Scion iM

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by reni

Really don't get the logic behind buying/leasing another car to be a daily driver for a twin just to avoid putting miles on it... it's not like it's some rare collectable. More fun and cheaper to just drive it.

I'd like a beater car (something that I can just have liability on) since in two years, I've put on 42k miles on my FR-S.

[perryair]

Originally Posted by reni

Really don't get the logic behind buying/leasing another car to be a daily driver for a twin just to avoid putting miles on it... it's not like it's some rare collectable. More fun and cheaper to just drive it.

my need for a dd is cause i help run a restaurant company and routinely have to bring cases of food and/or shuttle people here and there. as great as my brz is it aint any kind of hauler wih utility. it was always meant to be something i could treat myself to enjoying drives in my off time.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

Yes, it's the valvematic engine, but it's not the lift you're thinking of, like that of the 2ZZ.

Heh, I've been following Valvematic nearly since the patents were filed years ago.

The Nissan VQ37VHR, and every single BMW engine today has a similar system, it's great for fuel efficiency and response (throttle always wide open, no manifold vacuum), but the extra valvetrain mass is not very suited for high rpm.

The 2ZR doesn't really have high flow ports so this is the best valve system for it. Honda's triple VTEC approach is perhaps better for a high performance engine.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Heh, I've been following Valvematic nearly since the patents were filed years ago.

The Nissan VQ37VHR, and every single BMW engine today has a similar system, it's great for fuel efficiency and response (throttle always wide open, no manifold vacuum), but the extra valvetrain mass is not very suited for high rpm.

The 2ZR doesn't really have high flow ports so this is the best valve system for it. Honda's triple VTEC approach is perhaps better for a high performance engine.

I actually never heard of it until I started working at a Toyota dealership. lol. Kinda don't like how you lose torque tho (not sure how the torque curve is affected).

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

I actually never heard of it until I started working at a Toyota dealership. lol. Kinda don't like how you lose torque tho (not sure how the torque curve is affected).

"Lose"

It's a negligible loss (2 ft-lb), and the very low rpm torque is definitely better (I'm saying this without having seen a dyno chart though). The reason is because Valvematic starts with a higher duration cam and cuts duration and lift together. The non-Valvematic engines have fixed cam profiles that's a compromise between low end and top end, which performs very strong in the midrange.

The Valvematic engine had higher horsepower because at high rpm it uses the full lift profile of the cam, but at lower rpm the optimal duration is lower, and the only way to get lower duration is to also lose lift.

The plus is that at low engine speeds, the Valvematic engine should have lower lift, which will help combustion by speeding up the intake charge, producing more torque, possibly.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

"Lose"

It's a negligible loss (2 ft-lb), and the very low rpm torque is definitely better (I'm saying this without having seen a dyno chart though). The reason is because Valvematic starts with a higher duration cam and cuts duration and lift together. The non-Valvematic engines have fixed cam profiles that's a compromise between low end and top end, which performs very strong in the midrange.

The Valvematic engine had higher horsepower because at high rpm it uses the full lift profile of the cam, but at lower rpm the optimal duration is lower, and the only way to get lower duration is to also lose lift.

The plus is that at low engine speeds, the Valvematic engine should have lower lift, which will help combustion by speeding up the intake charge, producing more torque, possibly.

Peak torque is reached 400 rpm lower with the FAE compared to the FE. However, I didn't really get a chance to test out the LE ECO Plus compared to the LE Plus as my dealership doesn't really sell the LE ECO models (so we don't get them often). I don't want to compare it to the iM since it wouldn't be a fair comparison.

I'd much rather have a more usable curve than peak numbers.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by Kaotic Lazagna

I'd much rather have a more usable curve than peak numbers.

Yep.

Here we go:


3ZR is a little bigger but they're basically identical to the 2ZR, liter for liter. As you can see, more torque below 2000rpm.

Ferrari has a similar thing except it has cams that have a varying grind along its length that they slide around. That's more optimized for torque/power and not efficiency, and they also have a much bigger cam to start with to produce power at 9000rpm, but it really improves the performance over a big range.

[Kaotic Lazagna]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Yep.

Here we go:


3ZR is a little bigger but they're basically identical to the 2ZR, liter for liter. As you can see, more torque below 2000rpm.

If the 2ZR basically follows that, that's definitely a better choice for daily driving.

