Best Break-in Procedure

[DSR2409]

Originally Posted by Marrk

Some argue that the moly is from lube that is used in assembling the engine and has not much to do with break-in per se.

The only thing we know for sure is that some manufacturers, like Honda, advise in the Owner's Manuals of their vehicles not to change the factory oil until the first service (usually 7,500 miles). My question is: Why? Is it because the factory oil is special in some way? Is it because the factory does not want some eager beaver new owner to swap in fully synthetic oil too early in the life of the engine?

I am going to go out on a limb, and say that, if Honda says wait to change until 7500 miles, then it is already synthetic in there...

[mrtodd]

Originally Posted by Marrk

Some argue that the moly is from lube that is used in assembling the engine and has not much to do with break-in per se.

The only thing we know for sure is that some manufacturers, like Honda, advise in the Owner's Manuals of their vehicles not to change the factory oil until the first service (usually 7,500 miles). My question is: Why? Is it because the factory oil is special in some way? Is it because the factory does not want some eager beaver new owner to swap in fully synthetic oil too early in the life of the engine?

Agreed. Seems to be the question of the decade. I got all of my information about that on bobistheoilguy.com forums, don't know if you've already spent time there, but you usually can find some good info on that site - they seem to think it's unique.

And like DSR2409 said, it may very well be synthetic. On the latest Hondas it's actually recommended to change the oil when the car tells you to, which happens to be closer to 10,000 miles, actually. At the forum I mentioned above, people have tested the oil at several intervals and determined that the oil is about done right around ~7,500 miles....just like Marrk stated.

[mandm177]

I auto-x'ed my 350z with about 400 miles on it. no smoking or oil consumption when i sold it with close to 70k miles on it.

I think i like the hard break-in procedure...which is basically none?

[Joe@Amsoil]

Wow there is definitely a lot being said in here and all over the board as far as opinions. There is a lot of mis-information being passed around.

First thing that needs to be clarified is the statement "When oil is colder its thicker". This is a false statement. Going back to the basics, oil is rated by viscosity which is the oil's resistance to flow or simply put an oil's speed of flow as measured through a device known as a viscometer. The higher viscosity of an oil, the slower it will flow ie thicker. Looking at the stock fill for the BRZ its a 0w-20 oil. This means a 0 viscosity at cold operating temperatures and 20 viscosity at operating temps of 210*. On cold starts you need oil to flow quicker ie low viscosity ie THINNER oil to help reduce dry run time. So that being said.. when oil is a 0w-20 its THINNER at colder temps

Next statement I saw was Breakin oil = Mineral oil and Synthetics Take Longer. First ill take the Synthetics take longer as a compliment! That means were doing something right cause that means we are reducing wear! Now I wont touch on that comment but you are seeing a lot more cars coming out of the factory with synthetics as stock fills. The statement breakin oil = mineral oil nearly knocked me off my chair. Break ins are a very important step of an engines life to maximize performance. Mineral oils are compressible and contain contaminants. Synthetics are engineered with the correct levels of detergents, anti-wear additive, zinc and phosphorus. Which would you want running in your car during this critical point of time... Dinos remains sucked from the ground or something engineered in a lab with years of R&D by scientists and chemical engineers? Personally, Id take the engineered synthetic.


Now I can try and explain what the break in process is in my own words but Amsoil did so nicely for me so heres a classic copy and paste for you right from the Amsoil site.

"The primary goal during engine break-in is to seat the rings against the cylinder wall. Properly seated rings increase compression, resulting in maximum horsepower; they reduce oil consumption and prevent hot combustion gases from entering the crankcase. To achieve this, however, the oil must allow the correct level of “controlled wear” to occur between the cylinder wall/ring interface while maintaining wear protection on other critical engine parts. Insufficient break-in leaves behind peaks on the cylinder wall that prevent the rings from seating. The deeper valleys, meanwhile, allow excess oil to collect and burn during combustion, increasing oil consumption. Too much wear results in cylinder glazing due to peaks “rolling over” into the valleys and preventing oil from collecting and adequately lubricating the cylinder wall."

So well said...

Better yet, here is the link to the Break In oil that Amsoil offers. Take a read to the knowledge on this page.

http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/brk.aspx?zo=5001506

There is more to just piston seals that is important and should definitely be considered.

Now that being said. Everyone is going to have their own opinions as to what they want to do to their car. My personal opinion... Follow the manufacturers guide. From my personal experience it has saved engines and gotten maximum performance. I personally have a 2006 Evo 9 that I now race on the track. I followed the manufacturers guide to break in and around 3K miles started upgrading the car. My car was always around 20-25hp higher then other cars with the same mods tuned by the same tuner. I now have over 65K miles on the engine with all the stock internals. about 45K of those miles are at high boost, high horsepower and high rpm track miles. The engine is still running strong, compression is exactly where it was day 1 out of the factory and the cylinder walls still look brand new.


Like i said in the Fuel Additives thread. To each his own on how you want to do with your car but hopefully I can provide some correct information to help guide you in making your own decisions.

[Future]

Thanks for this post, great read. One question @ Joe, could it be possible that 0w20 isn't the "optimal" oil for this engine? I pretty much only see 0w20 as a way to reduce fuel consumption in new cars, if I plan to track the car shouldn't I use something "thicker" at high temp?

[Joe@Amsoil]

Hey Future. Another member on here had just asked me the same question. Here is what I just wrote him.

