Help me with my short list

[mdm]

Looks like it's time to buy a new car. I have a list of requirements, I did some research online, and I am working on a short list to test-drive.

Obviously, members of this forum are all car-savvy, so I thought I'll ask for help and suggestions - maybe I missed an obvious candidate that matches my requirements. Just please don't post "don't bother with other cars, just buy a twin", I know that the opinion of most of you .

So here is the list of requirements

1. only new cars, available in the US, and nothing rare, i.e. dealerships, mechanics, parts should be relatively easy to find
2. a small-ish nimble car, mostly for 1-2 people, but I need at least minimal back seats as well and some trunk space. So some practicality is needed. 2 doors are fine though.
3. hatchback or coupe or similar preferred, not a sedan
4. around 200 hp
5. around $25k budget, hopefully not terribly expensive maintenance and repairs
6. must be AT, preferably discrete (not CVT), preferably with manual mode and paddle-shifters
7. reliable (as much as you can tell about a new car...)
8. there should be some fun factor, both in driving/handling and in design/looks (which is highly subjective of course)
9. very comfortable seats (again, subjective, test-drive will tell)
10. preferably a spare tire/donut not a repair kit
11. no convertibles, sun roof not required
12. gadgets such as start/stop button, automatic AC, heated seats, are OK but not needed. As much as I can, I'd avoid complex and fancy dash displays, basic tach/speedometer/fuel/temperature is fine.
13. I don't need AWD
14. must have rear view camera
15. most likely, it won't be modded or tracked, just a DD with some fun factor

My idiosyncrasies that I have to take into account: I tend to trust Asian manufacturers more than American. I could probably convince myself to buy a Ford, but GM or Chrysler... probably not. I also don't really like Subaru brand, I don't know why.

Also, my requirement of AT effectively eliminates some fun/more powerful versions of certain cars, like Focus ST or Fiesta ST (or Civic Si, if it was available).


The short list for now:

Mazda3 5-door sTouring (with 2.5L engine)

Mini Cooper S hardtop [though above the budget and I actually don't like the looks at all, but people say it drives very well, so I want to give it a try. Also, being owned by BMW, I expect maintenance to be expensive]

Nissan Juke SL or SV, FWD [even though CVT and no paddle shifters]

Veloster Turbo [even though no real spare tire]

2016 FRS or 2017 86 [probably above budget (maybe not if 2016?), practicality minimal]



Close, but did not make the list:

2-door VW GTI or regular Golf - I don't really know why, I just don't have warm feelings towards those . Also, budget.

Fiat 500 Abarth - at least from the outside it looks scaryingly small, don't like the looks. Also, Chrysler.

Any other suggestions, thoughts?

[strat61caster]

Your wishlist is literally what the GTI was designed for, go drive one. The new Civic might hit all your needs but it's Honda's first mass produced turbo so long term reliability is a question mark and I've got a buddy who's had nothing but headaches with his.

Edit: nvm new Civic is CVT.

I've spent significant time in a new Mini S built for autox, power is cheap on turbo cars but it's definitely built to be a 'fun' budget luxury car, not a sporty hot hatch with the way everything feels and responds.

Originally Posted by mdm

Fiat 500 Abarth - at least from the outside it looks scaryingly small, don't like the looks. Also, Chrysler.

The 500 Abarth was designed about 4 years before Fiat started moving to merge with Chrysler, it has as much to do with American engineering as a 2009 Corvette has to do with Italian engineering.

It's only marginally more practical than an 86. Either little hot hatches tickle your fancy or they don't, lots of downsides to the car for certain people, still the most fun on public roads I've had. With how they're depreciating I would be happy to pick one up as a cheap commuter before the decade is out.

[swarb]

What is wrong with a twin? I would base my choice on which direction you want to go, since it was your last car.

[mdm]

Originally Posted by swarb

What is wrong with a twin? I would base my choice on which direction you want to go, since it was your last car.

It wasn't!

[Teseo]

Miata

[swarb]

Originally Posted by mdm

It wasn't!

Why not another? You made the purchase years ago, it was right then, what has changed and why is it not "right" now?
Consider what you will gain or lose in comparison to a twin. Mostly storage space and loss of fun factor. Possibly some mpg and extra doors.

I also prefer Asian cars over American. German cars I like, but parts aren't cheap. Reliability has gone up from years ago, but I still don't trust them as much as a Japanese car. I would really need to love the car to own one. Or swap every few years.
I've driven a mini(older supecharged manual) and gti dsg(2014 older model).
-Mini felt like cross between my old 90's civic hatchback in size with the power delivery(torque) of a gti. Bmw tax on parts. Was very nimble. 4/5ths of a gti.
-Gti felt pretty impressive in power and I can't imagine the newer model. Dsg shifted lighting quick, brakes were good. Suspension felt very solid/firm, handling feel was good, felt like a more expensive(refined) car overall. The plaid seats killed it for me though.

