PLM Long Tube Header

[xwd]

It's kind of a long process to get a patent on the design, so I doubt it. If they are making the parts in Taiwan or elsewhere which I'm sure they are, even more difficult to really do anything.

You just have to hope people are willing to spend the money on the real genuine part and not some lower quality replica...

[tennisfreak]

Companies like this would not have a chance if the original companies, like Nameless, were not charging such ungodly high prices.

$1200 for a header, jesus friggin crissakes, they are ripping people off.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Hyper4mance2k

Hopefully Nameless was smart enough to patent their product.

US patents aren't worth a penny in China, so if a company overseas copies something you'll never get anything out of them over it. Happens ALL the time in the RC industry, companies will sell 100% clones of existing products and even label them as being 100% parts compatible with the originals as a selling feature.

[JB86'd]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Companies like this would not have a chance if the original companies, like Nameless, were not charging such ungodly high prices.

$1200 for a header, jesus friggin crissakes, they are ripping people off.

They have the right to charge whatever they feel their product is worth, which includes development, production, etc. etc. Nobody is forced to buy it. Doesn't give anyone else the right to infringe on their design and undercut their original creation.

[Shady195]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Companies like this would not have a chance if the original companies, like Nameless, were not charging such ungodly high prices.

$1200 for a header, jesus friggin crissakes, they are ripping people off.

THis debate can go on forever but there is time and money spent in the development and testing. Also depending on whether or not these are made/welded here in the US or overseas.. depending on the shops price/labor rate they may only be making a few hundred bucks per header.

With that said, im all for getting a good deal on something thats just as good. I'm not rich, i was planning on buying a ptuning but realized until I boost my car, im not gonna waste time getting a custom tune for the best HP on such a pricey piece so i mine as well just get the best deal I can on a header to use with the OTS tunes..

Its shitty for nameless, but its a consumer market and well thats just how shit works.

[Hyper4mance2k]

Originally Posted by wparsons

US patents aren't worth a penny in China, so if a company overseas copies something you'll never get anything out of them over it. Happens ALL the time in the RC industry, companies will sell 100% clones of existing products and even label them as being 100% parts compatible with the originals as a selling feature.

Ture, but I thought PLM was stateside.

[2016 Camaro SS]

Mishimoto did the same crap to Grimmspeed in their intake thread. Also ripped Perrin's CAI off too first. I like to reward the original designers for their time, effort, and R&D put into the original product.

[Ryan@Nameless]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Companies like this would not have a chance if the original companies, like Nameless, were not charging such ungodly high prices.

$1200 for a header, jesus friggin crissakes, they are ripping people off.

You get a $500 header when you take away 11 prototypes and a year's worth of R&D and testing.

Companies like this wouldn't have a chance if they didn't rip off the hard work of others to make their profits.

Thanks to everyone for the positive support, and a special thanks to @JDLAutoDesign for the mutual respect. Even as competitors in the same market, hard work recognizes hard work.

-Ryan @ Nameless

[tennisfreak]

Not denying your hard work and not saying this company is justified in copying your product just giving a reason why people will buy their knock offs.

11 prototypes and a years worth of testing for a product that provides no clear benefit over the competition in a market where there happens to be quite a lot of competition to begin with.

The Nameless header was the #1 topic on this forum for close to a year and when it was finally released and the unicorn juice turned into pickle juice. Dynos came out to be underwhelming and and product enthusiasm died pretty fast.

Kudos for the hard work and craftsmanship but in the end it seemed like a lot of wasted time.

[DM7]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Not denying your hard work and not saying this company is justified in copying your product just giving a reason why people will buy their knock offs.

11 prototypes and a years worth of testing for a product that provides no clear benefit over the competition in a market where there happens to be quite a lot of competition to begin with.

The Nameless header was the #1 topic on this forum for close to a year and when it was finally released and the unicorn juice turned into pickle juice. Dynos came out to be underwhelming and and product enthusiasm died pretty fast.

Kudos for the hard work and craftsmanship but in the end it seemed like a lot of wasted time.

Thanks for your opinion.

Cosworth has an opinion on the Nameless header as well. Apparently they didn't think the time and effort to develop the header was wasted and paired the Nameless header with their supercharger kit.

[Cross]

Everyone is going to have an opinion and frankly it doesn't matter. To me I am honestly concerned mostly with the 3k or so RPM TRQ dip but I will be running E85 so we shall see and I will admit the sound will be another point. This will be the 3rd header I have tried and I really like the UEL sound so this EL sound will be a first for me.

Either way I did not buy the Nameless one but I do respect the time and work it took for them to get a finish product. I completely respect and understand that and continue to wish them luck with everything else they make. I have seen their products first hand on other BRZ/FRS member vehicles and they looked and sounded great.

[350matt]

lets face it its going to produce more or less the same result as the original part, maybe it will act a as a wake up to Nameless that their part is just too expensive?

not that I don't think this is shame of course - Nameless should be rewarded for their hard work

[kbye]

If I create a painting and want to sell it for $200 bucks, then someone takes my painting, makes photocopies and sells it for $50 bucks, would I drop my original price to compete with my own copies? Eff that!

[Kwaziekeller]

Aside from the obvious resemblance to the Nameless header, they are probably some differences in quality and materials as well. They could have changed the primary tubing diameter, or exit flange sizing therefore making it "different". I'm sure tubing thickness, material, etc are different as well, and probably not up to the standard of Nameless' products.

I came here looking for some info on this header, and basically discovered it's a knock off. I support the community, and have bought plenty of parts. Others have had success with PLM, but this kind of reduces PLM to Chinese EBay knockoffs imo . Since I plan to go turbo down the road, a header has always been an "intermediate" part to me. If I can get one for the right price, I'll do it to enjoy the gains while I save for FI, but an imitation isn't always worth it's cheaper price tag.