Upgrade help for autocross

[tahdizzle]

Originally Posted by ML

really? It seems like I see them a lot.

I know people have 17x7 on their cars, but I can't find any retailers that have them in stock :p

[ayau]

Let's be honest here, $700 isn't going to get you very far. It sounds like you're relatively new to autox, so you're probably not ranking very high locally. Your local events might have a "novice" class, which let's you have any mods you want and still be "legal".

If I were you, I'd save the $700 and run what you have now. Most people aren't going to protest you unless you're finishing top 3 or something, and since you're pretty new, I doubt you will.

Use that $700 to pay for entrance fees. Get as much experience as you can now and worry about the mods later.

As far as track/HPDE, personally I don't think it really helps prepare you for autox. Track days are so relaxed and lack the quick transitions from autox. It's definitely good experience to have, but I don't think it's very effective in terms of money spent. In addition, you'll need at least track pads and new fluid to safely prep your car for an event. That's at least $300 right here.

Enjoy what you have now. In the end, the money you spend in autox isn't going to gain you anything back. Once you gain enough experience, you'll know what exactly you need in terms of car prepping, parts, and classing.

[ML]

Originally Posted by ayau

Let's be honest here, $700 isn't going to get you very far. It sounds like you're relatively new to autox, so you're probably not ranking very high locally. Your local events might have a "novice" class, which let's you have any mods you want and still be "legal".

If I were you, I'd save the $700 and run what you have now. Most people aren't going to protest you unless you're finishing top 3 or something, and since you're pretty new, I doubt you will.

Use that $700 to pay for entrance fees. Get as much experience as you can now and worry about the mods later.

As far as track/HPDE, personally I don't think it really helps prepare you for autox. Track days are so relaxed and lack the quick transitions from autox. It's definitely good experience to have, but I don't think it's very effective in terms of money spent. In addition, you'll need at least track pads and new fluid to safely prep your car for an event. That's at least $300 right here.

Enjoy what you have now. In the end, the money you spend in autox isn't going to gain you anything back. Once you gain enough experience, you'll know what exactly you need in terms of car prepping, parts, and classing.

Thanks, obviously I wish I had more money to spend on my car, but it's just not at the top of my priorities. I've done 3 autocrosses, and I'm still about mid pack. Instructor ride alongs have helped me a lot too. I'm still having fun in my car. Maybe after it gets paid for I will get seriois.

[ayau]

Originally Posted by ML

Thanks, obviously I wish I had more money to spend on my car, but it's just not at the top of my priorities. I've done 3 autocrosses, and I'm still about mid pack. Instructor ride alongs have helped me a lot too. I'm still having fun in my car. Maybe after it gets paid for I will get seriois.

All that matters in the end is that you're having fun. Remember, you're not winning any money. It's just a bunch of dudes driving around in a parking lot, lol.

Some people might not even like it after a season or two. It would be a waste to prep your car for a certain class only to find out that you're going to retire from the sport a year or two later.

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by ayau

I don't think it really helps prepare you for autox. Track days are so relaxed and lack the quick transitions from autox. It's definitely good experience to have, but I don't think it's very effective in terms of money spent.

things that you get from HPDE that you don't get from autocross


1. consistent flow. A 50 second run at an autocross will pit you against 14-20 corners, all different, and then park you for 40-60 minutes. If you're new, you won't learn jack, at least not very quickly


an HPDE consistently puts you against the same corners with plenty of breathing room between each one. Learning the concepts of weight transfer, gradual brake point advancement, gradual oversteer, gradual understeer, at a much more controlled pace.


when you have a corner that is half the length of your entire autocross run, it offers plenty of time to FEEL what all of these things are and correct them


2. raw speed


I have (had, lost it) data that showed me being significantly faster through tight-entry-wide-exit sweepers than people who have never been to the track. I can get up to 70kph and crank the wheel with less fear because I've done the same at a higher speed on a track.


part of being fast is having a body trained to deal with the g-loads.


funny enough, I went to a rollercoaster park yesterday (Canada's Wonderland) and did all the big rides all within an hour (Leviathan, Behemoth, and Drop Zone). I screamed on each one when going down, the force was just overwhelming. I did drop zone twice, with the second time trying my best to breath through the loads and NOT scream... I made it... barely, with my scream turning to grunts as I got to the ground.


3. Repetition


while you don't get fast transitions on the track, there is still basic race theory that applies at both venues. Type 1 vs Type2 corners, late-apex vs early-apex, rotation, trail braking, etc.


one day of HPDE puts you at 40-50 laps against identical corners all in a single day.


Practice makes perfect.... and you get a heck of a lot more practice at the track.






also , you could always do arrive-and-drive go-karts, those have nice g-forces..

[ayau]

Originally Posted by 7thgear

things that you get from HPDE that you don't get from autocross

All good points, but the guy just wants to do autox anyway. Besides, autox, is a much safer event compared to track days. With track insurance, you're looking close to $600 (pads, insurance, entrance fee) for just one track day vs. $50 for autox. For a beginner, I'd recommend autox over track.

Also, some places offer novice schools for autox. I know we have one. It's basically half class time and half run time. They teach your the fundamentals of autox. All for $50 and you get 20+ runs with an instructor.

Each sport has its positives and negatives. It's just a matter of preference.

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by ayau

All good points, but the guy just wants to do autox anyway. Besides, autox, is a much safer event compared to track days. With track insurance, you're looking close to $600 (pads, insurance, entrance fee) for just one track day vs. $50 for autox. For a beginner, I'd recommend autox over track.

Also, some places offer novice schools for autox. I know we have one. It's basically half class time and half run time. They teach your the fundamentals of autox. All for $50 and you get 20+ runs with an instructor.

Each sport has its positives and negatives. It's just a matter of preference.

My club just sold out on spots for a day at the mosport driving development track, with free instruction, for 180 bucks.



I can play this game all day long.

[DarkSunrise]

Sometimes I wish Subaru/Scion would sponsor track days. VW does one every year for just $50. Good way to give people their first hit and show how good these cars are, even stock.

[renfield90]

Wow, you guys jumped down the OP's throat. Don't forget you were once a clueless hack in need of gentle direction, not patronizing advice.

To the OP: what are your goals with autocross? Just out to have fun, or do you want to try and be competitive? There is no wrong answer, but it'll guide where your $700 will be best spent.

[ML]

Originally Posted by renfield90

Wow, you guys jumped down the OP's throat. Don't forget you were once a clueless hack in need of gentle direction, not patronizing advice.

To the OP: what are your goals with autocross? Just out to have fun, or do you want to try and be competitive? There is no wrong answer, but it'll guide where your $700 will be best spent.

My goal is really to just get better, I'm not trying to win the point race just yet. I would love to go out there and know its not the tires or some other factor holding me back from getting better.

[tahdizzle]

The car stock is faster than you are.

The car is not holding you back, you are holding the car back.

Trust me.

[ML]

So I should just stfu and drive haha

[tahdizzle]

Originally Posted by ML

So I should just stfu and drive haha

Exactly. There is a guy running in CS class in his FRS and is faster than most of the guys on course. SSM and down.

Granted is a local pool but still. Shows that wheel time is king. :P

[renfield90]

Originally Posted by ML

My goal is really to just get better, I'm not trying to win the point race just yet. I would love to go out there and know its not the tires or some other factor holding me back from getting better.

Then my recommendation is going to be similar to others: save that money and do as MANY events as you possibly can.

When you think you've plateau'd, have someone faster than you drive the car, and if you're within a second of their time then it's time to start upgrading. Tires first, everything else is secondary. Have fun!