learn me, getting motorcycle license

[tennisfreak]

Originally Posted by ButeraFRS

I don't know about where you live but here where I live people are pretty honest about the history of their bikes.

I dropped my bike once and let the buyer know before hand of the damage it had and the things that were fixed. As do most people

For a first time buyer I'd recommend buying used... the MSRPs on the 300s are ridiculous. Not only that but the low cc bikes for the most part hold their value. I bought my bike at 4250 and sold it 2 years later after thousands of kms for the same price.

The same goes for 300s and 250s. Buy them at a low price, learn on them for a year or 2, sell them and get a higher cc bike of your choice. Though some people like wringing out lower cc bikes.

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A quick search through Craigslist anywhere in the country will bring up a example of someone dishonest that is trying to pass of a bike that has been wrecked.
Heck in my motorcycle forums we have dedicated threads named "The Sh!t you see on Craigslist" because it happens so often.

As for buying used you are contradicting yourself. You say buy used because of the high price new then go on to say that the bikes hold their value so well you can sell it years later for the same price new.
If that is so why in the hell would I buy a used bike for the same price as a new?

I know for a fact (got an offer from a dealer) that I can buy a brand new 2015 Ninja 300 for $4000 OTD. That is a pretty dang good deal.
You just need to be a smart shopper and look for left over models from last year that never sold.
I just bought a brand new 2015 Kawi ZX-10R for $10586 OTD. This was from the same dealer I got the offer on the 300 from.

Maybe its personal preference but I stick to bikes new that are cheap. Be patient and you will find them.

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

As for buying used you are contradicting yourself. You say buy used because of the high price new then go on to say that the bikes hold their value so well you can sell it years later for the same price new.
If that is so why in the hell would I buy a used bike for the same price as a new?

My fault I wasn't clear. If you buy used the bikes wont depreciate and it will hold their value.

If you buy new, which for the most part is at MSRP or just under, your brand new ninja 300 will depreciate on the used market because that's just how the market is, people don't want to pay sticker price for a used low cc bike that they will most likely keep for a year or two... At least in my area.

Ie: This goof who is trying to sell a 2 year old ninja 300 at near sticker price of a 2015 http://www.kijiji.ca/v-sport-bikes/w...ationFlag=true

look at the date his ad was posted...

[Re_Invention]

Right on Freak - I managed to pick up a brand new 2014 Vstrom 1000 in crate on December 14th for $7,299 + TTL. It's a helluva bike and a steal for the money. I've only ever bought used up till then.

Motorcycles depreciate heavily because of buyers/lifestyle remorse. Folks want to get into it, realize riding can be stressful, then get out or leave toys in the garage to rot; then they sell. Stupid but take advantage of that. Although that is somewhat model dependent. I've found certain enthusiast models (like the VFR) can keep a stable price due to its cult following... Man, I love the VFR. Avoid anything salvage title. There are waaaay too many motorcycles for sale at any given time to 'settle' for a salvage title bike. Someone got their money from the insurance and was able to buy back pennies on the dollar - short of having a professional shop do a laser alignment on the frame, you will not know in your brief time with the bike if it'll be 'true' again. Why even risk it? Motorcycles are cheap enough that the market is accessible for anyone. You aren't searching for a clown shoe BMW or some ridiculous low-number specialty product. Keep looking and skip the salvage stuff.

Maintenance is significantly cheaper than cars, too. Search forums, youtube and google how to buy a used motorcycle - there's no excuse for ignorance in today's world. Get a basic set of metric (if you're going japanese) hand tools, invest in some stands and find a free service manual online. Bikes that have been sitting will likely need a tune-up, tires will be the most expensive part so budget for that or haggle.

Here's an ad that looks like it could lead to something:

http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/mcy/5449050063.html

'01 CBR600 F4i
It's fuel injected, which is great so you don't have to d*** around with jetting carbs. It's relatively modern in style with original or at least oem fairings. With its age and mileage I'd guess it's been either 'gingerly' used or put away wet regularly - at those miles and your experience level, doesn't matter much either way. Tires were replaced, great. I'd inquire to the title status, last service performed (valves, battery), how long it sits between rides (fuel). Show up with cash and negotiate down to $2,900 flat if everything checked out because christ it's been up for 2 months. Throw some handle bar risers, tank bag and extended windshield on that bad boy and you've got yourself a stew.

