Worth trading for a 2015? - Page 3 - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

Zhangy · 04-21-2015, 10:24 PM

My lease is for 4 years... perfect timing to turn to finance a 2018 if its attractive. If not i buyout my 2015. I like 2015 for its ass and deeper sound

Zhangy · 04-21-2015, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Oh let him! I haven't had a good rant in 24 hours.

FU! there's my rant

FRSupra · 04-21-2015, 11:50 PM

This car was built for a manual transmission.

richardM · 04-21-2015, 11:58 PM

This is a really interesting topic... how most people buy cars, I suppose.

As we all know, the dealer makes about as much money on the car loan as they do on the car.

Lets do some math... your monthly payment is M = PI/(1-(1+I)^-N)
where I is the annual percentage rate divided by 100 (in case you don't know percent) then divide by 12 months. N is the number of months of your car loan.
(P is the principal amount of the loan.. the amount you borrow.. and N is the number of months your loan is)

It seems crazy to me, but lots of people seem to do 4 or even 5 year car loans!

Of course, you pay more for your car with a long loan but your monthly payments are less. The total you pay for your car is (Down Payment (Includes trade-in from old car if applicable) + M * N)

Doing the math, you see that the longer loans might cost you an extra $700 ish over a 3 year loan. That's not the kicker.

The issue is that the value of the car depreciates at about 15% per year (according to cars.com.. and it sorta seems to work roughly for us.) The first year is rougher.. but it gives us something reasonable...

Value = price * (.85)^y

Maybe the value of my '13 is now $18,750 ish. It's almost 2 years old.

three years from now, it will be worth about $11,500.

In the first 2 years, I lost about $7,500 in depreciation on the car.
In the next 3 years I will lose $7250
and after that, it's sort of gravy... the car isn't losing much value at all.

There are lots of implications... but buying a new car every couple of years while in a financial situation where you must take out a loan is long term disaster for your financial health.

The solution is to trade with someone else that has also suffered similar depreciation... and accept the risk that your evil opposite's car might have troubles yours doesn't.

Or.. sell the FRS and buy a cherry 1995 Miata... take the extra $11,000 and put it in the bank, and keep making those car payments to your very own bank account. No one ever said "Oh, the Miata, nice car but it's underpowered."

The financial justification for buying a new car is "I wanted it." I think the thing to do is drive it in to the ground. Pay the loan off as fast as you can, keep making payments to your bank account. I think these cars will hold value like the Miatas have.

As for me, I followed my advice years ago.. drove my car in to the dust while saving my payments for myself. For years! Now I pay cash. Dealers hate that.

FRSupra · 04-22-2015, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richardM

No one ever said "Oh, the Miata, nice car but it's underpowered."

Brilliant.

I don't know about all that other sh*t you wrote.

justin6280 · 04-23-2015, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MokSpeed

If you are seriously considering trading up just for a 2015 MY then wait a couple years for the BRZ STi at least.

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I've seen the term "MY" tossed around a few times in the forums and I have no clue on what it means. Could you please tell me?

On topic, imo driving a manual is much more enjoyable than an automatic. If you can handle the payments without any stress, then I say go for it and upgrade to a 2015. There are very minor features added to the '15 compared to the '13. Waiting 3 years for the new 2018 gen is a long time haha

Mim · 04-23-2015, 02:48 AM

Manufactured Year = MY

The period is centered around the financial year so an MY15 was released for sale from July 2014 to June 2015. MY16 would be a car released for sale from July 2015 to June 2016. I beleive I'm right, but happy to be corrected if I'm slightly off

donoman · 04-23-2015, 03:07 AM

If you love the car but want a manual, there is nothing you can do but to sell it. However, given that it is almost May:

Wait until the 2016's are announced (August). Then you will have visibility as to whether a '16 is a worthwhile upgrade. If not, you can buy a 2015 leftover.

Your decision will depend on your opportunity-cost. And that will depend on your financial situation. You will lose money on this deal either way (in your '13 or in a '15) but the opportunity cost (about $10K --- since you will sell yours for approx $18K and buy the new one for approx $27K) is something you need to make a decision about. $10K might be half your monthly salary, or it might be 10 years of rice & beans so it's really up to your situation and how badly you want to change it.

Do it.

