Idle issue?

[eriktherod]

I feel like most people are overreacting to the way the engine works. It's a great engineering feat between Subaru and Toyota, I'm sure they've spent thousands of man-hours of development and testing. I don't think this is a production issue.

The very few, handful of people who have stalls and actual problems need to get their's looked at by the dealer, but for the rest of us it shouldn't be seen as a problem.

Stu, I have noticed that same issue as well. Seems like it's part of the ECU doing some kind of calibration or balancing act.

[Tomzilla]

Originally Posted by F1point4

That is pretty much spot on for what my car does. Except I can only produce if I'm stopping starting around 45-50mph in neutral.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but I don't believe it's advisable to throw it into neutral at this speed. (I realize this has nothing to do with the idle issue, but just looking out for a fella) Say if you needed to perform some sort of evasive maneuver while at this speed in neutral; it's going to be more difficult to do so. That and I don't know it's very friendly on the clutch to try and engage a gear starting from neutral at a higher speed.

My 2 cents, that should be taken with a pinch of salt.

[synchromesh]

I took my car(600km) in to the dealership today because I was having idle problems that noticed last week. Yesterday was at its worst. Stopped at a red light and the idle was loping between 400-1100 rpm in neutral. At below 500rpm it feels and sounds like the car is going to stall.

Today the problem went away and the mechanic told me to come back again if the problem happens again. Spoke with the sales rep and he told me he was familiar with this thread and will let me know if there is a bulletin for this problem.

[F1point4]

Originally Posted by Tomzilla

Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, but I don't believe it's advisable to throw it into neutral at this speed. (I realize this has nothing to do with the idle issue, but just looking out for a fella) Say if you needed to perform some sort of evasive maneuver while at this speed in neutral; it's going to be more difficult to do so. That and I don't know it's very friendly on the clutch to try and engage a gear starting from neutral at a higher speed.

My 2 cents, that should be taken with a pinch of salt.

Thank you for the feedback. Totally agree that its much more difficult for an evasive maneuver. However, I was advised to do this for gas savings by drivers who been driving manuals for decades [New manual gearbox driver here].

For reengaging a gear from neutral at speed, the same people said if I'm going 30, put it in 3rd. 40 put it in 4th, etc. I try to rev match to make it smooth. I have no idea if this is even a best practice.

[F1point4]

Took my car to the dealership today. Demanded that I be present in the car when the tech takes it for a test drive. To my surprise I ended up driving the technician and repeatedly demonstrating the issue to him. He acknowledged the existence of the noise but wasn't sure what the issue was so he got the foreman involved.

I asked this technician about the high pitch chirping and he is fairly sure it is the Direct Injection system.

After a few calls to Gulf States Toyota (I think this is a regional distributor) and California, they still weren't sure what the noise was. Gulf States said they wanted the Foreman to bring the car over to listen to it. After the foreman and I went for another drive to get synced up on issue and noise in question, I hesitantly agreed to let him bring it over there. Overall I think they will put 80+ miles on the car before I get it back

Just got an update, they had another FR-S to compare it to. In the other vehicle they got the same noise to occur, but it happened much more quietly. They said you really had to listen for the noise. In my car it was much more pronounced. Ultimately they are convinced it was something in my transmission, heard something along the lines of "harmonic balancer". They recorded video, documented the issue and sent it to engineers in California. They deemed the car safe to drive and said there isn't an impact on reliability so I'm getting the car back tomorrow. They aren't sure but they are researching the issue.

I'll continue to touch base with them and get updates. They told me if anything had to be done it'll be covered under warranty.







For anyone who wants to hear this flutter engine noise I'm hearing you can do it two ways. Get the car warmed up first. Roll up your windows. Turn off the radio. Now either

1) get the car up to around 50mph in 5th or 6th gear. When its safe, put it in neutral and brake all the way to 0 with regular pressure like you are doing a normal stop. For me, right around 20mph you'll see the RPM dip and the engine make the flutter/sputter noise.

2) Get the car up to speed, around 45mph. When its safe, put it in neutral and let the car coast and slow down on its own. The Foreman was able to repeatedly hear the sound when it passed 36-38mph.

