Kraftwerks Kit, Moto-East Tune, R comps and Coilover ..wow. what a track machine

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

For the car's budget underpinning's its remarkable how well it responds to the additional power and suitable tire and suspension changes.
My dyno on the Vortech was around 220WHP on my Perrin tune (dynojet) and I always shift at 7000RPM on the track so I am not getting all the power. So there is a large power difference.

How are the JRSC and Kraftwerks people shifting? Are you revving out past 7k?

Are you on stock exhaust?

[Dezoris]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

Are you on stock exhaust?

Perrin Header back 2.5"

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

Perrin Header back 2.5"

So, you're still on stock headers?

That might partly explain the lack of power. That stock cat is massively restrictive and your timing cannot really be advanced very far safely with that thing in the way.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

For the car's budget underpinning's its remarkable how well it responds to the additional power and suitable tire and suspension changes.
My dyno on the Vortech was around 220WHP on my Perrin tune (dynojet) and I always shift at 7000RPM on the track so I am not getting all the power. So there is a large power difference.

How are the JRSC and Kraftwerks people shifting? Are you revving out past 7k?

Interesting I wonder if the dyno's calibration is the reason why it reads a bit low, did you ever take it to another dyno place?

Drift office recently posted the comparable dyno graphs and the peak power was close to Rotrex units (area under the curve is very different obviously)

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61589

and to answer your question, I always shift at redline (7200-7400 rpm) since it leaves me in the higher point in the next gear, even though most of the time cars lose their edge after certain point

What kind of tires do you currently use for track days?

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by KraftWerks

Hope you don't mind us posting your video on our Facebook page @glamcem! Nice driving dude, glad you're enjoying your kit!

of course not I'm glad you guys enjoyed it, I will add new videos and hopefully next time I will have ABS, EBD fixed since I couldn't even bed in my new pads and hoping I can get better times next time

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

BTW this is an excellent video, and great track thanks for posting it up, nice to see more people on SC, regardless of brand pushing it on track and not just street trolling.

Thank you I was going to say the same thing for your videos, I love your videos editing and professionalism in your videos dude

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

So, you're still on stock headers?

That might partly explain the lack of power. That stock cat is massively restrictive and your timing cannot really be advanced very far safely with that thing in the way.

Who says that? because two of the reputable tuners told me otherwise..

This has been debated many times and it seems like the OEM headers are not that restrictive at all with the addition of FI difference between OEM headers and aftermarket ones are pretty negligible (you should be able to see before and after dynos here on the forum) , I think 2.5" headerback exhaust is perfect for SC kits since (compared to 3" systems or aftermarket headers)

if I wanted to stay NA I would be more interested in an aftermarket header for sure though.. but I knew that I was going to FI route before even I purchased my car

[Dezoris]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

So, you're still on stock headers?

That might partly explain the lack of power. That stock cat is massively restrictive and your timing cannot really be advanced very far safely with that thing in the way.

I know it's a restriction but I keep getting mixed messages on the true value. Being on an e-tune another $1000 for a header not going to be worth it to me.

Originally Posted by glamcem

Interesting I wonder if the dyno's calibration is the reason why it reads a bit low, did you ever take it to another dyno place?

Drift office recently posted the comparable dyno graphs and the peak power was close to Rotrex units (area under the curve is very different obviously)

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61589

and to answer your question, I always shift at redline (7200-7400 rpm) since it leaves me in the higher point in the next gear, even though most of the time cars lose their edge after certain point

What kind of tires do you currently use for track days?

Using 235 Hankook RS3s, they have been probably the most competitive street tire I have even used for the cost aside from maybe the A048 which are stupid expensive.

I am re-testing new tuning with Knose and doing dynos sometime in the next 3 weeks to see what the differences are.

Originally Posted by glamcem

This has been debated many times and it seems like the OEM headers are not that restrictive at all with the addition of FI difference between OEM headers and aftermarket ones are pretty negligible (you should be able to see before and after dynos here on the forum) , I think 2.5" headerback exhaust is perfect for SC kits since (compared to 3" systems or aftermarket headers)

if I wanted to stay NA I would be more interested in an aftermarket header for sure though.. but I knew that I was going to FI route before even I purchased my car

I feel the same way.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

Using 235 Hankook RS3s, they have been probably the most competitive street tire I have even used for the cost aside from maybe the A048 which are stupid expensive.

The best summer street tires I've used were Michelin PSS but I never tried RS3s. I've heard nothing but good things about them though. I might try it next time for my street setup if they have the wet traction capabilities of the PSS tires, here in Seattle we get a lot wet/dump days during the winter.

For track, Nitto NT01 is a clear winner (compared to Hoosiers, R888s, A048 and some other R compounds) imo for a few reasons, people at Rennlist forums are also quite happy with them.. if you never tried them and have another set of wheels, I'd say go for it :

• they are pretty consistent (I think the single most important thing for many people at track)
• They are cheap (about $160 a piece it's really hard to pass)
• Good threadwear for being an R- Compound
• Very responsive due to stiff sidewalls (this might be due to wheel size of my car since I have RPF1 17x9 +35mm wheels with 235/40/17, it can work on 8" wheel but with 9" wheel it's still in the range but with better/stiffer sidewalls, I hate sidewall bulge)

[Dezoris]

Originally Posted by glamcem

The best summer street tires I've used were Michelin PSS but I never tried RS3s. I've heard nothing but good things about them though. I might try it next time for my street setup if they have the wet traction capabilities of the PSS tires, here in Seattle we get a lot wet/dump days during the winter.

