Cosworth Supercharger Owners Thread

[Matt@Cosworth]

we run a 225/40 R18 contisport contact 5's which are generally excellent, really good wet weather grip anda nice consistency when they do lose grip
obviously you have to run them down at 26 -28 psi though

[weederr33]

Originally Posted by Matt@Cosworth

we run a 225/40 R18 contisport contact 5's which are generally excellent, really good wet weather grip anda nice consistency when they do lose grip
obviously you have to run them down at 26 -28 psi though

How do those compare to the Continental ExtremeContact DW tires?

[Matt@Cosworth]

I think the DW in the title refers to 'dry weather' so I can't comment as this sort of boot is ill suited to the ' interesting' range of weather we get in the UK.....

I'd imagine its got loads of grip if the tarmac is nice and warm

[killboy]

Continental uses the labels DW for Dry/Wet and DWS for Dry/Wet/Snow and the lettering wears off during usage to leave an indicator of what the tire is suitable for as it wears. First the S wears away if it's a DWS, indicating the tire is not longer suitable for snow, then the W wears away indicating it's unsafe to use in extremely wet conditions. Once the D is gone it's time to replace the tire.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....emeContact+DWS

Originally Posted by Matt@Cosworth

I think the DW in the title refers to 'dry weather' so I can't comment as this sort of boot is ill suited to the ' interesting' range of weather we get in the UK.....

I'd imagine its got loads of grip if the tarmac is nice and warm

[Mak01]

I agree with you with most exposed tire configurations. Even I take I'm not unhappy. currently led yokohama advan 105 215x45x17 measures oem tires.
But something else is in extreme driving circuit. And I think none of you have tried this.
However I think follow the advice not suddenly increase the surface.

I think I'll put 225x45x17 in Oem rims. And Neova ad08r Yokohama tires.
And I'm hesitant to put 235 behind. The problem is like the 17 rim 235 supports.

[weederr33]

So what are the thought's on using the HKS stroker kit with the Cosworth supercharger?

[killboy]

Originally Posted by weederr33

So what are the thought's on using the HKS stroker kit with the Cosworth supercharger?

Seems a bit wasteful at $2300 unless you just have to upgrade the internals for some reason, and this is coming from a Cosworth owner with upgraded internals. The extra displacement is ok, but it's not a big change (2.0 -> 2.1L) and if you can't crank up the boost with a significant pulley swap, I don't think you'll see much of a difference. Be better off with the stroker kit + turbo to get the benefit of quicker spool and more torque along with larger power gains on the top end.

I'm running forged internals because we developed a head gasket leak and had to go in and fix it anyway, so did the forged internals (stock crank) while in there because I plan to make more boost one way or another with this thing...through pulleys, custom-made if I have to, or twin charging.

[ajc209]

Oil Cooler part 2

So decided that my oil-to-air cooler wasn’t the best solution for my car as I do some shorter journeys. Even though I had a 99C thermostatic plate there was still some flow though the radiator at lower temperatures. This led to the oil to take longer to warm up, which for my shorter journeys meant that I had to go for a hoon to warm the oil up to >80C

An option I had previously considered was the use of the Forester DIT oil cooler, which his basically an oil-to-water cooler which sandwiches between the oil filter and engine block.



You basically splice a couple coolant lines to pass the coolant though the cooler. As the coolant warms up quicker, this has the added benefit that it heats the oil up quicker and cools it once it starts getting hotter than the coolant. Our cars have a large coolant radiator and it is well controlled by the thermostat with plenty of headroom so the extra heat from the oil is compensated for by the thermostat allow more flow through the coolant radiator.

After looking through the ft86club it appears that the forester cooler struggles on cars with force induction and very hot days.

One of my work colleagues mentioned that his car has a Mocal Laminova which might give more thermal capacity than the forester cooler. So I had a look and found a post on the ft86club where someone has sliced one into the coolant pipe going from the block to the radiator.

For anyone interested there is more info here: http://www.mocal.co.uk/FAQ.html

Installation
Here you can see the outlet on the engine and the inlet on the radiator:


Here’s the original pipe and the Mocal Laminova next to it:


and spliced into the pipe:


Using the original Mocal sandwich plate was not desirable as it has the thermostat, but also with very little clearance it was difficult to route the oil pipes down to the cooler. It can be done though, but I wanted something tidy.

I found that mocal do a sandwhich plate with M18 banjo fittings, but I was concerned about oil pressure loss through a small ports turning right angles. Then I found the Mishimoto sandwich plate with M22 fittings which looked more appealing. They also provided pressure drop data for the Subaru WRX cooler (similar to the GT86 one) which showed 5psi in 90psi drop through the two banjo fitting and the radiator.



So here it is all fitted:



I have to say the Mishimoto item is very nicely finished with nice smooth machining.

While I was at it, I added a sandwich plate with a few 1/8npt sensor ports and moved the pressure gauge sensor. This will give me pressure reading after the cooler.