[DAEMANO]

Originally Posted by perryair

i just leased a scion im as a daily to replace my old civic (RIP). i looked around at quite a few things but with scion pushing an extremely good lease deal i just couldnt pass it up. i'm out the door with tax and the bespoke navigation addition $232 a month for a 15k lease.

theres not another car that you're gonna get at that price that doesnt look either tiny as hell or as the poverty spec version of a nice car. the hatch design gives it plenty of storage and room to bring things, its not fast but looks sporty and is comfortable with nice touches like padded kneerests on both sides and an armrest stock (THANKS FOR NOTHING SUBARU)

plus, it lets me save the BRZ for fun drives and keeps it from accumulating tons and tons of miles. a win win!

Saw a black iM right behind a black Mazda3 hatch. Granted the iM is newer, but it looked quite a bit more modern and sophisticated and even upscale than the 3. TBH, I was surprised, but really shouldn't have been. Nice looking car. Especially for the price and configuration.

[perryair]

Originally Posted by DAEMANO

Saw a black iM right behind a black Mazda3 hatch. Granted the iM is newer, but it looked quite a bit more modern and sophisticated and even upscale than the 3. TBH, I was surprised, but really shouldn't have been. Nice looking car. Especially for the price and configuration.

all the autojournos drool over the mazda 3 but honestly unless you pony up for the grand touring model or higher, you're gonna have less features than an im and also its gonna look like the 'cheap' version of the car. but at that point you're almost to 25k for it. i'm fine to have something that looks nice and is comfy for dailying.

[Sasquachulator]

Yes I know its not an 86, not and FRS, not a BRZ. As much as I have been waiting to pull the trigger on one of those, numerous factors (cost, practicality and reliability are the 3 main factors) pushed me in this direction so i'll have to wait out for my sportscar for a little longer.

Anyways thought i'd give a quick impression. Pretty sure everyone knows what these cars are all about: they're practically Corolla hatchbacks (didn't officially get named Corolla until 2017) but with independent rear suspension, so they're apparently quite a bit more fun to drive than your vanilla Corolla.

Power: Its an econobox.......and it has enough power. I did not feel like it was underpowered (that might change the more I drive it) and its obviously no rocketship. I think the only time i'd probably yearn for more power is on the highway overtaking a semi or something. The feeling of urgent thrust isn't going to be there (In my old Honda fit, I would redline it (CVT sport mode) to pass and it did not feel like I had 130hp, there just wasn't any urgency). Oh, and NO TORQUE DIP :P!!!! Then again theres no torque to begin with....lol

Steering: Steering feel is...OK. Its pretty light, yet at the same time seems very accurate. Kind of a weird feeling when combined with the handling. But that's OK. Would prefer more steering heft though.

Shifter: Shifter is also light, not a lot of resistance. throws are I guess normal or long (I haven't driven enough varieties of shifter to know what would be considered long and what would be short). Im sure almost all sportier cars are shorter but its not like a semi truck. Im actually thinking its par for the course. The reviews indicate the clutch grab point is a bit high and its true...feels a little awkward at first but anyone driving a manual would get used to it. Would prefer it a little further down the pedal range though. Oh I don't care what anyone says about CVT/automatic vs Manual, manual is always more fun.

handling: Didn't really chuck it in the corners at speed but it did feel tight and planted when I did take a few turns. Im not sure what the limits are but I highly doubt i'll be looking for it. I'd agree with reviewers that this thing can handle much more power than given. Makes it fun and tossable. Its why I think the steering feels a bit weird given how light the steering is and how tight the car feels.

I don't think anyone can go wrong with this car especially for a preowned product. Its not equipped with the safety sense stuff (that came in 2017+) but don't care, don't need it.
Is it the best product out there? Probably not by a longshot, but its got the right combination of affordability, ride, handling, reliability, and cost of ownership.
Oh its a second car, its not replacing my X1.

[Kimsey47]

Just messing! Glad you got something you seem to be pleased with! I saw a new Corolla hatchback the other day and thought it looked pretty good. It seems that Toyota is ready to get out of their "beige" days and create some interesting looking cars. Hopefully they'll get some performance to match the looks.

[DarkPira7e]

Had one as a rental, actually a pretty stout car all around. The electronic e-brake had my pulling my hair out when trying to navigate during a snowstorm. Sometimes you just need the extra rotation on a FWD car, and the e-brake on that car locks the front wheels!!!!!!!!!!

I loved the ride in it, and it had plenty of power.

[daiheadjai]

Are there any shifter bushings or short shifter kits out there for the iM?
I put one in my 2008 Honda Fit (which already had a pretty decent stock shifter for an econobox) and it feels far better. I suspect bushings could do the job too.