Magazine Motorsport: S2000 vs BRZ

[Subaruwrxfan]

Originally Posted by WingsofWar

Well for me, the S2000 was horribly impractical, 18/24 economy is a down seller. and the fact that its a roadster.

While they are similar in handling, they achieve it in completely different ways.

What we should be asking ourselves is whats more important to us as an individual buyer? In the overall bigger picture, even if the s2000 is a better performer, the BRZ still offers the same feeling of the sportyness of the s2000 but has a wider range of uses. AKA the Zx6 has better general value.

Ok, so the practicality and roof, I can understand that. I guess for me I'll still be keeping my Legacy as a winter car and will use it when I need lots of interior room or utility, so I don't see value in that personally, and I wouldn't mind a convertible either, so I suppose I don't value the hardtop as much as some of you do. Guess those are the differences then, thanks for the insight.

[RylisPro]

An S2000 CR makes a great street car and has a hardtop

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by RylisPro

An S2000 CR makes a great street car and has a hardtop

And used ones are more expensive than a new BRZ.

Personally I don't own a S2000 because I want a rear seat to haul the occasional friend and more trunk space for long trips to visit family.

[enigma]

Imho, if you're buying the FR-S/BRZ for a fun "weekend only" car, there are FAR better options for that. Hell, I've thought on more than one occasion about skipping the FR-S all together, buying a cheap beater, and getting my second NSX.

However, if you're like me, and intend on having only one vehicle for a while, the FR-S provides a good option for the 'best of both worlds' scenario. It's relatively quiet, practical, gets good mileage, reliable, but is also fun to drive and a purist sports car in the most traditional sense.

If you're looking for a weekend toy and want to spend $25k, for the love of God, go buy an NSX or an Elise. I love the FR-S and have been following it for years, but I could never even begin to imagine it as my "fun" second car that sits in the garage most of the week.

And for those arguing power issues... it's irrelevant, honestly. If you're going to track it, and if 1) you're a good enough driver, and 2) the chassis/setup is really as good as they make it out to be on the FRS, you'll pass up several cars that are supposedly faster and better track cars. Power isn't everything. Some of the most fun I've ever had on the track was in my old 135 hp MR2. Slowest thing on the planet, but man you could just play with it! You could easily explore the limits, it was incredibly easy to control (understeer in? Just lift! The back will come right around!), and very rewarding when you got it right---much like I expect the FR-S to be. Power is overrated imho.

[zoomzoomers]

Originally Posted by enigma

Imho, if you're buying the FR-S/BRZ for a fun "weekend only" car, there are FAR better options for that. Hell, I've thought on more than one occasion about skipping the FR-S all together, buying a cheap beater, and getting my second NSX.

However, if you're like me, and intend on having only one vehicle for a while, the FR-S provides a good option for the 'best of both worlds' scenario. It's relatively quiet, practical, gets good mileage, reliable, but is also fun to drive and a purist sports car in the most traditional sense.

If you're looking for a weekend toy and want to spend $25k, for the love of God, go buy an NSX or an Elise. I love the FR-S and have been following it for years, but I could never even begin to imagine it as my "fun" second car that sits in the garage most of the week.

And for those arguing power issues... it's irrelevant, honestly. If you're going to track it, and if 1) you're a good enough driver, and 2) the chassis/setup is really as good as they make it out to be on the FRS, you'll pass up several cars that are supposedly faster and better track cars. Power isn't everything. Some of the most fun I've ever had on the track was in my old 135 hp MR2. Slowest thing on the planet, but man you could just play with it! You could easily explore the limits, it was incredibly easy to control (understeer in? Just lift! The back will come right around!), and very rewarding when you got it right---much like I expect the FR-S to be. Power is overrated imho.

[viper_driver]

I daily drove an S2000 for nearly 7 years including a couple trips clear across the US. I got almost 28 mpg lifetime and it never broke down once. I loved it the first time I drove it and felt the same way when I watched it drive away. If the BRZ I have on order provides half the joy of that car I'll be happy. I sold the S2000 for one reason--first baby and no back seat. I'm buying the BRZ hoping that it's like an S2000 with a tiny back seat.

One thing to consider... The S2000 was just over $30k in 1999, that would be in the low $40s now in the US adjusted for inflation. I'd bet if we were all willing to suck up another 12K or so in MSRP they could get more power from the motor. I'm not willing to do that--happy with 200hp here for the price it's at.

[86design]

Originally Posted by PERRIN

Both the BRZ/FR-S and the S2000 are awesome drivers cars. BUT the S2000 is no longer made, so why compare a 4-12 year old used car to the BRZ? Also the S2000 was $32k 12 years ago so it's no surprise it's faster and very well may handle a little better. The biggest difference between the two is the tires, the S2000 actually came with performance tires, the BRZ not so much. The BRZ does have good handling characteristics but the tires do hold it back from good magazine numbers.

FYI, I have driven both extensively.

i concur!!!

