Driven: FR-S 6MT, 6AT, BRZ 6MT.

[Tgionet]

Originally Posted by Michael Blue

Thanks, all.
For me, the clutch take-up was vastly more different than the shifter.
Has anyone else experienced that?

Dealer may have adjusted the pedal

[tobin]

Hi Michael, welcome to the forum. I had a 98.5 2.8 A4 myself. Manual, sport, leather, sport seats, etc. That was a great car. The BRZ is a totally different animal. Definitely get the Limited, and enjoy the hell out of it.

[Mad1723]

Transmissions are the same, from FR-S to BRZ. They are built on the same line of assembly. The big differences are the trim levels, front bumper and suspension tweaks at the back that are minor mostly.

How the car was treated can change the reaction of the transmission dramatically. Clutch wear, fluid temperature, etc. Honestly, it's mostly psychological. I drove a BRZ and an FR-S back to back, for me it was the same apart for the goodies on the BRZ

[Michael Blue]

Originally Posted by tobin

Hi Michael, welcome to the forum. I had a 98.5 2.8 A4 myself. Manual, sport, leather, sport seats, etc. That was a great car. The BRZ is a totally different animal. Definitely get the Limited, and enjoy the hell out of it.

Oh, cool!
You'd dig this one, it's a '98 Sport Quattro, 30v V6 5sp...Pelican Blue.
Pretty rare color.

[Dadhawk]

Like others have said, many of the differences you feel are probably the quarks of the specific two cars you drove. I've seen this in nearly every model car I've ever driven. The drive-train is the same between both cars.

Originally Posted by Michael Blue

...I couldn't help but be disappointed in how much I preferred the auto to the manual.....

It's OK, take it from a reformed MT guy, embrace the flappiness of it all, that's what manual mode is for....

[tahdizzle]

I would agree that the cars are pretty much identicle, aside from some minor tweaks.

I would also agree to each car having its own personallity and character too though.

[Imrac]

I once heard from a Evo tuner when tuning two identical Evos (Year, Milageish, Mods). One made about 25 more HP than the other. The tuner labeled the higher HP car as a Wednesday car. Meaning it was assembled on a Wednesday. The lower HP car was labeled as a Monday car. The difference they said is, "The workers are still hung over from all the Saki Bombs over the weekend and thus the manufacturing difference"

[kevman_101]

No 2 cars are alike. I'm guessing the FRS you tried has some querks in it. Did they have other ones on the lot? Maybe tell the dealer you want another color and try another one. Was the BRZ new as well? If it was used, the previous owner might of tweaked the clutch. Not making excuses but they both generally should be the same.

Another thing is the transmission is very temp sensitive. If it's cold, it's very notchy, but once the fluid gets warmed up, it's awesome. I'm wondering if maybe the BRZ you tried was maybe taken for a test drive not too long before, while the FRS was not. Little things like that can make a HUGE difference with this car.

Anyways. The only thing that should sway your decision on which car you want, is what kind of options do you want, or are willing to live without. For me the FRS was the car that fitted me. I don't like leather and GPS that comes with cars. I can also live with having to turn a key, not having heated seats, less sound deadening material, and simple heater. We are a bit lucky here as I don't think the FRS in the States get heated mirrors or a set of winter mats, but the Canadian model does which is very nice with us still getting frost in our windows.

Don't be afraid to take them for a spin again, and try another FRS and another BRZ then the ones you tried. And also try to take it on a warmer day or longer drive as it can make a big difference. And if you do decide on purchasing either one, welcome to the Toyobaru club

[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

Like others have said, many of the differences you feel are probably the quarks of the specific two cars you drove. I've seen this in nearly every model car I've ever driven. The drive-train is the same between both cars.



It's OK, take it from a reformed MT guy, embrace the flappiness of it all, that's what manual mode is for....

I drove both cars in auto an manual form and must say that the auto tranny is damn good. It is probably even faster on the track or winding mountain road for people who can't/don't drive at 10/10ths since you can concentrate on other things vs. shifting. The only reason I bought the manual is it kind of fell into our lap for a killer deal while I was waiting for a White BRZ Limited Auto with all of the same equipment to show up at the dealer.

[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by krayzie

Yes I also experienced this strange difference in shift quality. The FRS shifter feels really notchy, especially 5th and 6th they feel completely different than with the BRZ. I can't explain this either. I can only attribute it to possibly different manufacturing batches.

My BRZ transmission was just replaced under warranty. These cars are filled with GL-3 from the factory. The IS250 uses the same transmission and Lexus has a TSB with a big red CAUTION that says use of fluid other than GL-5 WILL result in manual transmission damage. Beware of grinding gears, it will not fix itself. Toyota and Subaru need to get with the program and issue the same TSB and offer fluid replacement as a warranty item. With approval from the Subaru engineers, we filled my new tranny (and diff while we they at it) with Motul 300 75W-90 gear oil.

[krayzie]

Originally Posted by zdr93523

My BRZ transmission was just replaced under warranty. These cars are filled with GL-3 from the factory. The IS250 uses the same transmission and Lexus has a TSB with a big red CAUTION that says use of fluid other than GL-5 WILL result in manual transmission damage. Beware of grinding gears, it will not fix itself. Toyota and Subaru need to get with the program and issue the same TSB and offer fluid replacement as a warranty item. With approval from the Subaru engineers, we filled my new tranny (and diff while we they at it) with Motul 300 75W-90 gear oil.

We have TL70 gearbox (short stroke version of AZ6 from the Altezza). IS250 uses a RA62 gearbox (isn't this from a Toyota truck?).

The sticker on the passenger side will tell you. They are both Aisin tho.

[Michael Blue]

The weather was about the same, both cars were new, but I don't know when either had been previously driven.

Personally, I really like the added equipment of the BRZ. I'm a former Subie guy anyways (had an SVX for about 8-9 years) and looking more for a daily GT car (which can be tracked occasionally) than an all-out track-day monster.

I'll have to drive a few more just to be sure, but I'm pretty sold on the BRZ, even if the next FR-S I drive isn't so off-putting.

Thanks!
~M

[Mad1723]

Originally Posted by Michael Blue

The weather was about the same, both cars were new, but I don't know when either had been previously driven.

Personally, I really like the added equipment of the BRZ. I'm a former Subie guy anyways (had an SVX for about 8-9 years) and looking more for a daily GT car (which can be tracked occasionally) than an all-out track-day monster.

I'll have to drive a few more just to be sure, but I'm pretty sold on the BRZ, even if the next FR-S I drive isn't so off-putting.

Thanks!
~M

Then get a BRZ, your heart tells you to! =)

[zdr93523]

Originally Posted by krayzie

We have TL70 gearbox (short stroke version of AZ6 from the Altezza). IS250 uses a RA62 gearbox (isn't this from a Toyota truck?).

The sticker on the passenger side will tell you. They are both Aisin tho.

Either way, it needs GL-5

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