How often do you turn off TCS?

[Ultramaroon]

Originally Posted by pfaffendorn

I have felt and heard some grumbly vibration in the back until the car is thoroughly warmed up, more noticeable when pulling around a sharp corner from a stop.

You are describing the function of a healthy limited slip differential. You want that.

[justatroll]

Originally Posted by CCJ

It's a miracle that people managed to keep cars on the roads in the 60's and 70's.

I've come closer to spinning my FR-S with all the aids on than with them all off. It's now always push and hold for street, pedal dance for autocross.

How would you know?
If the aids are on, you almost CANT spin it.
If the aids are off, how do you know you "were close" if you didn't actually spin it?


My TCS has saved my ass more than once on the street, but don't recall a single time it has gotten me in trouble.


Perfect example:
I was getting on the highway on a cloverleaf that I was not that familiar with, but there was no one in front or behind me.
So I am taking the curve at about absolute max traction.
JUST AS the clover leaf joins the highway there is a sudden decreasing radius 'jolt' to the right.
I immediately think 'SHIT' as I see other cars in the next lane over on the highway.
I had no choice but to try to adjust to the abrupt decreasing radius when the TCS & VSC lights blink furiously and I end up straight in the merge lane (where I was supposed to be).
I am certain that without the TCS stepping in, I would have spun it into that next lane over.


The only times I have had the car nearly stop when trying to jump out into fast moving traffic was when the car hit a small bump (assuming briefly lifting one wheel) and you can feel the car hesitate for a second.
I am not sure if that was the VSC or the electronic DIFF that caused that.
If it was the E-Diff, then disabling VSC & TC with the 3 second button press will NOT change the behavior.


Another thing to keep in mind for all of you who think "I can drive better than the nannies can":
So the HUMAN DRIVER can apply just one of the 4 brakes if they want to? No?
Didn't think so, but the nannies CAN.

[CCJ]

Originally Posted by justatroll

How would you know?
If the aids are on, you almost CANT spin it.
If the aids are off, how do you know you "were close" if you didn't actually spin it?

My TCS has saved my ass more than once on the street, but don't recall a single time it has gotten me in trouble.


Perfect example:
I was getting on the highway on a cloverleaf that I was not that familiar with, but there was no one in front or behind me.
So I am taking the curve at about absolute max traction.
JUST AS the clover leaf joins the highway there is a sudden decreasing radius 'jolt' to the right.
I immediately think 'SHIT' as I see other cars in the next lane over on the highway.
I had no choice but to try to adjust to the abrupt decreasing radius when the TCS & VSC lights blink furiously and I end up straight in the merge lane (where I was supposed to be).
I am certain that without the TCS stepping in, I would have spun it into that next lane over.


The only times I have had the car nearly stop when trying to jump out into fast moving traffic was when the car hit a small bump (assuming briefly lifting one wheel) and you can feel the car hesitate for a second.
I am not sure if that was the VSC or the electronic DIFF that caused that.
If it was the E-Diff, then disabling VSC & TC with the 3 second button press will NOT change the behavior.


Another thing to keep in mind for all of you who think "I can drive better than the nannies can":
So the HUMAN DRIVER can apply just one of the 4 brakes if they want to? No?
Didn't think so, but the nannies CAN.

Fine, your anecdotal evidence contradicts mine. Like I said previously, it's a miracle people got any where safely before the invention of these miraculous, Darwin defying nannies. Which merely react to and make an educated guess at what the driver is attempting to make happen. I'd rather have that control myself. YMMV. IANAL. OMGWTFBBQ!!!

[justatroll]

Originally Posted by CCJ

Fine, your anecdotal evidence contradicts mine. Like I said previously, it's a miracle people got any where safely before the invention of these miraculous, Darwin defying nannies. Which merely react to and make an educated guess at what the driver is attempting to make happen. I'd rather have that control myself. YMMV. IANAL. OMGWTFBBQ!!!

People were able to commute to work before there were such things as seatbelts too. Is that a sufficient argument to say that we should not use them now? I mean they are kind of a pain in the ass...
And those air bag things have been known to kill you!

[wreckedrex]

Originally Posted by CCJ

It's a miracle that people managed to keep cars on the roads in the 60's and 70's.

I've come closer to spinning my FR-S with all the aids on than with them all off. It's now always push and hold for street, pedal dance for autocross.

And the 80's and the 90's and the 00's... This is the first car I've had with all the TCS/vsc stuff, and they sorta suck. The nannies kick in pretty early even in "sport" mode, and they are not subtle about it. That said I tend to leave it alone. Used to hold the button for 5 every time I started the car, but anymore I'm to lazy and the lights on the dash bug me.

[Xxyion]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

You are describing the function of a healthy limited slip differential. You WANT that.

Interesting. I always got that too and i thought maybe i just wasnt giving it the proper amount of clutch or gas and have been working on getting rid of that for like 5 years lol. Show's how much i actually know about cars. But glad to know its not me being bad at driving skill and something that the car should be doing.

[Xxyion]

Originally Posted by wreckedrex

And the 80's and the 90's and the 00's... This is the first car I've had with all the TCS/vsc stuff, and they sorta suck. The nannies kick in pretty early even in "sport" mode, and they are not subtle about it. That said I tend to leave it alone. Used to hold the button for 5 every time I started the car, but anymore I'm to lazy and the lights on the dash bug me.

