My Car just came in! (Midwest)

[Turbowned]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

It reminds me of the first time I drove a Lotus Elise. Great chassis, crap engine. Bolt a supercharger on the Elise and it's a brilliant and well-rounded car. Perhaps the BRZ requires the same treatment to fulfill its destiny.

This.

I drove an Elise, too. It needed more power, just like I feel this car will need, after I get comfortable with it in stock form. It doesn't help that I've been driving a supercharged Audi S4 for the past 4 months, I'll admit. If I were coming straight out of my high-strung naturally aspirated MR2, I'm sure I wouldn't notice as much.

[WRXGuy1]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

Ok, I just got back from the dealership. Here are my very quick stream-of-thoughts:

*Ingress: Due to the large seat bolsters, you can't just flop into the car like a lazy fat slob, you have to actually use some thigh muscle and carefully place your hips and buttocks accordingly. Since this is the case with my Lotus x1,000, it's NBD for me, just FYI.

*Starting: Press and hold the start button and the engine will magically fire to life. Who's driving the ship here? I guess the engine started, I couldn't really hear it. Kinda bland sounding so far.

*Ergonomics: Excellent. Low position, upright driving position is pert and confidence inspiring. Steering wheel is high and vertical, the exact opposite of common Greyhound bus-style hot-hatches these days. Kudos.

*****pit: The gauges are recessed compared to the rest of the items you use [HVAC + vents, Nav/audio]. This creates a tunnel effect for the gauges, IMO not ideal, but it does give the car rare depth in a world where uber-flat IPs are typical

*Controls: The shifter is clunky yet accurate. Engaging any gear results in a "clunk" from the transmission, just like your favorite crotch rocket. Very unrefined and it'll likely annoy those it doesn't impress. The clutch pedal is rather anonymous. Engagement is high in its travel, but very light and easy. The throttle feels OK; it's neither lazy nor responsive, it's just there. The brake pedal....ah, now we're into the good stuff! The brake pedal feel is amazing; firm, solid, confident, responsive, and great modulation. It's among the best I've felt. The steering is good. In modern context, it's great. On-center feel is strong and natural, and there's no slop or dead-space. Overall weight is natural and fitting for the car. It's not chatty or all that communicative, however it's accurate and well weighted.

*Handling & Ride: Honestly, I can't make a big call on this due to the nature of the roads I was on. The ride feels a bit overzealously jiggly, as in the dampers aren't digressive enough. There's also plenty of pitch and roll over rather simple bumps, more than I expected. The car feels a bit amateur hour in terms of body control. I could be wrong, but also remember that my expectation bar is annoyingly high. The handling also has a strange feel to it. During medium-speed 60-odd degree sweepers, the car turns in appropriately, but then it feels as if the front outside tire digs in and the car wants to pivot around an imaginary anchor in the ground, rather disproportional to my steering input. These were not high-g corners, perhaps 0.5g max. It ends up feeling anxious rather than flowing, like it wants to kill all its momentum right at the corner exit. I'd love to spend more time investigating this; it reminds me a alot of the 1st gen BMW Z4 handling dynamics, which was always capable but not necessarily tidy.

*Engine: Ouch. It's quiet, and what you do hear isn't all that musical. All those media reviews where they were bashing the car for its lack of power. They were right. It's not that the car is slow, it's that it feels and sounds like it's under-powered. The acoustics aren't helping, and the way the body moves around during gear changes is more 80's Ford Escort than, well I hate to play this card, but my Exige S. Now before you jump down my throat proclaiming I'm not fairly comparing, hear me out. I've owned an NA Miata. I've also driven every iteration of the Miata, all the way through the current '12 NC2. The Miata is slow in reality, but behind the wheel, it doesn't feel taxed or tedious, it's well-paced and interesting. I'm not getting that vibe from the BRZ, I'm just not. Granted, I was keeping the engine below 5k so as to not get into a philosophical argument about how he & Subaru are wrong about engine break-in. Even then, in daily traffic, I'm not going to be wringing the crap out of any engine just to "feel it", the engine has to seem important and purposeful even at low RPM and part throttle, and I'm struggling to find those attributes here. The engine is bar-none the most disappointing aspect of the car. It reminds me of the first time I drove a Lotus Elise. Great chassis, crap engine. Bolt a supercharger on the Elise and it's a brilliant and well-rounded car. Perhaps the BRZ requires the same treatment to fulfill its destiny. As it stands, my Golf TDI feels more sprightly and point-n-shoot around town.