[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by WingsofWar

For many of us here who have been following this car since its announcement in 2009. What we have been searching for is not numbers, but a forgotten love story. Many people here have a big resume of cars from all sorts of power ranges, and their most memorable and heart felt experiences as an enthusiast have been with the most underpowered unimpressive cars.

Yeah, I've had an 7th gen Celica GT-S and G35 plus a few MkII MR2s/Spyder. I miss the banshee howling Celica more than the wheezing G boat.

[eikond]

Originally Posted by Subaruwrxfan

I can see both sides, but I gotta admit I'm a little disappointed, I already knew that the S2000 would be faster, but it got me thinking...the S2000 isn't a drag racer either, it's a back roads carving machine like the BRZ, very similar weight to the BRZ, same great handling. Why buy a BRZ when you can have an S2000 which will arguably give you a very similar experience for less money? Really not trying to troll here, but I'm not 100% loyal to the BRZ either. The car is fantastic I'm sure, but the S2000 has been doing the same thing for the past 12 years. 100 hp/liter, high redline, low weight and great handling. Am I missing something? I wanna know what makes this car different from an S2000, honest.

Used vs. New = more confidence in long term use and zero fear of mechanical issues (not that Honda's are bad.. they are excellent.. but still...)

Size.. S2000 is a very small 2-seater.. Most BRZ buyers are not expecting a very useful back seat, but it still exists for stowing luggage, small kids, etc..

Price.. Remember the BRZ is still in the bottom rung of prices for cars in it's class. The S2000 was quite a bit more expensive than some of it's competitors when it was sold.

Hardtop vs. Roadster. Many people want the hardtop.. don't want the noise from the roadster. Personally, I like the convertible.. but I think most people prefer the hardtops.



The one thing that gets me is that people aren't seeing the potential of the BRZ yet. They think that it always has to have 200hp. We all know that supercharger/turbocharger options are coming in the future. I fully expect to have a 250 to 300 hp BRZ... and I'm not talking about waiting for the STI/TRD versions to come out. I'm guessing the cost of a TRD S/C will be less than what the future upgraded BRZ model will cost.

If you could make another 100hp for $4k, then how would the BRZ/S2000 comparison turn out? The BRZ might be faster at that point and nobody could complain about the price because the BRZ would still be less expensive than the MSRP of the S2000 from a few years ago.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by Mr Franky

15.7 is one of the slowest times posted so far...

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5462

There was a video in this thread where the 86 did a 14.7 quartermile

this test was probably done with less capable drivers plus that s2000 def posts better times aswell

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by eikond

Used vs. New = more confidence in long term use and zero fear of mechanical issues (not that Honda's are bad.. they are excellent.. but still...)

Size.. S2000 is a very small 2-seater.. Most BRZ buyers are not expecting a very useful back seat, but it still exists for stowing luggage, small kids, etc..

Price.. Remember the BRZ is still in the bottom rung of prices for cars in it's class. The S2000 was quite a bit more expensive than some of it's competitors when it was sold.

Hardtop vs. Roadster. Many people want the hardtop.. don't want the noise from the roadster. Personally, I like the convertible.. but I think most people prefer the hardtops.



The one thing that gets me is that people aren't seeing the potential of the BRZ yet. They think that it always has to have 200hp. We all know that supercharger/turbocharger options are coming in the future. I fully expect to have a 250 to 300 hp BRZ... and I'm not talking about waiting for the STI/TRD versions to come out. I'm guessing the cost of a TRD S/C will be less than what the future upgraded BRZ model will cost.

If you could make another 100hp for $4k, then how would the BRZ/S2000 comparison turn out? The BRZ might be faster at that point and nobody could complain about the price because the BRZ would still be less expensive than the MSRP of the S2000 from a few years ago.

I think its gonna take more than 4k to see a reliable 100 hp increase from this engine since it has D/I and a high CR. I think 50 hp for 4k might also be a stretch too. I wish this car had like a 1.6-8l boxer turbo that delivered 220hp/190tq as an optional engine for like 2k more.

[Subaruwrxfan]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I think its gonna take more than 4k to see a reliable 100 hp increase from this engine since it has D/I and a high CR. I think 50 hp for 4k might also be a stretch too. I wish this car had like a 1.6-8l boxer turbo that delivered 220hp/190tq as an optional engine for like 2k more.

Yeah that's another thing about the car that bothers me is the lack of mods we'll be able to do to the engine. I feel like this car will be stuck below 215 hp unless you wanna spend big money.

[djdnz]

Oh well, wasn't buying the car because it's fast.

Also...

Originally Posted by viper_driver

Geez do you own that Ford GT? Dammmmn

[Sport-Tech]

^ I presume you have pneumatic lifters built into that S2000 suspension so you can actually drive it on real roads lol...

Reminds me of an F430 I saw coming out of a car wash onto the road, he badly scraped the bottom of his front lip spoiler coming down the curb ramp, it made a huge racket. I broke out laughing, the guy didn't appreciate it, roared away leaving a nice patch....