What do you think of this set up? (Audio)

[keithr]

Originally Posted by MrSeldowski

Hey Keithr...

Hey, I don't want to jack this thread and make it about me. I'll answer you via PM and when I get a few minutes I'll do a post with a write-up and pics.

[MikeM7]

Ended up going with this. Might mess with the door speakers and stuff later, but I figure this should hold me over.

[gramicci101]

Once you get it all installed and you're working on properly setting EQ, look into the Dayton iMM-6 calibrated mic ($18 on Amazon) and the AudioTools app from Studio Six Digital ($10 on iOS App Store). The mic is designed to work with iOS or Android, so you can put the app on your phone or tablet and get proper in-car measurements.

Its SPL measurement only goes up to 127 dB, so if you're looking for straight up SPL, I'd get a different mic. This one is designed more for frequency response so you can get your crossovers correct and account for different speaker sensitivities.

[MikeM7]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

Once you get it all installed and you're working on properly setting EQ, look into the Dayton iMM-6 calibrated mic ($18 on Amazon) and the AudioTools app from Studio Six Digital ($10 on iOS App Store). The mic is designed to work with iOS or Android, so you can put the app on your phone or tablet and get proper in-car measurements.

Its SPL measurement only goes up to 127 dB, so if you're looking for straight up SPL, I'd get a different mic. This one is designed more for frequency response so you can get your crossovers correct and account for different speaker sensitivities.

Cool, I'll definitely look into that. Thanks for the tip.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by keithr

Hey, I don't want to jack this thread and make it about me. I'll answer you via PM and when I get a few minutes I'll do a post with a write-up and pics.

Please!
You are now my go to guy for audio info.

[thill]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

Once you get it all installed and you're working on properly setting EQ, look into the Dayton iMM-6 calibrated mic ($18 on Amazon) and the AudioTools app from Studio Six Digital ($10 on iOS App Store). The mic is designed to work with iOS or Android, so you can put the app on your phone or tablet and get proper in-car measurements.

Its SPL measurement only goes up to 127 dB, so if you're looking for straight up SPL, I'd get a different mic. This one is designed more for frequency response so you can get your crossovers correct and account for different speaker sensitivities.

Fyi.

http://studiosixdigital.com/audio-ha...ted-microphon/

I would pony up and buy a nicer mic and use REW and a Windows laptop. Assuming you have a Windows laptop a decent mic is under $100 and REW is free. AVS forum has all the info you could ever need on how to use the mic and REW.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by thill

Fyi.

http://studiosixdigital.com/audio-ha...ted-microphon/

I would pony up and buy a nicer mic and use REW and a Windows laptop. Assuming you have a Windows laptop a decent mic is under $100 and REW is free. AVS forum has all the info you could ever need on how to use the mic and REW.

Oh yes, I love AVS Forum. A nicer mic is definitely preferable, but for a one-time use for car stereo I wouldn't really worry about it. Especially in our cars where the noise floor is so high. If he was setting up his home theater or building and testing speakers and crossovers, then yes. Spend the money and get a better mic. For myself, I would get a UMIK-1.

[keithr]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Please!
You are now my go to guy for audio info.

Well....................there's your first mistake.



Really though, I'm just an OCD engineer who over-analyzes and over-researches everything.

I will post a write-up, I took lots of pictures along the way hoping they might prove useful to someone in the future. I just have not had any time to sit down and pull the info together. I can't say *when* I'll get to it, but I will. In the meantime, I will happily answer any specific questions to the best of my ability. I never pretended to be a "real pro." But, since doing my system I've had very sincere compliments from 3 very respectable high-end shops who've seen my car for one reason or another, so I guess I'm not a complete idiot.

[keithr]

Originally Posted by MikeM7

Ended up going with this.

Good choices, one note of caution, though...

That amp is actually not rated for 2 ohm mono operation. The manual explicitly says not to do that, and the Stealthbox is a 2 ohm mono load.

While it may /work/, you're going to be operating outside the specified parameters of that amp (warranty void). You're also going to be sending way more power than the sub was built to handle. Before anyone chimes in with "set the gain all the way down" -- that's not the correct way to solve this problem. It's still a 2 ohm load, and the amp is likely to overheat and, depending on how you install it and how hard you drive the system, you may cause permanent damage to the amp and/or sub.

For basically the same money, I really think this is a better/safer choice:

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...NVX-MVPA1.html

...or another amp of similar RMS power, rated stable for 2 ohm mono operation. It will be a much more appropriate match for the sub's specifications. If you're worried that it won't be enough power -- it will. Trust me. If you set your gain correctly, you can get 400W RMS+ out of it without clipping or distortion, which is EXACTLY perfect for that sub.

A class D amp will also run a lot cooler and typically be quite a bit smaller (physically) for equivalent power output, making installation a WHOLE lot easier too.

[MikeM7]

Originally Posted by keithr

Good choices, one note of caution, though...

That amp is actually not rated for 2 ohm mono operation. The manual explicitly says not to do that, and the Stealthbox is a 2 ohm mono load.

