S2K to BRZ as daily driver, looking for advice from anyone that has made the switch

[King Tut]

Originally Posted by Darnold

Also is there a list i'm unable to find of things to look for if I do consider a used BRZ? I couldn't find one just a list of mindless problems like leaking tail lights and chirping, and dips in RPMs due to a ECU reflash

Buy one under warranty, and then you don't have to worry about any of that stuff. If it has it, then take it to the dealer to fix it. That is the advantage of owning a 2013 over a 2001. The BRZ Limited definitely sounds like the way to go for you. I do miss the comfort access, bluetooth, and navigation that the S2000 doesn't have. I made the move because the S2000 has been around for quite a while now and the aftermarket has found solutions for all the issues and the cost of entry / cost of replacement should I wreck mine on track is lower.

[Darnold]

Originally Posted by King Tut

Buy one under warranty, and then you don't have to worry about any of that stuff. If it has it, then take it to the dealer to fix it. That is the advantage of owning a 2013 over a 2001. The BRZ Limited definitely sounds like the way to go for you. I do miss the comfort access, bluetooth, and navigation that the S2000 doesn't have. I made the move because the S2000 has been around for quite a while now and the aftermarket has found solutions for all the issues and the cost of entry / cost of replacement should I wreck mine on track is lower.

I'd disagree with the cost aspect but I have a J's racing/ASM themed S2K project car right now. Also I'm glad someone else feels my pain of the s2k as an extremely boring daily driver with 0 luxuries. It's an amazing weekend warrior however lacks in the commuter car.

Overall you do not see any issues with snagging a 2013 over a new 2015/2014?

I've negotiated 25.6k on a new '14 BRZ limited however can get a '13 with <10k for 23K asking so I'll go ahead and assume <22K

Winter is coming after all

[mokinbird87]

i never owned an S2000 but I would advise you to not to buy the BRZ for it's "features". Navigation sucks, heated seats sucks, it`s loud, etc... If I`m honest, the S2000 is a better driving experience. If I were you, I would keep the S2000 to do your fun stuff with, and get an another nice comfy car. I can only afford one car that is kind of a middle ground of everything, but if I already had an S2000, it`s a no brainer for me.

[Darnold]

Originally Posted by mokinbird87

i never owned an S2000 but I would advise you to not to buy the BRZ for it's "features". Navigation sucks, heated seats sucks, it`s loud, etc... If I`m honest, the S2000 is a better driving experience. If I were you, I would keep the S2000 to do your fun stuff with, and get an another nice comfy car. I can only afford one car that is kind of a middle ground of everything, but if I already had an S2000, it`s a no brainer for me.

Mokinbird, the problem is one S2K is built beyond my personal driving ability. As well the AP1 has 130k miles on it at this point and is reaching it's endings, anything I do replace the AP1 with will need to be a RWD sports car as well and I'd honestly prefer a new car. That leaves me with only a few options and all of the alternatives besides the BRZ are blagh.

Genesis feels sloppy in comparison
Mustang GT is all power no finesse
Miata is less power + better handling but I'd like to avoid another soft top. And this puts me in the same dilemma I'm in now

The navigation doesn't bother me 100% as much because I know with cars like this selling the navigation to FRS owners who didn't pick one up won't be all that bad (so I'd imagine).

I'm one of those twisted individuals that took a RWD sports car out in the middle of New Hampshire's worst snow storms... And loved it

[mokinbird87]

forget what I said. you have two S2000s lol.

[Darnold]

Originally Posted by mokinbird87

forget what I said. you have two S2000s lol.

Yea one has reached the point of no return... Stuck with it now

[mokinbird87]

what about the new wrx or an evo mr?

[Darnold]

Originally Posted by mokinbird87

what about the new wrx or an evo mr?

I HATE HATE HATE the wrx/sti platform... (I know I'm weird). Also I've driven a evo X and it simply has too much road presence to be considered a driver's car, albeit an unbelievable performer.

[tahdizzle]

Originally Posted by Darnold

I HATE HATE HATE the wrx/sti platform... (I know I'm weird).

Don't sugar coat it, we're all adults here. We can handle it. Tell us how you really feel.

I have not driven the s2000, but if you're looking for an affordable RWD coupe the twins in my opinion are your best option. (perhaps the only option?)

[Darnold]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

Don't sugar coat it, we're all adults here. We can handle it. Tell us how you really feel.

