Twins vs 2015 z06

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

Only reason that the entire thread upsets me is because when people go around acting like the Twins are the end all be all of cars, it makes the rest of us look like ass-hats. I actually have to be seen driving around my car and I don't like that the community is turning into the new Civic or WRX community in their way of thinking.

I don't care if people were running around saying that the twins are better than ferraris.... DO NOT compare this community to a civic or WRX community EVER@@!!!!that's just wrong on so many levels.


Jaden

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by Jaden

I don't care if people were running around saying that the twins are better than ferraris.... DO NOT compare this community to a civic or WRX community EVER@@!!!!that's just wrong on so many levels.


Jaden

Then stop acting like them.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by DylanFRS

Then stop acting like them.

There's no comparison between a twin and a civic... sorry...

You think I'M@ acting like them???? haha in what way pray tell????

Jaden

[DylanFRS]

Originally Posted by Jaden

There's no comparison between a twin and a civic... sorry...

You think I'M@ acting like them???? haha in what way pray tell????

Jaden

I said The Community, not the car... Don't be a girl about it and try to misinterpret my words...

Well there are a lot of posts on this forum I could go find to cite, but regarding this specific post:

The whole "My cheap BLANK car could easily beat this car more expensive BLANK car with BLANK amount of money in mods" discussion, exact same thing that the WRX and Civic people do.

[Atropine]

Originally Posted by Jaden

There's no comparison between a twin and a civic... sorry...

You think I'M@ acting like them???? haha in what way pray tell????

Jaden

Page 3 and 4 of this very thread...

You think a 250 or 300 HP will pull on an SRT8 Challenger.

The twins are a great platform.

But if you reasonably plan on dropping 20k (or more) into a Twin...you probably bought the wrong car.

Civic and WRX guys think, "I will just add turbo or a bigger turbo and I will be better than XXXX".

There is more a sports car than Peak HP.

A 330 HP WRX is not as good as a 305 HP STi, because the STi has better breaks, transfer case and suspension.

A 260 HP Civic is not better than a 240 HP S2000. The S2k has a way better suspension (and looks amazing).

A 330 Camaro is not better than a 276 HP NSX because...well it is an NSX.

That is the thing.

The Twins are GREAT for the money. But once you start putting HUGE money into it (and I mean 15k+) you probably should have just bought a higher tiered car.

Whether you should have bought a Vette, WRX/STi, Exige or Cayman.

Here is a chart...

Your Budget = car you should consider

25k = Twin or WRX (depends on taste RWD vs AWD)
30k = Twin or WRX or Mustang (feel vs speed...your pick)
35k = Mustang GT Track pack or some mods for Twin
40k = Here is where you need to be looking at something other than a Twin, because you can get a STi or Exige or Cayman rather easily
The further you get about 35k...the more options you have for true world beaters...

BTW Jaden, I still enjoy your posts and think you are a cool guy. I just wanted to point out that the whole "My car is da best car eva!" attitude is what makes the Civic and WRX community so gross.

[enjetek]

Amen atropine

[Model Citizen]

Haven't read the thread, but it isn't quite a sticker + mods vs sticker comparison.

Taxes, etc all should be factored as well.

Here in mass there is a 6.25% sales tax, and excise of $25 per thousand annually with a changing percentage scale as the vehicle ages.

so for simple numbers on a 3 year ownership

25k frs sticker
1562.5 sales tax
562.5 excise year 1
375 excise year 2
250 excise year 3
27775 total
2,775 sunk cost in taxes

There probably isn't much of a chance of getting a z06 for the 80k msrp after dealer optioning, markups, delivery, etc. so lets go with 2 figures, 80k and a more realistic 90k. The frs at this point is findable at 25k or less all day every day, in the real world less unless you are a retard at negotiations and deal finding.

80k z06 sticker
5000 sales tax
1800 excise year 1
1200 excise year 2
800 excise year 3
87,000 total
7,000 sunk cost in taxes


90k z06 sticker likely real world
5,625 sales tax
2,025 excise year 1
1,350 excise year 2
900 excise year 3
99,900 total
9,900 sunk cost in taxes

In other states this could be better or worse, and isn't accounting for income tax deduction of those payments. Regardless, theres a pretty sizable difference between the sunk tax costs between the two options.

After factoring in other real world costs i.e. operating (lol tires), depreciation (80k+ has more room to fall than 25, period), lost gains on assets, etc on a 3 year basis the picture painted of 10-20k of mods into an frs isn't that terrible an idea. It sure as hell isn't a good idea either, but looked at over a 3 year span it becomes a bit less painful.

It varies for everyone, on my end the idea of pissing that much away to the state wether it can be afforded or not is a heart breaker, that plus doing the math on actual real world ownership costs really take the edge off being a retard and crying myself to sleep at night for being past balls deep in this car.

The z06 is a far better car and platform, dump in a load of mod $ into an frs/brz and it still it isn't debatable. But either are far more than can be utilized on legal roads. On the track the vast majority of those who can afford the z06 won't be able to fully utilize it, same can be said about the modded frs just to a lesser extent.

Basically either option at the end of the day are a lot like having a 16" **** and living in a village of midgets. You may get a bunch of attention but good luck using it all and not ending up seriously injuring someone.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by Atropine

Page 3 and 4 of this very thread...

You think a 250 or 300 HP will pull on an SRT8 Challenger.

The twins are a great platform.

But if you reasonably plan on dropping 20k (or more) into a Twin...you probably bought the wrong car.

Civic and WRX guys think, "I will just add turbo or a bigger turbo and I will be better than XXXX".

There is more a sports car than Peak HP.

