When does driving MT get "fun"

[Jeff Lange]

You don't have to, but you should.

When you are upshifting, the revs are already dropping, so you can catch it at the right spot for the next gear. When downshifting, the revs need to go up to match, you do this by blipping the throttle to get it to rev up. If you don't, the clutch spins up the engine to match, but this wears the clutch and in extreme situations can actually slow the tires down instead of revving the engine up (rain/ice), this can cause sliding/loss of control.

Jeff

[ArKiTeCkT]

Not sure if im doing this right but when im travelling on the highway 100km and exit I DO NOT DOWNSHIFT. I shift it to neutral when Im at 20-30km and come to a complete stop.

[Ad8707]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lange

You don't have to, but you should.

When you are upshifting, the revs are already dropping, so you can catch it at the right spot for the next gear. When downshifting, the revs need to go up to match, you do this by blipping the throttle to get it to rev up. If you don't, the clutch spins up the engine to match, but this wears the clutch and in extreme situations can actually slow the tires down instead of revving the engine up (rain/ice), this can cause sliding/loss of control.

Jeff

Blipping the throttle when downshifting, when is the proper way to do it? Is it when the clutch is depressed after downshifting or releasing the clutch or do I have to put it in neutral then blip then downshift again...aren't they same thing since neutral and holding the clutch fully down Releases the engine from tranny.

[Ad8707]

Hope that made sense lol

[Jeff Lange]

Blip the throttle after you push the clutch in, while going to the next gear. Double clutching (releasing the clutch when you put the transmission in neutral and then pushing it back in before going to your desired gear) is, for the most part, a thing of the past. New transmissions (like any transmission from the last 25-30 years), don't need it.

Essentially: clutch in, blip throttle to rev match while selecting gear, clutch out.

If you do this while braking, you blip the throttle with your right foot while braking with your right foot. That is heel-toe.

The timing on all of this is something that varies between what you are doing, what car you are driving, etc., but the process is generally the same.

Jeff

[FT86FRS]

So which way would be better for going to a complete stop, downshifting to decelerate or pop it to neutral and use the brakes? I normally downshift on my eagle talon not sure if that's the proper/better way

[Turbowned]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

Audi seems to have no problem winning lemans with your "not really manual" gearbox, i guess that's not a real sports car then..

Using your 2nd foot in no way makes the car more sports like.

The whole point of a manual car is dictating what gear you are in, it's unfortunate that we require a crutch to operate it as such. The clutch is stone age technology. You people really need to start looking ahead.

And yes i said you people.

Really? You're comparing a $1,000,000+ Le Mans Prototype to a $25,000 Scion? Really? A $50,000 sequentual gearbox in no way compares to the little $1,100 automatic transmission in the FR-S. And if you've ever driven an R8 road car with the R-Tronic sequential auto (I have) you would know why so many people prefer it with the manual transmission! I drive a manual S4, and I wouldn't dare trade it for any of the SMG-equipped S4's, S5's, TT's, etc. They're not even remotely as much fun to drive!

To the OP, give it more time. My friend Andrew hated driving stick his first couple weeks. He bought a manual car out of necessity and was forced to learn on it. After a month's time, he was not only good at it, but he loved driving manual! He even said to me, "Now I know what you've been talking about all along! This is so much better than automatic!"

[TheJuggernaut]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lange

Blip the throttle after you push the clutch in, while going to the next gear. Double clutching (releasing the clutch when you put the transmission in neutral and then pushing it back in before going to your desired gear) is, for the most part, a thing of the past. New transmissions (like any transmission from the last 25-30 years), don't need it.

+1 synchros were invented to remove the need for double clutching.

[Jeff Lange]

Originally Posted by FT86FRS

So which way would be better for going to a complete stop, downshifting to decelerate or pop it to neutral and use the brakes? I normally downshift on my eagle talon not sure if that's the proper/better way

You shouldn't be doing one or the other, you should be doing both.