*Aura: The overall sense I feel while driving the car is mostly calmness and relaxation. The world outside is wholly irrelevant; it really is all about you and the car. I love that aspect. There are very few cars I've driven that nail this chill aura, and I very much love that.

*Summary: I'm very torn. It's obviously a car that's unfinished. It needs some work with the suspension, perhaps as simple as the alignment. It also needs proper engine music and thrust. The seats, driving position, and brake feel are all fantastic, but is that enough to buy a car on?

I really enjoyed reading your review, I prefer reading what people like you or I feel about the car rather than when those auto blogs write. This is what I'm worried about though, all the hype and photos we saw make this out to be some sort of one of a kind sports car on the cheap, and I feel that's why a lot of us are disappointed when we start driving it. For me, I have no real need to get a new car, so if the car isn't the best thing I've driven and feels more like a "meh, this is a pretty cool car, I can get used to this", I'm going to pass (anyone want to take it off my hands if I do?).

So did you end up buying it?

[dsgerbc]

If you're comparing to something much more expensive and end-up disappointed - it's your own fault. Compare to RX8 and go from there.

[Subaruwrxfan]

Yeah, curious if you bought the car too. Great review but you have reinforced some of my fears about this car. I've driven an Elise so I connected well with your review. I really hate to bring up the effin' Mustang again, but after reading your review, I find myself doubting the BRZ again. Really wanna know if you bought the car.

[NWIguy]

Originally Posted by sparrowhawk

All you guys getting your cars now, where you first on the list at your dealers? Im 3rd in mine. I have no idea when its coming...

I was no. 4 at the other dealership..till now no ETA or VIN

For this one it's their first ordered car

[the_3d_man]

Originally Posted by NWIguy

I believe you pre ordered at Subaru Of Merrillville? I went there first actually but they told me there was nothing for me to pre order.

You must be one of those three who pre ordered.

Yep. Looks like I should have gone where you did... Oh well.

[Nate219BRZ]

Im going threw the portage store so june 18th eta

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by WRXGuy1

...For me, I have no real need to get a new car, so if the car isn't the best thing I've driven and feels more like a "meh, this is a pretty cool car, I can get used to this", I'm going to pass (anyone want to take it off my hands if I do?).
...

I can save you some time if you'd like, based on what you said here, you won't be buying the car. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love my little red FR-S, but I went into it with my eyes open and knew what it was going to be. At the risk of being judgemental, I think you are expecting it to be more than it really is.

It's a car that gives you all the tools to have street legal and light track use fun. It may even be more than that with a few mods or in the hands of a more skilled driver.

It is not a pocket rocket, and wasn't intended to be. No "sustainable fun" street car I've ever driven had huge amounts of horsepower. HP give you bragging rights, and will make me smile, but only in short bursts. This car makes me smile constantly.

I've got around 600 miles on mine and every mile came with smiles. Even when the perverbial soccer Mom in the Honda Van today decided to power away from me at the stop light (yes that happened, but I wasn't really trying to prevent it).

For those that asked earlier, now that I've loosened up in it, and can drive it like I own it (rather than I'm borrowing it) it truly does channel all those great memories from my MK1 MR2 (all 110HP of it).

[ZetaVI]

Congrats. Really nice photos.

[alluringreality]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

The seats, driving position, and brake feel are all fantastic, but is that enough to buy a car on?

Mainly this car is currently at the top of my shopping list for the driving position. For under $30k the Miata is really the only car I can think of for a possibly-similar experience, but it feels like one size too small clothing for me. In this price range there's simply not a lot of competition when looking for a new low-profile rear wheel drive car.

