone)... and not the greatest albeit livable rear visibility. And loud. Windows down, driving downtown you can hear the car echoing off the buildings. My old SLK55 AMG with a secondary cat delete and x-pipe was quiet in comparison driving around town.

All that being said, I just noticed the SCCA bumped the 987.1 Cayman S and 987.2 base Cayman down from A-Street to B-Street class. My FR-S just had a short block replaced under warranty and has me hesitant to compete with it this year. A 987.1 Cayman S with an extended warranty may be in my future, alongside the Alfa.

honestly, even the 987.2 feels almost too insulated. 80 feels like 35. i dont know how ppl deal with the 981 numbed steering etc.

[Overdrive]

Originally Posted by prj3ctm4yh3m

honestly, even the 987.2 feels almost too insulated. 80 feels like 35. i dont know how ppl deal with the 981 numbed steering etc.

Despite not aging well and being "down on power" the same way the Twins are, the least insulated driving experience for the Boxster/Cayman line is the original and early 986. As it goes with most sport luxury things, people want more refinement for their money, so you get more sound deadening and start losing more of the sporty part of things. Electric steering has become a necessary evil in trying to squeeze out efficiency anywhere possible, but I think with time Porsche will figure out how to bring some road feel back to the steering rack. It's been their claim to fame for so long, it'd be a shame to lose it for good.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by MarkR171

I drove a 2015 911 GT3. Wasn't all that impressed by it. Good car, but unless you're going to compete in a specific class... not worth spending more for it. 911 GTS or probably even Cayman GTS is just as good for the road.

The engine note is really amazing at 9000rpm, but I guess there are easier ways to get that kind of great sound that cost less than 100k.

A great Porsche build IMO would be a very lightweight 986 build with a Honda J35 or Toyota 2GR swapped in. Since the crank can be placed lower with a V engine, the center of gravity height is kind of a wash. The 986 had a more nimble short wheelbase, but the M96 and M97 engines were not great.

Nice Alfa 4C. I have seen them at Sonoma Raceway and they look awesome. Not that it's within my budget, but the lack of M/T option was kind of a bummer.

I could probably stretch my finances to get a (used) Lotus, but I feel like for that kind of money the build quality is just unacceptable, and on top of that despite being advertised as track cars they do not really have the necessary reliability mods for track duty, so highly modified MR2 Spyder it was for me.

[Yardjass]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Nice Alfa 4C. I have seen them at Sonoma Raceway and they look awesome. Not that it's within my budget, but the lack of M/T option was kind of a bummer.

I am so glad the 4C doesn't come with a proper transmission and that the Porsches I like are out of my price range and that I absolutely despise the way that the rear of the C7 Corvette looks. Otherwise, I don't think I'd be able to resist buying one of them. My bank account would be a lot emptier, even more so because of those damned $2,000-$3000 personal property tax bills coming every year.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

The engine note is really amazing at 9000rpm, but I guess there are easier ways to get that kind of great sound that cost less than 100k.

Hah, $100,000? That'll buy you a 996 GT3 but not much else. Still a brilliant car, but if you want a new 991 GT3 you need at least 50% more money.

[Overdrive]

Uh....K. Not sure anyone was going for exact figures more so than just making a point.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

Hah, $100,000? That'll buy you a 996 GT3 but not much else. Still a brilliant car, but if you want a new 991 GT3 you need at least 50% more money.

I was referring to a 100k premium over a "normal" Porsche haha.