Some other bikes I highly recommend for beginners:

Kawasaki Ninja 650r (any year) - My wife has one, reliable parallel twin, easy power band, semi-standard riding position. $2,000-3,500 with under 20k miles all day long. Do an oil change, clean the chain and put on 5,000 miles before even thinking about checking the valves.

Suzuki SV650/S - reliable v-twin, accessible power with good torque, comfortable ergos, lots of aftermarket, easy to sell for someone looking for a race bike!

Yamaha FZ6 - I had one for a couple of years, it's an R6 inline 4 that's detuned for mid-range over peak hp. Very neutral bike, not a lot of character but VERY fast in the corners, has virtually no required upkeep and is damn easy to cover major distance with.

For cruisers - any metric (japanese) v-twin. Pick one, they're all good.

Kawasaki KLR650 - I've always had one in the garage up until the Suzi showed up. These are agricultural machines, think a tractor had sex with a dirt bike. They are awesome. Cheap to buy ($1,000-2,000) cheap to run, cheap to learn on. Just get the doohickey done, grab yourself a larger tank and you're set for the apocalypse.

Some stuff I'd avoid:
Anything with a 'cage'. Most suzuki supersports - they have an oil pickup point in the rear that makes them good candidates for stunters. Cool if you're into that but not so cool to inherit someone else's undisclosed stunt bike. Be weary of honda V four or flat six engines if this is your first bike - reliable if maintained, pain in the arse if not. If someone has had the motorcycle since new, like a '12 ninja 250r, verify all service records to match up with mileage. A poorly broke in bike will always be a poorly running bike.

[86 South Africa]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

My advice:

Unless you have a mechanic friend or someone that is very experienced with motorcycles avoid trying to buy used unless its from an authorized dealer. More people than not wreck their bikes and then turn around and sell them. You need to be very astute and know what your looking for when buying a used bike.

Your first comment is nonsense. I've bought many used bikes from private individuals with absolutely no issues.
I agree; buy with caution and make sure you get a test ride etc, but you can't tell the op second hand is not an option.

To be honest, with prices they way they are (here anyway) I can save 30-40% of a new price by buying something less than 1 year old! No brainer.



As for the Ducati Monster - I did some training with these bikes... they do not have a great seating position/ergonomics. Definitely better choices out there i.m.o. Ducati's are also not cheap to maintain.

[tennisfreak]

Originally Posted by Re_Invention

Yamaha FZ6 - I had one for a couple of years, it's an R6 inline 4 that's detuned for mid-range over peak hp. Very neutral bike, not a lot of character but VERY fast in the corners, has virtually no required upkeep and is damn easy to cover major distance with.

This is a absolutely great bike to get if you want a sport bike that is a little more suitable for beginners yet has more power than a 300 class bike.

[tennisfreak]

Originally Posted by 86 South Africa

Your first comment is nonsense. I've bought many used bikes from private individuals with absolutely no issues.
I agree; buy with caution and make sure you get a test ride etc, but you can't tell the op second hand is not an option.

To be honest, with prices they way they are (here anyway) I can save 30-40% of a new price by buying something less than 1 year old! No brainer.

Maybe you did read all of my posts and maybe my market is drastically different than yours but I just bought a brand new bike 1 mile on the ODO from a dealer with full warranty for well over 30% off MSRP.

2015 ZX-10R MSRP: $14299 (then think of fees like assembly, tax title license, etc.... to add on top of that price)
I paid, total final line item OTD: $10586

Like I said if you shop smart you can find new bikes cheap and dont need to buy used.

But you can find amazing deals used too.

Not knowing a lot about bikes will greatly increase your chances of getting screwed in the used market though.
Either get a used bike checked by a mechanic, or take someone who knows plenty about bikes to check it out, before you pay.

[86 South Africa]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Maybe you did read all of my posts and maybe my market is drastically different than yours but I just bought a brand new bike 1 mile on the ODO from a dealer with full warranty for well over 30% off MSRP.

2015 ZX-10R MSRP: $14299 (then think of fees like assembly, tax title license, etc.... to add on top of that price)
I paid, total final line item OTD: $10586

Like I said if you shop smart you can find new bikes cheap and dont need to buy used.

But you can find amazing deals used too.

Not knowing a lot about bikes will greatly increase your chances of getting screwed in the used market though.
Either get a used bike checked by a mechanic, or take someone who knows plenty about bikes to check it out, before you pay.