For track, Nitto NT01 is a clear winner (compared to Hoosiers, R888s, A048 and some other R compounds) imo for a few reasons, people at Rennlist forums are also quite happy with them.. if you never tried them and have another set of wheels, I'd say go for it :

• they are pretty consistent (I think the single most important thing for many people at track)
• They are cheap (about $160 a piece it's really hard to pass)
• Good threadwear for being an R- Compound
• Very responsive due to stiff sidewalls (this might be due to wheel size of my car since I have RPF1 17x9 +35mm wheels with 235/40/17, it can work on 8" wheel but with 9" wheel it's still in the range but with better/stiffer sidewalls, I hate sidewall bulge)

The RS3s are really a one trick pony. They double the grip of the PSS, but cold and wet performance is bad. My buddy was using the PSS on his stock BRZ for 2 autox, and I swapped on my old RS3s and he was blown away by grip and heat stability. That was until he started driving on the street and they have no grip in cold and wet, tire noise is awful too.

I have been phobic of Nitto since the 90s as I have seen so much crap from them when the import seen took off. Since you have had so many cars and probably tracked them all I would like to drive on to see, as I know many things have changed in the tire world.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

The RS3s are really a one trick pony. They double the grip of the PSS, but cold and wet performance is bad. My buddy was using the PSS on his stock BRZ for 2 autox, and I swapped on my old RS3s and he was blown away by grip and heat stability. That was until he started driving on the street and they have no grip in cold and wet, tire noise is awful too.

I have been phobic of Nitto since the 90s as I have seen so much crap from them when the import seen took off. Since you have had so many cars and probably tracked them all I would like to drive on to see, as I know many things have changed in the tire world.

Same here, I was also very skeptical about the quality of Nitto, Toyo, Falken tires back in the days and didn't want to own anything besides Michelin or Pirelli but my views are changed.

Nitto NT01s are by far the best tires I've ever owned and AFAIK Toyo and Nitto are the same company. I think when it comes to QC every brand had some issues with certain models in the past for ~$600-700 it's hard to pass

I also prefer having separate wheel/tire and brake/rotor setups for street and track use, simply because I feel that there is no best tire or brake for multi purpose use (dry and wet performance) but there are always compromises . Believe it or not, being able to fit 4 wheels and tires is one of the most important factors that I wanted to do the switch and get rid of my Miata since driving 200+ miles with R compounds to Oregon for a track day is no phun, haha, I had to drive 80 miles for this past weekend and the noise was still unbearable (maybe I'm getting old) I will probably get another PSS for street or maybe PSS AS3 , I've heard they are surprisingly good for All season tires and perform better than many summer tires also

I also didn't want to spend $1k+ on a set that has 30-40 treadwear rating

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by glamcem

For track, Nitto NT01 is a clear winner (compared to Hoosiers, R888s, A048 and some other R compounds) imo for a few reasons:

• they are pretty consistent (I think the single most important thing for many people at track)
• They are cheap (about $160 a piece it's really hard to pass)
• Good threadwear for being an R- Compound
• Very responsive due to stiff sidewalls (this might be due to wheel size of my car since I have RPF1 17x9 +35mm wheels with 235/40/17, it can work on 8" wheel but with 9" wheel it's still in the range but with better/stiffer sidewalls, I hate sidewall bulge)

I agree that the NT01 is an excellent tire - I've used them a lot. It's kind of a "tweener" tire in that its performance is between what top street tires offer and what the Hoosier R6s/BFGoodrich R1s can do. When it comes to pure performance, the NT01 is nowhere near as grippy as the R6/R1, but the price/performance factor is outstanding for HPDEs.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by dradernh

I agree that the NT01 is an excellent tire - I've used them a lot. It's kind of a "tweener" tire in that its performance is between what top street tires offer and what the Hoosier R6s/BFGoodrich R1s can do. When it comes to pure performance, the NT01 is nowhere near as grippy as the R6/R1, but the price/performance factor is outstanding for HPDEs.

I might try R1s next time around but the price is also another factor as you mentioned. I also heard that it may take at least couple laps to heat up those R6 tires and they are not consistent as time passes but I personally don't have experience with them or the R1s.

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by glamcem

I might try R1s next time around but the price is also another factor as you mentioned. I also heard that it may take at least couple laps to heat up those R6 tires and they are not consistent as time passes but I personally don't have experience with them or the R1s.

It's not just price, it's the number of heat cycles before the tires are no longer performing the way they were during their first couple of heat cycles. That's what the 'inconsistency' thing is about - they're not inconsistent, it's that they're designed for a purpose, and that purpose is not being run for 20 heat cycles or being run down to the cords, even if lots of drivers do those things anyway.

The R6/R1 tires will come in (i.e., heat up) quickly; however, that's no longer true when you have a lot of heat cycles on them, or when it's cold out. Their optimum temperatures are 180-220 degrees (in their carcasses, taken with a probe pyrometer - not on their surfaces, taken with a laser pyrometer). If you can't get them up to temperature, they'll underperform; if you've gotten them up to temperature and they're not performing, it's time to switch them out.

How many heat cycles an R6/R1-type tire is good for is principally dependent upon the car, and somewhat on the driver. After 4 HCs, they really drop off on my car; at 8 HCs, they are totally done. This is on a race car with major aero; i.e., nothing like a DD twin.