I have not driven the s2000, but if you're looking for an affordable RWD coupe the twins in my opinion are your best option. (perhaps the only option?)

Mustang GT with the 5.0 coyote are surprisingly affordable/miata/genesis r-spec but the more i research the twins the better they are the clear car to beat for <30K

Now I just have to find out if it's worth buying a NEW BRZ limited or just find a used one for a few grand less

[GotMunchies?]

Originally Posted by Darnold

Also is there a list i'm unable to find of things to look for if I do consider a used BRZ? I couldn't find one just a list of mindless problems like leaking tail lights and chirping, and dips in RPMs due to a ECU reflash

My advice is to spend some time in the Issues subforum, read through some of the bigger threads and you'll get some background on the usual problems. Just remember to bring some grains of salt. Hyperbole is fairly common there (as it is for any car community).

Here's a quick list off the top of my head of the most common issues with this platform:

- Condensation in tail lights (Fairly common - heard rumors, these are no longer being replaced under warranty, after market fixes exist)

- Oil leak from cam plate on rear of engine on manual cars (not common - aftermarket fix, can be done in driveway)

- RPM drop and shudder (common prior to MY2014ish - fixed at dealer under TSB. Not to be confused with RPM drops at idle with AC on, this is a pretty common Subaru thing).

- Crickets from high pressure fuel pump (common to all model years - three versions of the HPFP exist, none fix the crickets for sure, does not effect driveability, can only be heard at idle).

- DI Seal failure (Possibly due to gaps left in transient fuel tables, not very common, occurs mostly in tracked or tuned cars. Apparently newer ECU revisions fix this issue. Has been quiet for a long time - since MY2013ish).

- Axle failures (all examples I read about were on significantly lowered cars, fixed with aftermarket axles.)

- Notchy transmissions / gear grinds (unclear how common it is, some people complain of notchy shifting or difficulty getting into 2nd when cold. Some transmissions have been replaced, sometimes fixed with better transmission fluid. Drive the car you intend to buy before you buy it, just to make sure things shift well. I think notchy transmissions are very common to budget sports cars).

- Usual pops and rattles in the interior - its a budget sports car, you get what you pay for.

- Issues connecting to Bluetooth (really hit or miss. I guess if you have a lot of contacts on your phone, it overwhelms the connection process and won't connect. Options exist to not transfer contacts and then issues are rare).

Regarding track use - the car can be driven straight onto the track if you don't intend to go 100% and are ready to replace fluids immediately afterward. Otherwise, the usual for just about any car is needed (e.g. brake pads, fluid, good oils, and tires). The exception is for those tracking regularly in hot climates - an oil cooler is considered pretty mandatory. Several options are routinely used (OEM sandwhich cooler under oil filter, Jackson Racing external cooler).

All in all, the BRZ/FRS is a great little sports car ripe for an owner who cars about the experience of driving and learning to drive better. The added bonus is decent fuel economy (6spd manual, I get about 30mpg on my commute and routinely over 30 on highway trips). The car is relatively comfortable for long trips or the commute, the speakers suck but can be tweaked to sound ok. Bluetooth means you don't even need to use the Nav (instructions from your phone read over speakers).

In the end, coming from an S2k, you'll likely be underwhelmed (maybe even frustrated) by the engine but the trade off is a car more usable every day that can still go to the track whenever you want. And remember, you can fit four wheels and a jack in the car with the rear seat down - very useful.

BTW, regarding new vs. used - depending on how you're buying, if you're financing and get a really low interest rate (< 2.00%) over 5 years, the savings of used over new approach negligible and you have the added benefit of being the only owner of the car.

My advice is to find a car you can REALLY test drive. You'll really know if you'll like it once you push it a bit.

[nick_318is]

Originally Posted by Darnold

Now I just have to find out if it's worth buying a NEW BRZ limited or just find a used one for a few grand less

If you can find a used one I say let someone else take the initial depreciation hit. I picked mine up with 2k miles, saved 5k and ended up with a practically new car with a full warranty. Win win.

[Darnold]

Originally Posted by GotMunchies?

My advice is to spend some time in the Issues subforum, read through some of the bigger threads and you'll get some background on the usual problems. Just remember to bring some grains of salt. Hyperbole is fairly common there (as it is for any car community).

