ST XTA coilovers (rebound adjustable, with camber top mounts front)

[8R6]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

I have not had first hand experience with them. A couple thoughts...

You can get a lot of camber on a ST/KW/RCE coilover without camber plates. Reusing stock top mounts and using the lower slotted mount for camber is IMO a better solution for some rather than going with camber plates. We have used the KW camber plates and although the design is pretty good, the bearing has always been VERY tight which is annoying.

I don't have any reason to think these wouldn't be decent coilovers. A lot will depend on how they set the compression curve. Part of me thinks that would be a more worthwhile adjustment than rebound as long as you're sticking with the standard spring rates, but I'm just thinking out loud. Overall, they're probably a pretty good street and light track coilover and I'd think about getting them without camber plates. Maybe add your own.

- Andrew

i dont mean to thread jack and since you brought up the camber adjustability with the slotted lowers, what are your thoughts on using camber bolts with the slotted lowers?

i remember you and a few others had mentioned in the past that when possible, it is better to get camber from the slotted hole as opposed to top hats - but i cant seem to find the thread about using both camber bolt in a slotted hole. it's buried somewhere in the search results lol

[edit] actually just found the thread about my question! but would still like to know your opinion on it if you can provide. thanks!

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by 8R6

i dont mean to thread jack and since you brought up the camber adjustability with the slotted lowers, what are your thoughts on using camber bolts with the slotted lowers?

i remember you and a few others had mentioned in the past that when possible, it is better to get camber from the slotted hole as opposed to top hats - but i cant seem to find the thread about using both camber bolt in a slotted hole. it's buried somewhere in the search results lol

[edit] actually just found the thread about my question! but would still like to know your opinion on it if you can provide. thanks!

I prefer to get more of my camber from the lower mount vs. camber plates. Reasoning is a better steering axis inclination (SAI). You may want more than you can get from just the lower mount and then you would add some up top with plates (and also add some caster too!). I have a longer post somewhere...I think it's a scrub radius thread.

- andrew

[brzest]

Let us know what your impressions are after you have them installed. Very interested!
ST should hire you for marketing btw! I'm now seriously considering them, before they weren't even an option

[Tor]

I ordered my other parts (LCAs, camber bolts etc), in a group buy that got screwed up. So I'm trying to sort that out now (getting my money back and ordering it myself). I hope it won't delay it too much - still hoping to get them installed in February, if my new job permits as well.

As for marketing, I'm not sure I an doing KW a favour here. The KWs are same manufacturing quality, except they are stainless steel. As you can see, they are nowhere near the quality of the Öhlins that we both considered. What I am getting at is that maybe the KWs are a bit over-hyped/priced? Considering you can get XTA for half the price of KW, is the price of KW really justified, just to have separate rebound/compression adjustment?

If I was to spend more money, KW would be off my list and I would look for some nice upside-down mono tubes (AST would be on the top of my list for 2500€$ range).

[Tor]

With regards to camber adjustment, if I can get what I want (-2.5 deg) with the camber bolts and slotted lower mount, I'll leave the camber adjustable top mounts at the center.

If I can't I'll adjust some at the top (same value both sides), and then let the alignment shop match it up at the lower mount.

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Overall, they're probably a pretty good street and light track coilover and I'd think about getting them without camber plates. Maybe add your own.

As for the top mounts, please keep in mind these are recessed, so they will give more travel than most other 3rd party top mounts.

By the way, I hear that the US KW V3 are also 4kg/mm front and 5 kg/mm rear (like the EU version) for some time now. Is that true?

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by Tor

As for the top mounts, please keep in mind these are recessed, so they will give more travel than most other 3rd party top mounts.

By the way, I hear that the US KW V3 are also 4kg/mm front and 5 kg/mm rear (like the EU version) for some time now. Is that true?

True, I do like that the plates are recessed. Yes the V3s here use those softer rates.

- Andrew

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by Tor

As for marketing, I'm not sure I an doing KW a favour here. The KWs are same manufacturing quality, except they are stainless steel. As you can see, they are nowhere near the quality of the Öhlins that we both considered. What I am getting at is that maybe the KWs are a bit over-hyped/priced? Considering you can get XTA for half the price of KW, is the price of KW really justified, just to have separate rebound/compression adjustment?

The stainless steel finish is important for those of us that live where roads are heavily salted in the winter months.