While it may /work/, you're going to be operating outside the specified parameters of that amp (warranty void). You're also going to be sending way more power than the sub was built to handle. Before anyone chimes in with "set the gain all the way down" -- that's not the correct way to solve this problem. It's still a 2 ohm load, and the amp is likely to overheat and, depending on how you install it and how hard you drive the system, you may cause permanent damage to the amp and/or sub.

For basically the same money, I really think this is a better/safer choice:

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...NVX-MVPA1.html

...or another amp of similar RMS power, rated stable for 2 ohm mono operation. It will be a much more appropriate match for the sub's specifications. If you're worried that it won't be enough power -- it will. Trust me. If you set your gain correctly, you can get 400W RMS+ out of it without clipping or distortion, which is EXACTLY perfect for that sub.

A class D amp will also run a lot cooler and typically be quite a bit smaller (physically) for equivalent power output, making installation a WHOLE lot easier too.

Yeah I already figured out I got the wrong amp. Luckily Crutchfield has a good return policy, so I'm just going to buy an amp from the place that's doing the install. Also getting door speakers from them.

I got in a hurry because I decided I wanted to get this done by Saturday for the twisted sisters group drive here in SA, so I just picked one so I could get the order in. I'll stick with my head unit and sub, have them provide the amp and door speakers, do the install, and remove the rear speakers as I hear they are useless anyway.

They said they'd do the install for 100 bucks, and they got really good yelp reviews. My roomate also bought his system from them and had them install it, he was happy with them.

I'll report back on Friday and let you know what happens and how it turns out.

[keithr]

Originally Posted by MikeM7

They said they'd do the install for 100 bucks

$100?? Where are they mounting the amp?

$100 is downright cheap. Let us know how it turns out!

[MikeM7]

Originally Posted by keithr

$100?? Where are they mounting the amp?

$100 is downright cheap. Let us know how it turns out!

Change of plans. I decided that place was a little shady, and since it's going to rain all weekend I think the twisted sisters run is postponed, so I've got some time and am not going to rush this.

I'm sticking with the JL stealthbox, and the pioneer head unit which both arrived today.

I'm debating whether or not to keep that 4ohm 2 channel amp, as my buddy said it would be great for the door speakers and to just get a 2nd for the Sub. Also haven't even begun looking for an amp but I'd like to keep it around 100-150. (Edit: Something like this would probably be what I need for the sub right? http://www.crutchfield.com/p_777M150...ce-M-1500.html)

I'm debating sound deadening, in terms of what kind to use, to do it myself or include with install, where to do it, or if I should do it at all. There's a thread on here somewhere where someone said they used equivalent materials from home depot for a fraction of the cost, I'll have to dig that one up.

I'm also still planning on removing the rear speaker.

I found another place that looks a little more reputable, and the bad reviews that do come up have been responded to by the owner very professionally, offering to correct the issues and on one of them even a 25% discount on their next job. They want 150 for the basic install, which sounds a little more realistic to me.

The other place, I saw a review that said they scratched up his interior.. and with these scratch happy interiors our cars have that really scares me. There were several reviews that said they just didn't know what they were doing too, so I'm staying away from that.

Anyway.. I'm in the market for an amp to power the stealthbox, door speakers, and sound deadening, and appreciate any advice.

[gramicci101]

I'd get the NVX mentioned earlier in this thread. It'll do the job nicely and it has a very small footprint, so you can tuck it anywhere. I've got my sub amp sitting right next to my door amp.

For the doors, consider an Alpine KTP-445U. You can bridge it to 2 channels at 90w at 4 ohms, which will be perfect for a decent 6.5 in the doors.

And if you want to keep all the 3.5s in the cabin, another 445U running as four channel would do very nicely.

[keithr]

Originally Posted by MikeM7

Something like this would probably be what I need for the sub right? http://www.crutchfield.com/p_777M150...ce-M-1500.html

It's fine from a power perspective, but consider this... that's a big amp. It's 15-1/4" x 9-13/16" x 2-1/8". Where you gonna put it?

If you were to keep the Pioneer amp for your front speakers, not only is the power complete overkill for most of the speakers you'd be considering, but it's also pretty hefty: 13-3/4" x 2-1/2" x 8-1/2". We don't have a lot of space in our cars to hide amps without extensive custom work and expense. So, it's either really expensive to do it clean, or it's really ghetto looking.

Those are both also class AB amps. AB amps make good sound (most of the time) but they tend to run hot. So, not only do you need to make sure you have lots of physical space to mount the things, but you have to make sure you have adequate airflow around them so they don't cook.

Also, I don't see anything saying that the M-1500 is CEA 2006 certified. CEA 2006 is an industry rating standard to ensure that amplifier manufacturers aren't lying. Ever seen a 1500W amp for $50? Yeah, there's a lot that goes into amplifier power and many manufacturers of budget amps were known for inflating their claims and producing garbage that would damage your equipment.

If you're looking for advice, here's mine: Return the Pioneer amp, don't get the M-1500.