Here's a quick list off the top of my head of the most common issues with this platform:

- Condensation in tail lights (Fairly common - heard rumors, these are no longer being replaced under warranty, after market fixes exist)

- Oil leak from cam plate on rear of engine on manual cars (not common - aftermarket fix, can be done in driveway)

- RPM drop and shudder (common prior to MY2014ish - fixed at dealer under TSB. Not to be confused with RPM drops at idle with AC on, this is a pretty common Subaru thing).

- Crickets from high pressure fuel pump (common to all model years - three versions of the HPFP exist, none fix the crickets for sure, does not effect driveability, can only be heard at idle).

- DI Seal failure (Possibly due to gaps left in transient fuel tables, not very common, occurs mostly in tracked or tuned cars. Apparently newer ECU revisions fix this issue. Has been quiet for a long time - since MY2013ish).

- Axle failures (all examples I read about were on significantly lowered cars, fixed with aftermarket axles.)

- Notchy transmissions / gear grinds (unclear how common it is, some people complain of notchy shifting or difficulty getting into 2nd when cold. Some transmissions have been replaced, sometimes fixed with better transmission fluid. Drive the car you intend to buy before you buy it, just to make sure things shift well. I think notchy transmissions are very common to budget sports cars).

- Usual pops and rattles in the interior - its a budget sports car, you get what you pay for.

- Issues connecting to Bluetooth (really hit or miss. I guess if you have a lot of contacts on your phone, it overwhelms the connection process and won't connect. Options exist to not transfer contacts and then issues are rare).

Regarding track use - the car can be driven straight onto the track if you don't intend to go 100% and are ready to replace fluids immediately afterward. Otherwise, the usual for just about any car is needed (e.g. brake pads, fluid, good oils, and tires). The exception is for those tracking regularly in hot climates - an oil cooler is considered pretty mandatory. Several options are routinely used (OEM sandwhich cooler under oil filter, Jackson Racing external cooler).

All in all, the BRZ/FRS is a great little sports car ripe for an owner who cars about the experience of driving and learning to drive better. The added bonus is decent fuel economy (6spd manual, I get about 30mpg on my commute and routinely over 30 on highway trips). The car is relatively comfortable for long trips or the commute, the speakers suck but can be tweaked to sound ok. Bluetooth means you don't even need to use the Nav (instructions from your phone read over speakers).

In the end, coming from an S2k, you'll likely be underwhelmed (maybe even frustrated) by the engine but the trade off is a car more usable every day that can still go to the track whenever you want. And remember, you can fit four wheels and a jack in the car with the rear seat down - very useful.

BTW, regarding new vs. used - depending on how you're buying, if you're financing and get a really low interest rate (< 2.00%) over 5 years, the savings of used over new approach negligible and you have the added benefit of being the only owner of the car.

My advice is to find a car you can REALLY test drive. You'll really know if you'll like it once you push it a bit.

@GotMunchies? This is pretty much exactly what I've been reading. Added was the years that these potential issues can be relevant to and that was honestly the major concern here. As for financing I'll be going through DCU for 1.2% financing and have aprox 15K to put down leaving me with a relatively small to non existent. I'll have to keep my eyes open for a color I like BRZ limited that is used or try to be lucky enough to get a '14 BRZ limited next month when the AP1 ships off to it's new home.

Overall probing the ft86 forum was enough to tell this is a good community to join on top of everything else

[GreenMonster]

Originally Posted by Darnold

I've negotiated 25.6k on a new '14 BRZ limited however can get a '13 with <10k for 23K asking so I'll go ahead and assume <22K

Yeah, that's about right, pricewise. There's a 2013 CBS limited in Wakefield MA w/ 41K miles for $18.5K on craigslist. If you don't mind some mileage, there are some decent deals out there.

Originally Posted by Darnold

Now I just have to find out if it's worth buying a NEW BRZ limited or just find a used one for a few grand less

I'm shopping both the Ecoboost Mustang premium and BRZ limited. When the 2015's BRZ hit the lots late Sept or Oct, I'll see what pricing is and go from there. Leaning towards a new BRZ, maybe a used one. I like some of the new items on the 2015's (faux carbon dash instead of silver, new key fob, sharkfin antenna, nicer exhaust tips).

Manchester Subaru usually has some decent pricing, and a few forum member from MA have bought from up there.

Not much left down here for choice of colors on the 2014's unless you want silver or silver