04-23-2015, 02:48 AM	#35
Mim Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Drives: MY11 Maxima 350st, MY15 BRZ Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 534 Thanks: 304 Thanked 342 Times in 185 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Manufactured Year = MY The period is centered around the financial year so an MY15 was released for sale from July 2014 to June 2015. MY16 would be a car released for sale from July 2015 to June 2016. I beleive I'm right, but happy to be corrected if I'm slightly off __________________ MY15 CWP A/T BRZ \| Leather heated seats \| STI CAI filter, A/T leather shifter, strut brace, V-brace, draw stiffener, battery tie down, Radiator cap, Oil cap, push start button \| TRD door stabilizer \| YoSpeed STI console garnish \| Pioneer AVIC-F70DAB + Rev-camera, TS-WX710A sub \| JL speakers, Amp \| TOMS' Clear Brake Lights \| Cusco 4.556 FD \| Driveshaft Shop aluminum shaft \| Tein FlexZ, EDFC AP+GPS \| Crawford BPB

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04-21-2015, 10:24 PM	#29
Zhangy Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2014 Drives: 2015 FRS Location: Toronto Posts: 361 Thanks: 14 Thanked 106 Times in 83 Posts Mentioned: 5 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	My lease is for 4 years... perfect timing to turn to finance a 2018 if its attractive. If not i buyout my 2015. I like 2015 for its ass and deeper sound

04-21-2015, 11:50 PM	#31
FRSupra Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Drives: 2013 FR-S Location: PA Posts: 506 Thanks: 455 Thanked 464 Times in 164 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	This car was built for a manual transmission.

04-21-2015, 11:58 PM	#32
richardM Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Drives: scion frs, 2012 Mustang Location: wisconsin Posts: 47 Thanks: 59 Thanked 41 Times in 21 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	This is a really interesting topic... how most people buy cars, I suppose. As we all know, the dealer makes about as much money on the car loan as they do on the car. Lets do some math... your monthly payment is M = PI/(1-(1+I)^-N) where I is the annual percentage rate divided by 100 (in case you don't know percent) then divide by 12 months. N is the number of months of your car loan. (P is the principal amount of the loan.. the amount you borrow.. and N is the number of months your loan is) It seems crazy to me, but lots of people seem to do 4 or even 5 year car loans! Of course, you pay more for your car with a long loan but your monthly payments are less. The total you pay for your car is (Down Payment (Includes trade-in from old car if applicable) + M * N) Doing the math, you see that the longer loans might cost you an extra $700 ish over a 3 year loan. That's not the kicker. The issue is that the value of the car depreciates at about 15% per year (according to cars.com.. and it sorta seems to work roughly for us.) The first year is rougher.. but it gives us something reasonable... Value = price * (.85)^y Maybe the value of my '13 is now $18,750 ish. It's almost 2 years old. three years from now, it will be worth about $11,500. In the first 2 years, I lost about $7,500 in depreciation on the car. In the next 3 years I will lose $7250 and after that, it's sort of gravy... the car isn't losing much value at all. There are lots of implications... but buying a new car every couple of years while in a financial situation where you must take out a loan is long term disaster for your financial health. The solution is to trade with someone else that has also suffered similar depreciation... and accept the risk that your evil opposite's car might have troubles yours doesn't. Or.. sell the FRS and buy a cherry 1995 Miata... take the extra $11,000 and put it in the bank, and keep making those car payments to your very own bank account. No one ever said "Oh, the Miata, nice car but it's underpowered." The financial justification for buying a new car is "I wanted it." I think the thing to do is drive it in to the ground. Pay the loan off as fast as you can, keep making payments to your bank account. I think these cars will hold value like the Miatas have. As for me, I followed my advice years ago.. drove my car in to the dust while saving my payments for myself. For years! Now I pay cash. Dealers hate that.

04-23-2015, 03:07 AM	#36
donoman Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Drives: '13 FR-S Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 277 Thanks: 6 Thanked 87 Times in 48 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	If you love the car but want a manual, there is nothing you can do but to sell it. However, given that it is almost May: Wait until the 2016's are announced (August). Then you will have visibility as to whether a '16 is a worthwhile upgrade. If not, you can buy a 2015 leftover. Your decision will depend on your opportunity-cost. And that will depend on your financial situation. You will lose money on this deal either way (in your '13 or in a '15) but the opportunity cost (about $10K --- since you will sell yours for approx $18K and buy the new one for approx $27K) is something you need to make a decision about. $10K might be half your monthly salary, or it might be 10 years of rice & beans so it's really up to your situation and how badly you want to change it. Do it.

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