Get something Class D. They're smaller, more efficient, draw less power off your car's electrical system, and run a lot cooler.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, for your sub:

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...NVX-MVPA1.html

Just to reiterate, look at the physical size, and look at the power output. Look at how perfectly it matches to the power rating for your JL Stealthbox. Your Pioneer head unit is going to put out a quality 4V pre-out signal, and your installer should be able to tune your gain to get 400W RMS out of that little amp with no problem at all. It's going to run very cool, being Class D, and it's going to be **MUCH** easier to find a place to install it.

Now, for other options...

Originally Posted by MikeM7

I'm also still planning on removing the rear speaker.

That's fine, your prerogative. Personally, I like having some rear fill, but others don't.

If you're set on nixing the rears, you only need 3 channels. You can get a good 4-channel Class D amp that will let you bridge to 3 channels -- be aware that not all 4 channel amps can do this, or, I should say, some *can* but you *shouldn't*, others flat out won't work.

Or, you can get a 3 channel amp.

The JL Audio XD500/3v2 is a favorite of mine. There are others, of course, just be careful to know exactly the specs on what you're getting. Quality is worth paying for.

The JL amp will fit under your trunk carpet on the passenger side, all you have to do is cut out a little of the styrofoam. My XD700/5v2 fit there beautifully and the 3 channel is almost 2 inches smaller. There are pics on other threads of people who have put the 3-channel in, here's my XD700/5v2:





Alternatively, you can pick up the matching NVX 4 channel amp I've previously mentioned: http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...NVX-MVPA4.html

You'll have 2 extra channels to add rear speakers someday should you decide you want them, or if you ended up going with front speakers that needed more power, you can bridge the amp to 2 channels. Wouldn't be necessary with most speakers that'll be looking for 60-90W RMS.

Even though it's 2 amps, they're both tiny and would be a cinch to install almost anywhere.

If you're looking to do this in stages, I'd emphatically recommend that route. Start with the NVX mono amp for your your sub, down the road you can add the other NVX for your new front speakers.

I will say this though, if your plan is to add an amp down the road for front speakers, wire for it now. Run a 4 AWG power wire and 4 AWG ground and get a distribution block to feed 8 AWG to the NVX amp. That way, when the time comes for the other amp, you don't need to run another power wire off your battery, you can get a second 8 AWG off the dist. block. I'll watch as others say you need 2 AWG or 0 AWG, but, you don't. For the amount of power you'll need, 4 AWG is more than enough.

Originally Posted by MikeM7

I'm debating sound deadening, in terms of what kind to use, to do it myself or include with install, where to do it, or if I should do it at all.

I recommend you do it. The extent to which you do it is up to you. I did pretty much the whole car. Do you NEED to do that? Depends on what you're looking for. I wanted to cut down road noise and "tighten up" the ambient noise inside the cabin as well as improve the audio system's sound quality.

I suggest you read through the http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/ website first -- there's a lot of extremely valuable information there to help you understand what each method and each area of the car entails, and the benefits of each. You can email Don off the contact page and he will work with you to devise a plan that best meets your needs. He's a really top-notch guy to work with.

If you pay a shop to do it, the labor costs can add up real quick and you'll want to make sure they are well-versed in real sound deadening -- a lot of audio shops just want to slap some Dynamat on your doors and call it a day. There are a lot more places inside your car that are going to make noise other than just your doors.

Originally Posted by MikeM7

There's a thread on here somewhere where someone said they used equivalent materials from home depot for a fraction of the cost, I'll have to dig that one up.

Yeah, I've seen it, and I researched it quite a bit....and then I bought my stuff from Don. Yes, it cost quite a bit more. But, with the Home Depot kind of stuff, as you'll find, it's much harder to know exactly what you're getting. You don't want CLD tiles with asphalt adhesive, as you're certain to find at HD because they're meant for roofing. MLV (mass-loaded vinyl), for example, can have different chemical makeup for the vinyl and you could be introducing VOC's or other harmful fumes into your car, because those products maybe weren't intended for enclosed space use. You could also get funky smells from construction-grade materials.

Don's very careful about the materials and manufacturing. You can trust his stuff, and I've been very happy with it and with his service.

Caveat Emptor.

Originally Posted by MikeM7

I found another place that looks a little more reputable, and the bad reviews that do come up have been responded to by the owner very professionally, offering to correct the issues and on one of them even a 25% discount on their next job. They want 150 for the basic install, which sounds a little more realistic to me.

Even $150 is pretty cheap, and I'm surprised they're quoting you anything without knowing exactly what gear you want installed and exactly how you want it installed. I'd be leery of cookie-cutter pricing and potentially a cookie-cutter install job.

I had a shop here quote me over $1000 in labor to do my setup. Granted, mine was a bit more involved than yours is (at this stage), but, really, assuming your "phase 1" install is 50% of what mine was (you're still doing the head unit, amp (or amps), and stealthbox), you still need wiring, you still need the amp located somewhere nice (I wouldn't let them jam it under a passenger seat like many places want to do...), 50% is still a $500 or so install.

I chose to do it myself because not only could I save the money, but I could be as slow, meticulous, and methodical as I wanted to be. Any shop, especially a bargain price, is just going to want the get the job done and out the door quickly.

Caveat Emptor.