All done:


While it was at it I gave the bay a clean and #becausecosworth J


Testing

While at Bedford yesterday I had my tablet plugged in displaying/logging some temperature data.

Here the first session. I was taking it easy learning the circuit.


Unfortunately I left the tablet on and the charging cable didn't work very well so I only got data from the morning session.

Here's the last session where I was up to pace:


Quite impressed that oil stayed below 110C. I will have to see what temperatures look like in hotter conditions, but if the temps stay below 120C I may consider going back to 0W20 oil as my oil pressure was about 7Bar (100PSI) which might be unnecessarily high.

Also note that Intake temps hovered around +15C over ambient for the whole 32 minutes. The dip in the middle is where I started short shifting to let the brakes cool down a bit.

Air flow is my friend. I noticed intake temps went up a few deg C when following the Golf R down the back straight.

[weederr33]

Originally Posted by killboy

Seems a bit wasteful at $2300 unless you just have to upgrade the internals for some reason, and this is coming from a Cosworth owner with upgraded internals. The extra displacement is ok, but it's not a big change (2.0 -> 2.1L) and if you can't crank up the boost with a significant pulley swap, I don't think you'll see much of a difference. Be better off with the stroker kit + turbo to get the benefit of quicker spool and more torque along with larger power gains on the top end.

I'm running forged internals because we developed a head gasket leak and had to go in and fix it anyway, so did the forged internals (stock crank) while in there because I plan to make more boost one way or another with this thing...through pulleys, custom-made if I have to, or twin charging.

Makes sense. I guess I'm just thinking ahead when Cosworth releases their smaller pulley for more boost.

[killboy]

Originally Posted by weederr33

Makes sense. I guess I'm just thinking ahead when Cosworth releases their smaller pulley for more boost.

For sure you would want to upgrade if going smaller pulley, and it's not a bad price for forged pistons, rods, and a crank. Not sure what the change in compression is though, and whether you'd want to do that with the Cosworth.

[ajc209]

I wonder if the stock pistons even need changing for 350hp.

If the pistons are good enough, all you'd need to change for 325hp stage 3 might be:

1. New stronger rods
2. New Injectors
3. New Fuel Pump
4. New Clutch plates/cover
5. Set of pulleys and belt

to get to 350hp a new airbox might be required.

Hopefully Matt et al. are working on a stage 3

[NotSoJDM]

Originally Posted by ajc209

I wonder if the stock pistons even need changing for 350hp.

If the pistons are good enough, all you'd need to change for 325hp stage 3 might be:

1. New stronger rods
2. New Injectors
3. New Fuel Pump
4. New Clutch plates/cover
5. Set of pulleys and belt

to get to 350hp a new airbox might be required.

Hopefully Matt et al. are working on a stage 3

I am curious as to why so many people are so keen on keeping the factory pistons? I'm not sure if you do your own work or not, but the labor costs involved with pulling the engine to do rods (which requires removal of the pistons to begin with) will be pretty high. It seems crazy to me that anyone would want to then take the factory parts, and reassemble them into the engine (especially given the modifications apparently require for this to work). Adding a stronger part only increases the factor of safety of the assembly, which ultimately translates to reduced chance of having to pull the engine again down the road. I would prefer to have that piece of mind, rather than be the test subject of "how much hp can these stock pistons handle"?

[NotSoJDM]

Originally Posted by ajc209

Oil Cooler part 2
Testing

While at Bedford yesterday I had my tablet plugged in displaying/logging some temperature data.

Here the first session. I was taking it easy learning the circuit.


Unfortunately I left the tablet on and the charging cable didn't work very well so I only got data from the morning session.

Here's the last session where I was up to pace:

Thank you for posting this. I have been interested in seeing some comparable temperature data for other TVS supercharger options on the market. I run the Edelbrock kit, and took some similar data below, seen below. Unfortunately I didn't log ambient temps the ECU saw, but it was about 70F (21C) that day for comparison sake.



Edit: My IAT data is taken post supercharger (the MAF/MAP harness relcators the temp sensor to the MAP rather than the MAF). Do you know which sensor the Cosworth kit pulls IAT from?

[ajc209]

Originally Posted by NotSoJDM

I am curious as to why so many people are so keen on keeping the factory pistons? I'm not sure if you do your own work or not, but the labor costs involved with pulling the engine to do rods (which requires removal of the pistons to begin with) will be pretty high. It seems crazy to me that anyone would want to then take the factory parts, and reassemble them into the engine (especially given the modifications apparently require for this to work). Adding a stronger part only increases the factor of safety of the assembly, which ultimately translates to reduced chance of having to pull the engine again down the road. I would prefer to have that piece of mind, rather than be the test subject of "how much hp can these stock pistons handle"?

If its just the costs of the pistons then i'd replace them, but im not an engine builder so i'd have to pay someone to do it and if keeping the stock pistons means less labour then i'd be okay as long as Cosworth had done the R&D to confirm they are fine.