So the reduction in viscosity is becoming a new thing with manufacturers these days when the stock fill is a synthetic. The overall premise behind this is that in the old dino oils there were used contained contaminants and sub par molecular structures. Under higher pressures these oils would compress and in turn be thinner ie less protection. Nowadays with synthetic oils they are engineered with tightly woven molecular structures with in theory make them uncompressable (is that a word lol) There is still some debate about this out there but thats the underlying premise. Being said that a 20 weight yes is a thinner oil then a 30 weight but remember engines are designed with smaller tolerances these days. Thinner oils are able to get into tighter areas faster. Rule of thumb is you can always go up in viscosity NEVER DOWN! If your planning on running the car stock as a daily driver and enjoying it, stick with the recommended oil weight. If you start upgrading the car, putting a turbo on it and racing it then you could up to a 30 weight oil. Remember protection comes with additives as well. Zinc and phosphorus are what you really should be looking for in oils. They help lube and protect the high friction areas like cam lobes and cyl walls. The higher the better. Increasing weight helps against breakdown from heat and alcohols in the fuel so that the oil still protects and doesnt turn into... well..."water" lol

[SkullWorks]

Joe,

thanks for the corporate take.

go grab oil measure viscosity in your viscometer.

heat it 100 F put it back in your viscometer

wonder why you are so wrong?

the oil "acts like" SAE 0w when cold it isn't actually thinner when cold it's resistance to flow is actually greater. just not as great as it would be if it were a "straight weight" oil.

multi viscosity oil is full of friction modifiers, to make it more stable over a wider temp range, but the oil doesn't act inversely from normal oil in regards to temp vs viscosity, it is just less of a swing

and how can you tout your (snake) break-in oil and then say the best thing to do is follow manufacturers recommendation?

don't forget increase in oil weight also contributes to an increase in at the bearing temperature because of lower flow and higher pressure, increased strain on the oil pump drive....

I see you are trying to be helpful but it is hard with a banner that big and a corporate axe to grind,

[Genomaxter]

I think a visit to Bob is the Oil Guy is in order.

From a cold start (75 degree standard) there is no oil that is too thin.

A very easy experiment is a simple oil change. Drain cold oil compared to hot oil. Tell me which flows faster.

[naticedog04]

i just bought a 2011 toyota corolla type s last year in April. My first oil change was at 9800 miles on it about a month ago(took four big trips all over 300 miles). To my surprise the engine didnt blow up lol. After the oil was change by the toyota dealership, my car has gotten better gas mileage(only noticeble difference). Previous to getting the oil changed, I didnt have to do anything but drive the car, but i never pushed it cause i knew it was a brand new motor. Anyways, toyota does have a lot more to loose if peeps had to do any special "break-in" techniques because some of the stuff mentioned sounds tideous. Its a lot of work for the consumer and a bad name for Toyota if all their motors were blowing up. To add to this, my friend also bought a 2011 Toyota Tacoma and his first oil change was at 10K as well. He pushes his vehicles a lot harder than I do and he didnt blow up his motor either. As other peeps have mentioned, follow the owner's manual.

[Droopy]

Most of things Ive read on hear apply to a 100% brand-new engines, IE a full custom built engine and if your the one WHO BUILT IT. the production engine in passenger cars are started at the factory for checks and major problems, as for "break-in" for passenger cars follow the OM. Most if not all engine building companies now a days break-in the motor on a dyno. Also note, HIGH PROFORMANCE AND RACING ENGINES, not production engine, for the special break-in AMSOIL shows

[ngabdala]

I will break in according to what the manual says.

Subaru spent millions and weeks getting the best aerodynamics just for the rear wing on the new sti. If they are willing to do that, I know their engineers will know what's best.

I would think they know best about their engines. They're engineers.

Read the manual FTW

[cossey]

Originally Posted by Joe@Amsoil

Wow there is definitely a lot being said in here and all over the board as far as opinions. There is a lot of mis-information being passed around.

First thing that needs to be clarified is the statement "When oil is colder its thicker". This is a false statement. Going back to the basics, oil is rated by viscosity which is the oil's resistance to flow or simply put an oil's speed of flow as measured through a device known as a viscometer. The higher viscosity of an oil, the slower it will flow ie thicker. Looking at the stock fill for the BRZ its a 0w-20 oil. This means a 0 viscosity at cold operating temperatures and 20 viscosity at operating temps of 210*. On cold starts you need oil to flow quicker ie low viscosity ie THINNER oil to help reduce dry run time. So that being said.. when oil is a 0w-20 its THINNER at colder temps

This is entirely false!
As Skullworks correctly said 0w-20 means that the oil acts like a mono weight 0w grade when cold and a mono weight 20 when hot ie the viscosity changes less with temperature than a straight 0W grade (which would be too thin when hot).

This is due to the viscosity modifiers mixed into the oil which are long chain molecules that ball up at low temperatures allowing the oil to flow more freely but then uncoil at higher temperatures and tangle together increasing the effective viscosity of the oil.

Go and read this http://www.ideas4ag-ed.com/uploads/3..._viscosity.pdf

I am quite frankly shocked that a representative from a supposedly well respected oil manufacturer can't get his facts correct.

[chulooz]

Zombie thread!

Outch... hard to watch a distributor BS the forums.

Im interested to see the early stages of this engines reliability (and break-in procedures) once the cars really get spread out to the masses.

[trackmagic]

Bounce it off the rev limiter a few times to break it in...I saw a scion dealership do this.