You shouldn't just be coasting in neutral just braking, and you shouldn't just downshift and then pull out the clutch to decelerate. You should be braking and downshifting when coming to a stop, preferably with rev-matching to avoid wear on the clutch.

Jeff

[Sport-Tech]

Originally Posted by FT86FRS

So which way would be better for going to a complete stop, downshifting to decelerate or pop it to neutral and use the brakes? I normally downshift on my eagle talon not sure if that's the proper/better way

For casual daily driving strong engine braking is really not needed, you are not going to wear out your brake pads significantly faster by braking without downshifting, you will still get some engine braking value as long as you don't push the clutch in - just remember to push in the clutch before the rpm drops to the point where the engine is about to stall (say 1500 rpm). Going down 4-3-2-1 every 2 minutes for every red light is just too much work.

And on heel-toe, which I am currently trying to learn - it's not easy, learn it on a PC wheel before risking your new car's transmission - you are going to make lots of mistakes, it can be frustrating.

[Slartibartfast]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

Audi seems to have no problem winning lemans with your "not really manual" gearbox, i guess that's not a real sports car then..

Using your 2nd foot in no way makes the car more sports like.

The whole point of a manual car is dictating what gear you are in, it's unfortunate that we require a crutch to operate it as such. The clutch is stone age technology. You people really need to start looking ahead.

And yes i said you people.

Yes, I know the Ferrari 458 is only available with paddle shifters because its faster, but I still can't buy one. I've driven Porsche's with PDK, and double clutch Audi's, and the FR-S auto. Yes I know the technology is getting better. They can shift faster than I can. They are even getting better fuel economy now. But I need to feel part of the system. Not just a controller. I need to feel the gears engaging in my hand. I need to feel the connection in my left foot. ( yeah, I prefer not to have power steering too, but not too many cars come without power steering these day)

Their will be a day when the steering wheel is replaced by a joystick, or a PS3 type controller in your hand. Steering by wire, the car will interpret your inputs and make steering corrections for you. It will all work in conjunction with traction control, VSC, ABS etc etc. it will be BETTER, FASTER, SAFER. But... It will not be driving.

When you pull off a 5th - 2nd heel-toe down shift perfectly, threshold braking all the way, arriving at an Apex in the right gear, it makes you feel on top of the world.
You say "The whole point of a manual car is dictating what gear you are in", I couldn't disagree more.

[Sport-Tech]

^ If you can consistently do perfectly-matched heel/toes as you describe, great, but for those that can't they risk prematurely wearing out their clutch or causing other drivetrain issues through shock. Plus they will never be able to enjoy driving their car at 10/10ths through a corner if they don't heel/toe because they will have to do all their braking first, take their foot off the brake to blip/downshift, and then head for the apex. There is something very satisfying about snapping off a perfect paddle downshift right as you clip the apex without unsettling the car. It may be more fun to do the same thing with heel/toe, but it's a better alternative than endless frustration.

[pastuch]

Originally Posted by Heero

Wow looks like there's alot of love for the MT out there! Thanks for the support everyone.

I'll admit I enjoy driving on open roads, but rush hour traffic really irks me. & Yes, I choose MT because it was cheaper, but also because of all the hype around driving a manual car lol

I still have another Couple weeks before the FRS rolls in to decide...

Quick questions for those who drive MT:

1. Whenever I shift gears (especially downshifting) my car jerks like the gears going in really rough. Do I just need to shift quicker? or more gas?

2. How do I control reverse gear? My reverse is pretty darn fast as soon as I release the clutch. ATM I'm just riding the clutch - but I'm guessing that's bad?

Thanks

Most beginners don't let the clutch up slowly enough when up or downshifting. It's not an on/off switch.

[FT86FRS]

I always prefer driving a manual, I simply feel like i'm interacting with the vehicle. Auto's are nice when you have heavy traffic jam or what not but it gets so dull....