Engine idle chirping (cricket) noise poll.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

Independent studies or evidence of what?

I have no idea whether the certification really means their gas is any better,

This is all I'm looking for, thanks.

Edit: As for what the auto manufacturers get my guess would be a healthy paycheck from whatever oil companies funded the effort. It exists to differentiate 'higher quality' gas stations right?

[extrashaky]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Edit: As for what the auto manufacturers get my guess would be a healthy paycheck from whatever oil companies funded the effort. It exists to differentiate 'higher quality' gas stations right?

I seriously doubt there's enough money involved to make any difference. We're talking about multi-billion dollar auto companies.

My understanding is that the standard came about because the EPA standards that were to go into effect were set below the fuels that were on the market at the time, and the auto manufacturers were afraid that the oil companies would change their additives to match the EPA requirements to save money. They set their own standard to give the fuel companies a higher bar. That also gave the auto manufacturers a fuel standard to design cars for, rather than having to design for a lower standard or a wild west of fuels.

The result is that top tier fuels are mostly the same, regardless of which station you use. For us, that also unfortunately means that top tier fuels are usually going to give us crickets.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

They set their own standard to give the fuel companies a higher bar. That also gave the auto manufacturers a fuel standard to design cars for, rather than having to design for a lower standard or a wild west of fuels.

Then why isn't there any published independent studies or data? If this is true why not prove it? I haven't seen an ounce of evidence yet and I've looked, no SAE articles, not even any independent shops or university projects, just an endless loop of 'representatives' talking up additives and detergents.

[Sayte]

Soooo.. I heard from a friend that there is actually a new fuel pump part that was just recently released. I made an appointment with my Subaru dealership for this Friday. When I get some legit information I'll post up a new thread all about it. Maybe give a call to your dealerships to see if they know anything about this as well.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Sayte

Soooo.. I heard from a friend that there is actually a new fuel pump part that was just recently released. I made an appointment with my Subaru dealership for this Friday. When I get some legit information I'll post up a new thread all about it. Maybe give a call to your dealerships to see if they know anything about this as well.

Make sure you cross reference the part number, what you've posted isn't significantly different from posts 2 years ago...

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=832

[chaoskaze]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[litemup]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

LOL no. Just lots of theories. I have my own, which I think is better than everyone else's, but in the end it's still just a guess.

My theory is better than your theory.

[DoomsdayJesus]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Can you link me to something that isn't their marketing material? Just because a couple OEM's put their name on it doesn't make it legit, oil has a fuckton of money to throw around...

Edit: To clarify EPA standards are rather stringent (more stringent than some of our food standards but that's another topic), I have a hard time believing any gas is significantly better or worse especially considering the limited number of refineries supplying each region. A gallon or five of 'miracle X' in a couple thousand gallon tank doesn't exactly make me want to pay an extra $1-3 per tank.

EPA standards are not stringent. They pretty much suck, and those are more driven by the oil industry than top tier.

The proof's in the pudding. If you cared to seriously read the link I provided, you'd see gas chains have to pay about 30K to get tested, and have to demonstrate that their fuel does not have significant buildup over time or cause valves to stick. They have extraordinarily strict standards, established by automakers and not oil companies.

Shitty gas can and will cause your valves and cylinders to have bad buildup. Most premium/reliable car manufacturers recognize that. That's why they established strict top tier requirements, and why when you buy a car like a BMW, they seriously recommend fueling up exclusively with top tier fuels. And if you've ever pulled apart a BMW engine that used cheap premium, you'd know exactly why. There's a world of difference.

Other than that, I'm not going to sit here and do your homework for you. The information's readily available. This isn't a topic up for debate, it's established fact. You can take it or leave it, but playing the ignorant skeptic won't score you many points here.

edit: And I can damn near guarantee that in a high compression engine like ours, you're going to want to use top tier. The performance falloff will be dramatic once you start accumulating carbon and gum deposits.

