Kraftwerks Kit, Moto-East Tune, R comps and Coilover ..wow. what a track machine

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by dradernh

It's not just price, it's the number of heat cycles before the tires are no longer performing the way they were during their first couple of heat cycles. That's what the 'inconsistency' thing is about - they're not inconsistent, it's that they're designed for a purpose, and that purpose is not being run for 20 heat cycles or being run down to the cords, even if lots of drivers do those things anyway.

The R6/R1 tires will come in (i.e., heat up) quickly; however, that's no longer true when you have a lot of heat cycles on them, or when it's cold out. Their optimum temperatures are 180-220 degrees (in their carcasses, taken with a probe pyrometer - not on their surfaces, taken with a laser pyrometer). If you can't get them up to temperature, they'll underperform; if you've gotten them up to temperature and they're not performing, it's time to switch them out.

How many heat cycles an R6/R1-type tire is good for is principally dependent upon the car, and somewhat on the driver. After 4 HCs, they really drop off on my car; at 8 HCs, they are totally done. This is on a race car with major aero; i.e., nothing like a DD twin.

4-8 HCs should be very costly, another R compound tire that I have been looking is the Toyo Proxes RR but I am not sure if it's the same material with R888s

[wahsaihin]

awesome. I also have the KW kit and KWv3 coilovers . love how balanced your car is...definitely what I'm trying to achieve with mine!

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by wahsaihin

awesome. I also have the KW kit and KWv3 coilovers . love how balanced your car is...definitely what I'm trying to achieve with mine!

Thanks I will go with a bit wider tires on my next set (probably 255/40/17s) so I am hoping that I can get some more mechanical grip, car just wants to go

[Jawnathin]

I know this was discussed 2 months ago, but regarding tires, Nitto and Toyo are the same company. R888s and NT01s have similar compounds, but the NT01 seems to be a better tire. They seem to get up to temp sooner and don't HC as quickly as R888s. Until these tires warm up, their grip is like a good street tire. Warmed up, they're much stickier, especially early in their life.

Anyway, both are a great tweener tire that you can drive to and from events (or occasional street use) and enjoy on the track. I run R888s now for my track car and they do just fine. Would opt for the NT01 over the R888 given the chance, but they don't make NT01 in the sizes I need. Sticking with R888s for now.

Both are a step below a real R-Comp like an R6, but you wouldn't drive them on the street like you could an R888/NT01.

PSS is a great tire, best balanced street tire out there IMO (dry traction, wet traction, life). For a DD that sees occasional fun/autocrosses, PSS is great. For competition, RS3 is far superior in terms of dry grip and among the best tire you can buy right now. The new V2 looks very promising.

Anyway, not directed to anyone in particular, but there was a few comments about tires and wanted to chime in to help answer anything.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Jawnathin

I know this was discussed 2 months ago, but regarding tires, Nitto and Toyo are the same company. R888s and NT01s have similar compounds, but the NT01 seems to be a better tire. They seem to get up to temp sooner and don't HC as quickly as R888s. Until these tires warm up, their grip is like a good street tire. Warmed up, they're much stickier, especially early in their life.

Anyway, both are a great tweener tire that you can drive to and from events (or occasional street use) and enjoy on the track. I run R888s now for my track car and they do just fine. Would opt for the NT01 over the R888 given the chance, but they don't make NT01 in the sizes I need. Sticking with R888s for now.

Both are a step below a real R-Comp like an R6, but you wouldn't drive them on the street like you could an R888/NT01.

PSS is a great tire, best balanced street tire out there IMO (dry traction, wet traction, life). For a DD that sees occasional fun/autocrosses, PSS is great. For competition, RS3 is far superior in terms of dry grip and among the best tire you can buy right now. The new V2 looks very promising.

Anyway, not directed to anyone in particular, but there was a few comments about tires and wanted to chime in to help answer anything.

yes that is the common consensus about the R888s, they're also a lot better in Wet conditions (compared to other R comps) and lightyears ahead of the real R comps for sure..I really liked PSS tires on my Vette but on the track after couple laps (dry), R comps shine like you mentioned.. I will probably get a PSS for my street wheels but being able to break easy is also fun with OEM tires and they are everywhere

[rice_classic]

Toyo is an excellent tire manufacturer. They've been the spec tire of Honda Challenge and other series (like Spec Miata depending on org) for many years.

The Nitto NT-01, Toyo R888 and Toyo RA1 are almost all the same tire with small differences in construction and tread compound. Shave the tires down to 4/32nds and the NT01 and RA1 are indistinguishable from each other in speed, wear and window of performance. Nitto tire is Toyo. Same company. Like Acura is Honda. It's their 'Murican brand.

They're definitely not the fastest DOT R-comp, not by a long shot but they wear like iron and typically work well all the way down to cords, unlike most other DOT R-comps.