KW V3s are an excellent deal...a quality two way adjustable damper at their price is great. The extra compression adjustment is very valuable IMO for those that take the time to dial it in. It mostly affects low and mid piston sped so it has a strong affect on handling.

I do think these ST coilovers are a great value too.

- Andrew

[brzm3]

KW is still a better coil but ST definitely does not get the love it deserves. I originally had V3s for my BRZ and loved them. A friend of mine recently bought a set of the ST coils and decided to sell so he can upgrade to the XTA.

Anyone who is thinking about KW or ST feel free to PM me as I have a great source for them.

[swift996]

I had the Eibach Multi Pro R2 coilovers that had an integrated camber plate with caster adjustment. I believe Raceseng is the only top mount solution with the caster adjustment. I'd recommend their top mounts, more suspension travel and the caster adjustment was big for me on track.

[Tor]

Finally got around to installing my ST XTAs:



(Whiteline endlinks, broke the stock ones)



I sprayed them with some rust protecting grease, that's why they look ..eh.. greasy.



Ride height approx 25" from ground to the highest point of the fender.

[yip]

Looks good!

After a few thousand miles of driving around LA I'm extremely pleased with my purchase. After riding/driving in a few other 86's with different coilover setups I'm confident buying the XTA's was the right decision.

I wonder why these are so overlooked especially at the price point?

[Tor]

Originally Posted by yip

Looks good!

After a few thousand miles of driving around LA I'm extremely pleased with my purchase. After riding/driving in a few other 86's with different coilover setups I'm confident buying the XTA's was the right decision.

I wonder why these are so overlooked especially at the price point?

Yes me too. That's why I started the thread too and made the video. Because they have good specs on paper.

I also posted my first impression in my Member's Car Journal:
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99825

Cross posting it over here:

Originally Posted by Tor

I only drove it a small peaceful test drive so far.

No weird noises, no VSC light and it drive straight like on rails. So I guess I got lucky and didn't mess up the alignment left/right that much (or equally much both sides if you will).

Compared to stock, of course you feel the bumps in the road more.

But as a test I drove over a cobblestone pawed road near where I live. It was previously a jawbreaking experience, where the whole car was bouncing about. With the XTA in the middle rebound setting (I have it at 9 of 16 clicks towards soft), it feels a lot more comfortable! You still feel the wheels hit every stone, but it feels like it's the wheels being bounced around and the car is steadier.

With the stock shocks absorbers it felt like the shocks couldn't keep up, and would get "out of sync" and each subsequent stone would make the suspension travel exponentially bigger, with the result of throwing the car around.

Best way to describe the XTA, is that it feels like the shocks are working faster than the stock ones and thus keeping up with each stone and making a uniform minimum required travel for each stone.

As for performance it has less body roll as expected. I didn't push it in anyway though. And the of course I need an alignment. I think I gained a lot of toe out in the front, the steering feels a lot lighter.

[Tor]

An update on the XTAs, I now had them on track:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9qqv2lZb-o"]ST XTA coilovers for the GT86/FR-S/BRZ - track day[/ame]

My full mod list is in my build thread.

Relevant thing for the handling are:
- Suspension Technologies ST XTA coilovers
- Suspension Technologies anti-swaybars
- Pirelli P Zero Nero GT 225x40R18 (street tires)

Setup is -2.5 deg camber front and -1.8 in the rear, with very slight toe-in all round. Swaybars in their soft setting and the dampers in a soft rebound setting 9/16. With that setup the car is neutral biased towards oversteer - the stock understeer at speed is completely gone.

The 6 kg/mm front, 5 kg/mm rear springs absolutely doesn't make the car understeer. It actually caught me by surprise on the very first lap.

[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by Tor

The XTA is very different from the ST X. As far as I read elsewhere, the X damper (and KW V1) is made by AL-KO. Personally, I wouldn't replace my good stock suspension with either or any other brand in that price range.

What is your source on this info and how confident are you on it? KW customer support told me, "We are moving away from inserts on ST and V1s. still the same valving just wet filled now." That may corroborate your info.

I have the original version of ST coilovers for the 86. What annoys me is this past year creaking/clunking started to develop and did not go away after retorquing everything. Also took months for the height to fully settle (had to raise it 3 times because height kept drooping). Thinking of getting the new GReddy X KW coilovers. But exterior construction looks too similar to my ST and makes me hesitant I will get the same drooping and noise issues. In that case, I will bite the bullet for TRD coilovers (a bit pricey but their parts have never given me problems for over a decade on multiple platforms).