I am curious about this. A lot of people talk about the hold for 5. I dont really know what that means.

Disclaimer: I dont drive with any of my nannies off ever

When i do decide to turn them off (really just to see the lights come on) i press the button once and the light turns on in the dash telling me that my VSC is off. Now i do have a 2016. Does my model no longer need me to push the button for 5 seconds?

I also ask because i want to get into autocross eventually and i figured i should know some of this.

[everythingsablur]

Originally Posted by Xxyion

I am curious about this. A lot of people talk about the hold for 5. I dont really know what that means.

Simply pushing the button doesn't really disable it. If you get the car into a really dangerous situation, all the nannies will pop back on to try to save the car. Holding the button for 5 seconds disables TC/VSC more, be even still, not entirely. That's why you see reference to the "pedal dance" or aftermarket nanny disablers which simulate the pedal dance to fully shut off TC/VSC.

Personally, I leave them all on for daily driving/commuting, but I've had the car for a week. I'm still readjusting to RWD (it's been like 20 years since my last RWD, and that was FAR from a sporty car), but there are a couple of clear corners pulling into the office that I'm starting to get brave with and flick it into VSC Sport for, but haven't felt anything seriously kick in. Guess I should push it harder?

Will probably look into a proper track day to really understand the limits of the car in a safe (relatively speaking) environment.

[Xxyion]

Originally Posted by everythingsablur

Simply pushing the button doesn't really disable it. If you get the car into a really dangerous situation, all the nannies will pop back on to try to save the car. Holding the button for 5 seconds disables TC/VSC more, be even still, not entirely. That's why you see reference to the "pedal dance" or aftermarket nanny disablers which simulate the pedal dance to fully shut off TC/VSC.

Personally, I leave them all on for daily driving/commuting, but I've had the car for a week. I'm still readjusting to RWD (it's been like 20 years since my last RWD, and that was FAR from a sporty car), but there are a couple of clear corners pulling into the office that I'm starting to get brave with and flick it into VSC Sport for, but haven't felt anything seriously kick in. Guess I should push it harder?

Will probably look into a proper track day to really understand the limits of the car in a safe (relatively speaking) environment.

Interesting, is there anything telling you that you've successfully turned it off..."more"?

[justatroll]

Originally Posted by Xxyion

Interesting, is there anything telling you that you've successfully turned it off..."more"?

If you press the Left button for >5 seconds at any speed, both dash lights will come on solid and stay that way.
That is the most 'disabled' you can get without the pedal dance or pulling the ABS fuse.
In this state, you still have ABS and Electronic Differential active, but no Vehicle Stability Control or Traction Control.
If you let the car slide around some the lights may still flash at you.
If you lift a wheel completely off the ground or spin the car on the ice, there is some discussion about the system re-enabling itself, but that is not proven.

[andrewtgg]

Originally Posted by gravitylover

I usually leave it full on and rarely have the nanny kick in but when it does it's usually due to bad pavement or something like that and it can cause serious problems. Changing lanes or turning and having power get cut or worse having the brakes apply themselves has nearly caused me to get rear ended.

How do you manage to get the power cut just changing lanes? I've read a couple people saying that has happened to them, but it has never happened to me before.

[justatroll]

Originally Posted by andrewtgg

How do you manage to get the power cut just changing lanes? I've read a couple people saying that has happened to them, but it has never happened to me before.

see: asshat

[CCJ]

Originally Posted by justatroll

People were able to commute to work before there were such things as seatbelts too. Is that a sufficient argument to say that we should not use them now? I mean they are kind of a pain in the ass...
And those air bag things have been known to kill you!

Seatbelts and airbags don't fuck the car while in motion. Your argument is invalid.

I'm not saying that nannies are useless, I'm sure they have kept many people from their well deserved Darwin awards. I'm just saying that they aren't always better than being in full control of the car. The driver of the car is a huge factor.

Originally Posted by Xxyion

Interesting, is there anything telling you that you've successfully turned it off..."more"?

Yes. But justatroll doesn't really answer that for you,

Originally Posted by justatroll

If you press the Left button for >5 seconds at any speed, both dash lights will come on solid and stay that way.
That is the most 'disabled' you can get without the pedal dance or pulling the ABS fuse.
In this state, you still have ABS and Electronic Differential active, but no Vehicle Stability Control or Traction Control.
If you let the car slide around some the lights may still flash at you.
If you lift a wheel completely off the ground or spin the car on the ice, there is some discussion about the system re-enabling itself, but that is not proven.

so let me try. Both lights come on, same as the push and hold method, except that after the pedal dance pushing either button will not turn the dash lights off. The only way to turn things back on is to restart the car.

[pfaffendorn]

Originally Posted by Ultramaroon

You are describing the function of a healthy limited slip differential. You WANT that.

Thanks for the reassurance. I've been driving the car only seven months, so some things are still new to me. The noise in the rear started out almost undetectable, and has become louder over time, which made me suspicious. The next service isn't too far off -- I'll relax for now and have it looked at when the time comes.