If you do want to try a faster R-comp that's not the Hoosier, try the Toyo RR. Excellent DOT R-comp but definitely not something for the street. It will wear/last like the RA1/NT-01 but be a second or so faster.


p.s. I hated the R888s so much I actually gave them away. They did nothing well compared to their brethren and their "window of performance" was so damn narrow that if your setup wasn't just right for them then you may as well have been on street tires. They were abandoned immediately by most groups running spec Toyos. The R888, in the racing community, is known as a "fiasco".

[CSG David]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Toyo is an excellent tire manufacturer. They've been the spec tire of Honda Challenge and other series (like Spec Miata depending on org) for many years.

The Nitto NT-01, Toyo R888 and Toyo RA1 are almost all the same tire with small differences in construction and tread compound. Shave the tires down to 4/32nds and the NT01 and RA1 are indistinguishable from each other in speed, wear and window of performance. Nitto tire is Toyo. Same company. Like Acura is Honda. It's their 'Murican brand.

They're definitely not the fastest DOT R-comp, not by a long shot but they wear like iron and typically work well all the way down to cords, unlike most other DOT R-comps.

If you do want to try a faster R-comp that's not the Hoosier, try the Toyo RR. Excellent DOT R-comp but definitely not something for the street. It will wear/last like the RA1/NT-01 but be a second or so faster.


p.s. I hated the R888s so much I actually gave them away. They did nothing well compared to their brethren and their "window of performance" was so damn narrow that if your setup wasn't just right for them then you may as well have been on street tires. The were abandoned immediately be just about every group that running spec Toyos. The R888, in the racing community, is known as a "fiasco".

I like the RA1 too.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by glamcem

yes that is the common consensus about the R888s, they're also a lot better in Wet conditions (compared to other R comps) and lightyears ahead of the real R comps for sure..I really liked PSS tires on my Vette but on the track after couple laps (dry), R comps shine like you mentioned.. I will probably get a PSS for my street wheels but being able to break easy is also fun with OEM tires and they are everywhere

Note for wet weather:

RA1 > R888 (both full tread).

You also have Kumho Victoracers as a stickier option.

The major difference between the R888 and NT01 is the carcass

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by glamcem

yes that is the common consensus about the R888s, they're also a lot better in Wet conditions (compared to other R comps)

Like Mike said... NOPE. Fully treaded RA1 is lightyears ahead of a fully treaded R888 in the wet, partially wet, drying... well, always.

What are you doing this weekend? You should register with NASA HPDE or TT this weekend at Pacific Raceways. I'm going down and I want to see how your fire breathing monster compares to my 25 year old FWD shitbox. It'd also be good to chat with another track junky.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Like Mike said... NOPE. Fully treaded RA1 is lightyears ahead of a fully treaded R888 in the wet, partially wet, drying... well, always.

What are you doing this weekend? You should register with NASA HPDE or TT this weekend at Pacific Raceways. I'm going down and I want to see how your fire breathing monster compares to my 25 year old FWD shitbox. It'd also be good to chat with another track junky.

Weather looks nice and I would like to join you and chat on the weekend for sure.. I haven't been to the PR for a while though, in fact I think I have only been there for like 4-5 times in total since I moved to PNW last year, and due communication issues with "ProFormance Racing school" last year I haven't tried to sign up for another event but would gladly try other organizations..

I haven't register with NASA before so I am not sure about how it works ( there are so many different groups, racing teams etc) but I will join to NASA's website with 1 year membership and PM you so that we can communicate sometime this week..

When are you planning to go there? on Saturday or Sunday? or both?

Btw, this is a video from last year when I had my Vette I was pretty slow for a Corvette ( had some alignment issues) and the track is a bit scarry
I think my best was 1:42 with street tires so I am sure I can learn a lot from you

[ame="http://youtu.be/yZCk761Y1Qo"]http://youtu.be/yZCk761Y1Qo[/ame]

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Fully treaded RA1 is lightyears ahead of a fully treaded R888 in the wet, partially wet, drying... well, always.

A picture is useful here; note that each of these Toyos has different tread depths: RA1 - 8/32; R888 - 6.3/32; RR - 4/32. The 9/32 tread depth Hoosier Wet is shown for reference.

[wahsaihin]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Like Mike said... NOPE. Fully treaded RA1 is lightyears ahead of a fully treaded R888 in the wet, partially wet, drying... well, always.

What are you doing this weekend? You should register with NASA HPDE or TT this weekend at Pacific Raceways. I'm going down and I want to see how your fire breathing monster compares to my 25 year old FWD shitbox. It'd also be good to chat with another track junky.

On the topic of r-comp tires, does any of manufacturers make a 235-245/35/18 size tire? I can't see to find any...

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by wahsaihin

On the topic of r-comp tires, does any of manufacturers make a 235-245/35/18 size tire? I can't see to find any...

You may look into Ventus Z214s

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....omCompare1=yes