Personally my secondary reason for looking at the BRZ/FR-S is the expected lower than average maintenance and operating cost, and because the tiny rear seat might make it more useful than a 2-seater. The last time I shopped sporty cars over 10 years ago I really liked the 300ZX, yet I bought a previous-generation Camaro since it was significantly cheaper to own. I'm sure everyone doesn't necessarily put much emphasis on a slight bit of practicality in a sporty car, yet if it can hold a straight line at interstate speeds in Kansas winds, one draw I see to this car is a reasonable cost of ownership.

[Ryephile]

First off, I want to totally apologize to NWIguy for accidentally thread jacking, I should've started my own thread. No harm intended.

Originally Posted by brianbot5000

Congrats! Although I think your Exige has skewed your perspective a bit - that thing is like a street legal go-kart (in a good way)....

Originally Posted by dsgerbc

If you're comparing to something much more expensive and end-up disappointed - it's your own fault. Compare to RX8 and go from there.

Let's put it this way; I've owned 19 cars to date, from crap cans to trucks to American muscle to Euro to Japanese. I'm also friends with several automotive media personalities. I also work in the auto industry. My father and I also build street rods for fun. I've driven many hundreds of different cars over the years. My current garage is only a snippet of my automotive perspective. Please, please don't think that I'm narrow enough to seriously make such ridiculous comparisons without understanding how out-of-context the comparisons are. I'm not strictly comparing the BRZ to any one car, as that would immediately pigeon-hole the car into something it may not be. Yes, the Exige is definitely the most visceral street vehicle I've owned, but I will hazard the statement that it's only opened my eyes to what's possible in one extreme. Of course, the 1962 Chrysler Imperial Crown convertible and/or Rolls Royce Silver Spur is the other extreme.

That said, the acid test of any test drive is when you get back into your own car and make a back-to-back comparison. Today, I had my Golf TDI. When I got back into the TDI from the BRZ, the immediate feeling was of ample and available torque, and how sprightly and quick about traffic it was versus the BRZ. That was the overwhelming sensation; not the more numb steering, the bus-driver seating position, or the better ride quality. That sense of torque reserve and potential gives a dynamism to the TDI that frankly the BRZ didn't project.

I haven't bought the car yet. I'm still waiting for the dealership to give me a quote on trading in the TDI, and I need to close on my auto loan. The BRZ is a fantastic car, it just doesn't feel like the perfect total package. I'm going to try to drive it again on Thursday and wring out the engine and find more corners to see if I simply didn't dig deep enough [rev high enough] to extract the essence of the car. At this point, I may step back and wait for Subaru or Scion to make the next evolution. To be honest, sometimes I don't "get" the car on my first test drive. I want to give it another shot.

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

This car makes me smile constantly.

That's what it's all about in the end, having fun.

[dsgerbc]

The more cars you've owned the harder it gets to find a new one that feels like a 'total package', for obvious reasons.
At this point I'm probably keeping my turbo-Subie just in case I'm really missing the turbo for DD.

The truck with my BRZ arrived late today. Delivery is scheduled for tomorrow afternoon.

[Lighting Red]

Originally Posted by dsgerbc

The more cars you've owned the harder it gets to find a new one that feels like a 'total package', for obvious reasons.
At this point I'm probably keeping my turbo-Subie just in case I'm really missing the turbo for DD.

The truck with my BRZ arrived late today. Delivery is scheduled for tomorrow afternoon.

First: NWIguy, to you for getting your car in! Those are the best pictures of a white BRZ I have ever seen. I would like to hear more of your thoughts on the car.

dsgerbc: You have come off as a cooler-headed member on this forum, so I am keenly interested in your assessment of the car.

After driving one of the pre-production models a few months back, I found that I really enjoyed the experience in the car. Therefore driving impressions, such as the one Ryephile gave are of great interest to me.

[NWIguy]

[QUOTE=Ryephile;221937]First off, I want to totally apologize to NWIguy for accidentally thread jacking, I should've started my own thread. No harm intended.



Its alright I appreciated your objective review of the car. I couldn't really agree or disagree since I haven't tested it out myself. Tomorrow will be the defining moment! Reviews to come!