[mark7s4]

Originally Posted by whiteout fr-s

Ok so official word from the Toyota rep is that the VVTR control valve and Cam valve are bad. Unfortunately for me and the rest of you experiencing this problem the parts won't be available until sometime next month so my car will be sitting at the dealership until then. They also advised me that any of you having this issue should not continue to drive your vehicles until taking them into the dealership.

At least we have an answer, to bad it wasn't a simple one.

I have an update.

It looks like I'm having a similar issue to above. My check engine light went off and gave the P0019 code. This code is given if the exhaust camshaft position has slipped from the threshold for 5 seconds for the bank 2 camshaft sensor. I believe it has to happen twice for the code to be given. The dealer believes that it can either be the sensor itself or the camshaft timing gear assembly. I believe it can also be the camshaft timing oil control valve like "whiteout_frs's" car. What they did was to swap camshaft position sensors on either side of the engine to see if the code would come up on the other side. Their rationale is that if it does then it's the sensor that is bad. If the code comes up on the same side then it's either the control valve or the gear assembly. They drove the car around 50 miles or so and (of course) nothing happened. So now I have the car back to drive it around until the "event" happens again.

This wasn't the experience I had in mind when I won the First 86 contest. lol

[Northside]

Originally Posted by ahausheer

. . . Almost like an intermittent vacuum leak or faulty idle control valve or worse. At idle the tack should not be jumping that much. . .

I agree. The symptoms of the idle dip, struggle not to stall and the 1000-rpm recovery described seem to indicate an intermittent vacuum leak from a dodgy idle air control valve, MAF sensor or any other air sensor it may have or leaky vacuum hose.

Had the same symptoms with the idle of my older car. Changed the idle air control valve. Solved the problem.

[csaba]

Originally Posted by mark7s4

I have an update.

It looks like I'm having a similar issue to above. My check engine light went off and gave the P0019 code. This code is given if the exhaust camshaft position has slipped from the threshold for 5 seconds for the bank 2 camshaft sensor. I believe it has to happen twice for the code to be given. The dealer believes that it can either be the sensor itself or the camshaft timing gear assembly. I believe it can also be the camshaft timing oil control valve like "whiteout_frs's" car. What they did was to swap camshaft position sensors on either side of the engine to see if the code would come up on the other side. Their rationale is that if it does then it's the sensor that is bad. If the code comes up on the same side then it's either the control valve or the gear assembly. They drove the car around 50 miles or so and (of course) nothing happened. So now I have the car back to drive it around until the "event" happens again.

This wasn't e experience I had in mind when I won the First 86 contest. lol

Sorry to hear that I really hope they find the problem really soon !!

[davisk6]

Originally Posted by F1point4

Thank you for the feedback. Totally agree that its much more difficult for an evasive maneuver. However, I was advised to do this for gas savings by drivers who been driving manuals for decades [New manual gearbox driver here].

This is actually incorrect. When in gear, the engine will go into vacuum, using zero fuel, as the rotating mass of the transmission keeps the crank moving. When in neutral, the car is at idle, therefore, the throttle must open and fuel is used to keep the car from stalling.

http://www.ehow.com/facts_7594902_co...-save-gas.html

[Toy86]

Originally Posted by davisk6

This is actually incorrect. When in gear, the engine will go into vacuum, using zero fuel, as the rotating mass of the transmission keeps the crank moving. When in neutral, the car is at idle, therefore, the throttle must open and fuel is used to keep the car from stalling.

http://www.ehow.com/facts_7594902_co...-save-gas.html

CORRECT!

[F1point4]

Thanks to both of y'all for clearing that up. Much appreciated.

[djjd42]

And as a bit of trivia: it is illegal in some jurisdictions to be in neutral at speed, aside during shifting, of course.

[Bristecom]

Originally Posted by djjd42

And as a bit of trivia: it is illegal in some jurisdictions to be in neutral at speed, aside during shifting, of course.

Yes. And it annoys me when people do this. I mean, yeah, it lets you coast a little bit better but if you remain in gear, you don't use any fuel and can accelerate immediately if needed.

[Hanzo]

I have notice the same thing dip in RPM during idle after it's warmed up. I have 1040 miles on it.