Update on Window Freezing Issue, and Toyota Finance

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by MuseChaser

Not really. There was no fine print in the financing contract about having to mail extra principal payments to a different address, and having to do that is in direct opposition to the finance officer's representation of the loan contract. So.. no, everything did not go as expected, hence the post.

From Toyota Financial Services FAQ:

20. How can I reduce my principal balance?
To remit additional funds to be applied to principal only. send principal only payments to the following address for processing:
Toyota Financial Services
PO BOX 9490
Cedar Rapids, IA 52409

Include on the check one of the following:
Account number
Last 8 digits of VIN number
SSN
State on check to apply the funds to principal only.
Note: Additional funds applying to principal only will not advance the due date.

https://www.toyotafinancial.com/pub/...s_account_faqs

I didn't figure it out until my 2nd or 3rd payment either, but it's not a secret. Definitely an annoying practice, but not illegal or undisclosed.

[MuseChaser]

I appreciate the reply, Strat, very much. Maybe it's just me, but I still can't excuse Toyota Finance's handling of this. When the loan terms were presented to me, I asked the finance officer in no uncertain terms how to apply extra payments directly to principal and she told me to just indicate that desire on my check and on the payment slip. No mention of another address. No mention of another address on the monthly statements. Sooo.. how am I supposed to know about this policy prior to originating the loan? Tell the loan officer, "Wait, I don't believe you. Give me a second to pull out my smart phone and check the Toyota Financial FAQ to see if you're lying?"

OK, so they put the correct information up on their website. Customers aren't on their website when they're signing loan papers.

Maybe it's not illegal to not furnish this very important information PRIOR to a customer's signing documentation, but it's sure undisclosed at that time. It sure as H E Double Hockey sticks is annoying and unethical.

I spoke with the loan officer at my GOOD local dealership about the practice. He was cool, but pretty much admitted the evasive practices because they don't make much on low rate financing and this is one way for them to make more. So, yes, they're aware of the unethical, deceptive practice yet do it anyway.

You're a more forgiving dude than I am, at least in this respect. I'll be paying the car off within a month or two, and it'll be the last car loan I ever take out.

Thanks again.. I appreciate the thoughts.

Barry

[MuseChaser]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

ANY car windows will freeze under those conditions. That has zero to do with the TSB or "issue" since they were for water running down inside the door and freezing the guides there. Be glad that the safety system was there to save the windows and worked as it should. I burned out several motors back in the day trying to open frozen windows.

I wasn't complaining about the windows freezing; I've lived in the frozen north for my entire adult life and have replaced, personally, my share of burnt out window motors, bent arms, and broken nylon guides before I learned to stop using the darn electric window switches to try and break loose frozen windows. Better to just let'em stay shut until they thaw on their own or you can get some deicer on'em. I don't like the DESIGN, that's all. I'd rather the windows didn't have an auto-crack function, that's all. What you say is true; any window would have frozen in the conditions I described (and we get those conditions frequently). It'd be better to have windows that didn't subject themselves automatically to enough stress to cause them to shut down and require a reset, that's all.

Thanks..

Barry

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by MuseChaser

I spoke with the loan officer at my GOOD local dealership about the practice. He was cool, but pretty much admitted the evasive practices because they don't make much on low rate financing and this is one way for them to make more. So, yes, they're aware of the unethical, deceptive practice yet do it anyway.

You're a more forgiving dude than I am, at least in this respect. I'll be paying the car off within a month or two, and it'll be the last car loan I ever take out.

Thanks again.. I appreciate the thoughts.

Barry

I believe I did not convey my tone properly over the internet. I am 100% sympathetic with you, my post is entirely based on cynicism from going through exactly the same process you have.

I am not more forgiving, I'm just lazy and it's easier to be peanut gallery than try to affect actual change. The dealerships are shamelessly trying to get every penny out of you and Toyota USA is not in a position to kick them in the ass to provide good customer service. Their customer service line just kicks you to a dealership customer service rep who usually is just a paid punching bag for savvier customers that can't do anything because dealership owner doesn't give a shit and would rather see that extra profit from shady practices.

IMO direct sales to customers are coming back, if every Apple store was pulling this shit on laptops and iphones you think they'd have the reputation they have? No, they'd have Best Buy's reputation. Come on Tesla!

Like I said earlier, the "too long; didn't read" is that you bought an affordable car at a typical new car dealership. It's a damn shame, I have zero desire to ever go through the process of buying a new car again, it's just not worth it, craigslist has kicked ass in comparison. Be lucky you didn't get hit with the 'yo-yo finance' like I did.

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/08/28/p...-yo-financing/

They increased the interest rate, said they'd mail me a check for cash difference over the loan period, lied and applied the money to the next months loan payment (of course not the principle). I didn't raise a stink because like you I was paying off early so the interest rate increase didn't hurt me and I got like $100 free for falling for their scam and wasting an hour of my time.

Hey market research people, you hear that? Millenials would rather buy cars off craigslist than from a dealership. Get yo house in order!

Originally Posted by MuseChaser

I'd rather the windows didn't have an auto-crack function, that's all.

Take a closer look at the design, I believe they'd catch on the door frame if they didn't move out of the way.

[pfaffendorn]

Originally Posted by MuseChaser

Not really. There was no fine print in the financing contract about having to mail extra principal payments to a different address, and having to do that is in direct opposition to the finance officer's representation of the loan contract. So.. no, everything did not go as expected, hence the post.

I guess I'm not surprised at any of it, cause I can offer my own experience with a loan from Toyota Financial. Far less crazy-making, however:

Having set up an online account, I experimented by making a timely payment and a few days later making an additional payment. When the statement came, sure enough the next due date was not next month, but the month following. Good for putting it out of your mind for a while, but bound to bite you in the mass one way or another. Making a payment against principal, however, was possible by following certain instructions, doing it between certain dates, pressing certain buttons. You had to look for the instructions, but they are there. They hide them a little, cause after all, paying down principal is unsportsmanlike and costs them money.

Now ask me how I bought a glorious, slightly used BRZ still under Subaru warranty at a Toyota dealer and wound up with a Toyota extended warranty.

[pfaffendorn]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Hey market research people, you hear that? Millenials would rather buy cars off craigslist than from a dealership. Get yo house in order!

Well, certainly Millenials are learning the difference between how we elders bought cars at dealerships and how to save money on a newish car more or less outside the system. But from what I hear, Milleniums aren't much excited about buying cars anyway, as long as somebody in their group has one (our two-seaters mostly don't count).

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by pfaffendorn

Well, certainly Millenials are learning the difference between how we elders bought cars at dealerships and how to save money on a newish car more or less outside the system. But from what I hear, Milleniums aren't much excited about buying cars anyway, as long as somebody in their group has one (our two-seaters mostly don't count).

In broad generalities it's not that cars are uninteresting to my generation, they're about as interesting as they were to any other generation. Before there were computer nerds there were book worms, playing chess by mail and people felt comfortable walking or biking the streets at night. There's no hidden cultural shift for you to uncover watching kids play video games with other kids from Russia (it's just DnD where a computer rolls the dice) it's that cars (and most importantly to this conversation: new cars as there is no data on old car sales) are a luxury many cannot afford. Too many articles and studies and simple maths you can do yourself to see that there is less opportunity now then there was 50, 25, or even 10 years ago.

It's a trend that's been happening since before the early 90's crash that screwed over Gen X. If we had a booming economy and youths gainfully employed those 'average car buyer age' numbers would plummet.