A 330 HP WRX is not as good as a 305 HP STi, because the STi has better breaks, transfer case and suspension.

A 260 HP Civic is not better than a 240 HP S2000. The S2k has a way better suspension (and looks amazing).

A 330 Camaro is not better than a 276 HP NSX because...well it is an NSX.

That is the thing.

The Twins are GREAT for the money. But once you start putting HUGE money into it (and I mean 15k+) you probably should have just bought a higher tiered car.

Whether you should have bought a Vette, WRX/STi, Exige or Cayman.

Here is a chart...

Your Budget = car you should consider

25k = Twin or WRX (depends on taste RWD vs AWD)
30k = Twin or WRX or Mustang (feel vs speed...your pick)
35k = Mustang GT Track pack or some mods for Twin
40k = Here is where you need to be looking at something other than a Twin, because you can get a STi or Exige or Cayman rather easily
The further you get about 35k...the more options you have for true world beaters...

BTW Jaden, I still enjoy your posts and think you are a cool guy. I just wanted to point out that the whole "My car is da best car eva!" attitude is what makes the Civic and WRX community so gross.

I can easily buy and make a 2002 camaro SS vastly superior to a twin for less money.

I just like the challenge of taking a 200hp 4 banger and putting it into super car territory...

I'll pm you here in a sec...

Jaden

[thill]

Some of you should go look in the classifieds and actually understand what a heavily modified ($$$$) FT86 goes for.. I know people don't like to talk about this who do mod heavily, but very few people ever get what they put into these cars once they start modifying for big power and performance. And there is also a reason why so many of these cars end up for sale within 1-2 years of being modified to this extent.

I love the FT86 platform. I think it is great if people want to mod them and put their love and passion into the cars. But once you start playing the game of comparing yourself to affordable supercars, well, you have to talk about resale, return of investment, and reliability. And at what point should you have just bought a $50-60K sub 50K GTR, or a used Vette, or Boss...

[stevo585]

I was at the drag strip a few month ago testing out an e85 tune and a dodge challenger car club was there. So naturally I lined up with one an R/T model with the Hemi 5.7 V8, 375 hp I believe.

I was expecting him to pull me bad and generally just be way faster.

But nope we both ran a 2.1 60' and he ran a 14.3 @ 99-100 and me a 14.6 @ 96 or 97. At the 1/8 mile we are also both at ~76 mph. It wasn't until I was in mid 3rd gear he started to pull.

He didn't spin or anything. I think it was just the shear weight them + plus bad driver. Although I think it was a automatic. So was surprising.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by Atropine

But it does...because a lot of people do not realize this.

One of the things special about the Corvette is its ability to give you 600+ HP and still be under factory warranty and have longevity.

Sadly, a lot of people here play Forza and Gran Turismo and dominated with the R34 Skyline...therefore they think the R34 Skyline is the best car ever...or the Suzuki Pikes Peak car.

A 900HP Skyline does not run forever...it will be constantly breaking shit.

A 900 HP Supra will not run forever...you will be rebuilding things.

A 600 HP BRZ will not run forever either. While its working...it is AMAZING.

Sadly, there are guys who buy a Twin...and then use their Credit Card for an Innovate S/C and then have Toni from FA20Club tune their car...and then it blows up.

They are left with a car that won't budge and that has a voided warranty...and 20k sitting on a Credit Card.

Threads like this influence these 'Young'uns into doing FI, without really really know what they are getting into.

I love tuner cars and modded cars.

I don't even like thinking about the money I spent buy XXXXX Car and modding it...and then selling it for a good bit less than what I paid for it (and what I spent modding it)

I started my addiction when I was in my early 20s and I didn't really have the money to be doing that.

Now that I am more established and stable...I accept its a money pit that leads to great stories and fun times...but its an expensive hobby.

Sometimes, people read these build threads and do not truly realize what goes into all of this. Its not Legos. What works on one car, may not work on another.

And it is surprisingly easy to destroy an engine/car/chassis if you don't know WTF you are doing.

this is why i have a pile of parts in a storage container, waiting for the stock parts to break ahahah

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

this is why i have a pile of parts in a storage container, waiting for the stock parts to break ahahah

Aren't you that guy with the PowerFC tuned Celica GTS that was doing 8400-9000 RPM pulls in the past? LOL

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by CSG David

Aren't you that guy with the PowerFC tuned Celica GTS that was doing 8400-9000 RPM pulls in the past? LOL

hydra ems and 10,500 rpms. its kinda scary watching the tach go past the available rpms it can read and listening to the valve chatter trying to figure out what rpm you are at to shift before you hit the fuel cut. ahahha

i started on a car that needed work that was already 12 years old and had already seen more than 1 engine and 2 transmissions. :P

Also I'm getting older and I want a house and paying off my medical bills for my cancer is a bit more important than finishing my build on my FR-S. but hopefully at some point i will start a build thread

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

hydra ems and 10,500 rpms. its kinda scary watching the tach go past the available rpms it can read and listening to the valve chatter trying to figure out what rpm you are at to shift before you hit the fuel cut. ahahha

i started on a car that needed work that was already 12 years old and had already seen more than 1 engine and 2 transmissions. :P

Also I'm getting older and I want a house and paying off my medical bills for my cancer is a bit more important than finishing my build on my FR-S. but hopefully at some point i will start a build thread

Oh it is you. The legendary Celica GTS owner. I used to watch your videos and was thoroughly impressed with that work.

Get well soon man! Cancer is never a good thing. My dad has been working on cancer treatment solutions for a long time now and has developed a treatment to help in the fight for cancer.