[DoomsdayJesus]

Originally Posted by extrashaky

The result is that top tier fuels are mostly the same, regardless of which station you use. For us, that also unfortunately means that top tier fuels are usually going to give us crickets.

You can get 100% gasoline top tiers, they're just hard to find. Thankfully I live near a gas station that's not certified because they're too small, but after looking into their additives and volume/gallon they're essentially top tier. They use the same additive as Chevron. (acme fuel/fast fuel in Olympia, WA).

It's the ethanol. The nice thing about ethanol is that it seriously cuts deposits by itself as long as it's fresh. Top tiers are still required to maintain a certain volume of detergents, though. Managing deposits is only part of the certification.

And I did confirm that Arco is now a top-tier. I had no idea, I never would have trusted them before. I'll still hit up the Costco over them any day though.

[xxBrun0xx]

So I did some digging and apparently e10 burns hotter than both e0 and e85, which both have been claimed fixes. If these claims are true, then obviously, too much heat is the culprit. This makes sense, since crickets cannot be heard on cold start, but rather after car is warmed up at idle and why the crickets aren't as prevalent in cold weather.

The two systems potentially at fault that have been discussed are the high pressure fuel pump and the injectors. Now, to me, injectors would make more sense based on the fact that they are being exposed to combustion heat much more directly than the fuel pump. Although when dealerships replace fuel pumps, the crickets do seem to go away temporarily, so maybe it is the fuel pump at fault? Any thoughts?

[rdgFRSred]

so my FRS has 5700 miles on it and i took it into the dealship to see if they knew what the sound was and they sad its the fuel pump well i guess toyota came out with a new one and it was put in my car back in april and still makes the sound. They told me there is nothing they can do about it till there is an update on that fuel pump. I have been reading online about some people saying that the engine was made for the fuel back in japan and our fuel out here has to much ethenal or something which does something to the injectors making it squeal. has anyone found a solution other then waiting?

[xRavenFRSx]

Originally Posted by rdgFRSred

so my FRS has 5700 miles on it and i took it into the dealship to see if they knew what the sound was and they sad its the fuel pump well i guess toyota came out with a new one and it was put in my car back in april and still makes the sound. They told me there is nothing they can do about it till there is an update on that fuel pump. I have been reading online about some people saying that the engine was made for the fuel back in japan and our fuel out here has to much ethenal or something which does something to the injectors making it squeal. has anyone found a solution other then waiting?

I understand not wanting to read 50-60 pages to get every detail. But id suggest at least reading through a few pages before posting.

They've released multiple "revised" fuel pumps. Your dealer, and everyone elses dealer may claim to have the fixed part. None of them do. So don't bother getting them swapped. After about 6000-7000 miles, they seem to be far less frequent. Fuel system cleaners have been working for me and some others.

The part isn't malfunctioning, its working as it should. This isn't the only car, there is other cars with noisy high pressure fuel pumps. Until a company releases a silent hpfp, there's nothing you can do. Chances are that we'll never get a silent one in these cars. My suggestion is ignore it, if it bothers you like it does me and other people. Read through, and try some of the things working for other people. Fuel system cleaner is inexpensive, I would try that first.

[xRavenFRSx]

Originally Posted by xxBrun0xx

So I did some digging and apparently e10 burns hotter than both e0 and e85, which both have been claimed fixes. If these claims are true, then obviously, too much heat is the culprit. This makes sense, since crickets cannot be heard on cold start, but rather after car is warmed up at idle and why the crickets aren't as prevalent in cold weather.

The two systems potentially at fault that have been discussed are the high pressure fuel pump and the injectors. Now, to me, injectors would make more sense based on the fact that they are being exposed to combustion heat much more directly than the fuel pump. Although when dealerships replace fuel pumps, the crickets do seem to go away temporarily, so maybe it is the fuel pump at fault? Any thoughts?

Its the pump

[rdgFRSred]

What fuel system cleaner would you recommend?