The post I responded to didn't sound like this one...
But that applies to anything in life. Don't know about cameras? Well you should get someone who does to help you buy that $10,000 Nikon off eBay then shouldn't you

Cars are no different, you can get totally abused ones both from dealers or private second hand sales.

[ZDan]

There is no reason to fear most carbureted motorcycles. Japanese ones, anyway... I've had my '00 SV650 forever, never any issues. Stock it is fine, if/when you mod it's easy to rejet. I did the snorkelectomy mod and got aftermarket dual exhaust and rejetted it myself with ~$10 worth of parts.

Carbed bikes I've owned over the years: '86 Radian, '75 CB550F, SV650, FZR400. I've had exactly ONE carburetor issue: last year at the track I suddenly lost a lot of power, like I was down a cylinder. I thought it was ignition related, but turns out some previous owner had taken the carbs apart and thought it was a good idea to use RTV everywhere when putting them back together. It had a slug of rtv in the main jet on #4. DOH!

Other than that, no carburetor issues whatsoever over 30 years of riding.

But then 99% of my riding has been near sea level. If you do a lot of riding at varying altitude, then fuel injection is probably a good idea.

[covance]

To add, I also don't plan to do any highway riding or commuting. Just cruising on smaller roads on weekends. So smaller CC is better for this purpose as well right?

[tennisfreak]

Originally Posted by covance

To add, I also don't plan to do any highway riding or commuting. Just cruising on smaller roads on weekends. So smaller CC is better for this purpose as well right?

Yes sir at least IMO.

Smaller bikes are so light and nimble they are more fun when cruising on the back-roads in the "twisties".

If you wont be getting on the highway going 80+mph then a full fairing bike is not really a necessity either.

CBR300R
Ninja 300
Yamaha R3, FZ-07
Suzuki SV650, GSX-750

[CatDaddysBBQ]

Been riding most of my life. Here is my advice to a prospective beginner:

1: Take a msf safety course. They teach good habits, and you'll get a much much much better foundation this way. Having a buddy who has a bike teach you in a parking lot is a bad idea. You'll inherit his mistakes and bad habits, and he won't be as thorough as the msf course.

2: Buy yourself a cheap japanese bike. Preferably a standard or a really non-agressive baby sport bike. Cruisers aren't the easiest to learn on, as the riding position isn't ideal for newcomers. Same goes for aggressive sport bikes. Preferably 500cc or so. 250s are great to learn on, but you may run into wanting to upgrade soon. A 500 is still easy to learn on, and you can totally grow into it a bit. Suggestion: Suzuki gs500 or Ninja 500. Both are absolutely great beginners bikes, (suzuki is a bit better of a riding position, but ninja 500 is fine). They can also be had for super cheap prices since they've both been out forever, and you can get a good example for under 1800 bucks.

3: Don't buy your dream bike that you think looks bad ass. You're probably going to drop this first one a few times. You don't want to learn on something you're too busy babying. Plus, if you buy a 15yr old japanese bike to learn on, you can sell it back for just about the same price as you paid for it, so there's no financial reason to not buy a 'beater' first bike.

4: Don't ride with a group for a while. It can be a bit chaotic. Just spend some time learning basics. When you no longer have to think about what you're doing, then try riding with one or maybe two friends. You don't want to be a beginner in a pack of a dozen bikes, it's a bit unnerving at first.

5: Have fun, and be careful. Wear a helmet. Wear gloves. Wear boots. No shorts. Even a small "off" at 28mph is enough to lose skin and crack your head open. Proper gear goes a long long way.

Avoid hyosung BTW.

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[menikmati]

Originally Posted by CatDaddysBBQ

5: Have fun, and be careful. Wear a helmet. Wear gloves. Wear boots. No shorts. Even a small "off" at 28mph is enough to lose skin and crack your head open. Proper gear goes a long long way.

Please do this, I ride and wear all my gear even if I was just going for a couple of miles. I've crashed going approximately 30MPH into a guardrail and managed to walk away with no injuries or abrasions, and I thank all my gear for that. I had a full race suit with back protector, full gauntlet gloves and boots on and the aluminum insert on the shoulder was dented in. I couldn't imagine how it would've turned out if I wasn't wearing my gear.

If you have large fluctuations in the weather, you can buy gear that's designed specifically for the weather conditions. Hell, I rode in black leather during the summer and I felt cool as long as I was moving.

[bcj]

Well yeah.
Black leathers are always cool 8)