Hyundai, what you gain in warranty, you lose in resale value. I sat it one and it felt cheap to me. I don't like hyundai.

Juke while it looks sporty, I would need to drive one. Higher seating could mean more comfort if you like sitting higher. Also probably more body roll. Looks...

Sat in a fiat 500, felt like 4/5ths of a mini cooper. I felt like a giant in it. Too tiny for my taste. Stay away from Chrysler.

Mazda 3, driven a 2006 sedan 2.5. Felt like like Japanese econobox trying to be German, firmer steering, suspension. Interior reminded me of a nissan. Zoom-zoom sporty feeling is definitely there. Newer ones are supposed to be better, and they get good reviews.

I'd choose the gti or the mazda 3(haven't driven) if I needed the space. WRX is also high on the list, cvt though. I'd probably get another twin or gti with extended warranty, possibly wrx(manual). In the two years I've had my car I've had a 3rd passenger once(for 5 minutes), and needed more storage space once.

[mdm]

Originally Posted by Teseo

Miata

Originally Posted by mdm

2. a small-ish nimble car, mostly for 1-2 people, but I need at least minimal back seats as well and some trunk space. So some practicality is needed. 2 doors are fine though.
11. no convertibles, sun roof not required

So, no Miata.

[mdm]

Originally Posted by swarb

Why not another? You made the purchase years ago, it was right then, what has changed and why is it not "right" now?

Sorry, I was unclear. I have never had a twin. I joined this forum not because I owned a twin, but I predicted it would be on my purchase list at a point, and I wanted to learn more about the car - from the users.

Despite the price and relatively low practicality, FR-S/86 is actually pretty high on the list. I joined this forum, but not a Veloster or Mazda forum, so that tells something.

Originally Posted by swarb

-Mini felt like cross between my old 90's civic hatchback in size with the power delivery(torque) of a gti. Bmw tax on parts. Was very nimble. 4/5ths of a gti.
-Gti felt pretty impressive in power and I can't imagine the newer model. Dsg shifted lighting quick, brakes were good. Suspension felt very solid/firm, handling feel was good, felt like a more expensive(refined) car overall. The plaid seats killed it for me though.

Thanks, I'll give the GTI a try, I think. I am worried a bit about parts/maintenance costs of VW (as well as mini/BMW), but you're right I should at least test-drive them.

Originally Posted by swarb

Hyundai, what you gain in warranty, you lose in resale value. I sat it one and it felt cheap to me. I don't like hyundai.

OK. I do not care so much about resale, I tend to drive cars so long that the resale value is minimal anyway. I was afraid it could feel cheap, but I won't know until I drive one. Warranty is tempting, but that's not enough. I sort of like the looks (of the turbo), they are exaggerated but in a good way IMO.

Originally Posted by swarb

Juke while it looks sporty, I would need to drive one. Higher seating could mean more comfort if you like sitting higher. Also probably more body roll.

Exactly my concerns: possible body roll, I probably wouldn't like sitting high. Plus CVT. Still there is something about the looks I really like. OK, I am weird.

Originally Posted by swarb

Sat in a fiat 500, felt like 4/5ths of a mini cooper. I felt like a giant in it. Too tiny for my taste. Stay away from Chrysler.

Mazda 3, driven a 2006 sedan 2.5. Felt like like Japanese econobox trying to be German, firmer steering, suspension. Interior reminded me of a nissan. Zoom-zoom sporty feeling is definitely there. Newer ones are supposed to be better, and they get good reviews.

I'd choose the gti or the mazda 3(haven't driven) if I needed the space. WRX is also high on the list, cvt though. I'd probably get another twin or gti with extended warranty, possibly wrx(manual). In the two years I've had my car I've had a 3rd passenger once(for 5 minutes), and needed more storage space once.

Thanks a lot.

[FX86]

370Z

[krayzie]

GTI is like rolling the dice with this:

5. around $25k budget, hopefully not terribly expensive maintenance and repairs

I've only driven the first iteration of the Mazda 3 both base and GT as rentals a decade ago. I remembered well this car was quite good actually.

If you don't want to deal with Direct Injection carbon build up then go with FRS/86.

[daiheadjai]

I was gonna say, your list practically reads like the Toyobaru brochure/marketing presentation.
You may want to consider testing a Genesis Coupe (well, whatever's still left).

Fiesta ST? Focus ST?

[mdm]

Originally Posted by FX86

370Z

32k MSRP with AT.

[mdm]

Originally Posted by daiheadjai

I was gonna say, your list practically reads like the Toyobaru brochure/marketing presentation.

Originally Posted by daiheadjai

You may want to consider testing a Genesis Coupe (well, whatever's still left).

Hm, 29k MSRP with AT and I don't like very much how it looks. But maybe I'll give it a try when I go test-drive the Veloster.

Originally Posted by daiheadjai

Fiesta ST? Focus ST?

These only come in MT. I want AT.

[FX86]

Originally Posted by mdm

32k MSRP with AT.

what's wrong with slightly used?