follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
86WORX
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB > FT86CLUB Shared Forum > FR-S / BRZ vs....

FR-S / BRZ vs.... Area to discuss the FR-S/BRZ against its competitors [NO STREET RACING]


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-26-2012, 07:28 PM   #15
zoomzoomers
Senior Member
 
zoomzoomers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Drives: 2013 Subaru SWP BRZ Limited 6AT
Location: Darkside
Posts: 1,862
Thanks: 526
Thanked 305 Times in 207 Posts
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyR View Post
The Supra Turbo in the 90's tested out at mid 4's to 5sec 0-60, .91-.95g handling. Those numbers today stand tall over many cars, including the 86. Once again, you like others seem to forget that the MKIV Supra can absolutely handle incredibly well, despite it's weight. This is something that needs to be addressed. Just because a car weights in over 3000lbs, doesn't mean it won't handle great.

Whilst true that to buy one now you'd have to do some overhauling on wear and tear, once "restored" (wow saying that for a 90's car), it would outclass the 86, easily, and decisively.

Not to mention it still looks good today. And, TARGA. It was and is still the last real Sports Car Toyota made. The LFA is an exotic/super car more than anything.
Thank God someone else can recognize this too!
__________________
Man Law#17:A man in the company of a hot, seductively dressed, woman MUST remain sober enough to fight!

MODS: AVO tubes + filter, Cusco (F) strut brace w/ MC brace, Perrin CBE, Subaru OEM trunk tray, Grimmspeed front license re-locator & hood struts and Beatsonic rear cam.
zoomzoomers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2012, 08:22 PM   #16
fatoni
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Drives: miata, mazdaspeed protege, ls430
Location: socal
Posts: 4,413
Thanks: 599
Thanked 1,439 Times in 786 Posts
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyR View Post
Did they build another sports car that I missed along the way then? Was it secret, and in JP only?
mr2
fatoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2012, 11:10 PM   #17
JohnnyR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Drives: 04 Evo 8
Location: PA
Posts: 171
Thanks: 4
Thanked 9 Times in 5 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatoni View Post
mr2
MR2 stopped production before the Supra, thus my statement still stands, the last real sports car they made.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sully View Post
Nobody ever has any love for the MR-S/MR-2 Spyder. 7th gen celica GTS was quite a coupe, too.
The MR2 Turbo was yet another incredible car Toyota made in it's golden era of the 90's. Those days are still gone unfortunately. The MR-S wasn't that special, nor was it a looker. It wasn't carried over as the MR-2 name because even Toyota knew it wasn't worthy of the title. I had a 2000 Celica GT-S. Fun to rev and the VVTL-i was cool, but once again, despite it being light, with a high-revving NA motor, it too lacked oomph getting out of the turns and on straights. Stepping into my Evo was like entering a whole new world. I'm still waiting on a real sports car from Toyota, but I don't think they have the magic left in them to do a proper MKV Supra.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zoomzoomers View Post
Thank God someone else can recognize this too!
It's like people are going hook, line, and sinker on the marketing stuff. The way some parrot it, it's like they're on the payroll. Look at the GT-R once again, where it's designer said it needed to be in that ballpark of weight to add to the handling, and it's numbers speak for itself. Reading here, you'd think the GT-R would corner like the Renault Robin, or a Yuke.
JohnnyR is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to JohnnyR For This Useful Post:
2013GTRNate (05-16-2014)
Old 03-26-2012, 11:42 PM   #18
fatoni
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Drives: miata, mazdaspeed protege, ls430
Location: socal
Posts: 4,413
Thanks: 599
Thanked 1,439 Times in 786 Posts
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyR View Post
MR2 stopped production before the Supra, thus my statement still stands, the last real sports car they made.



The MR2 Turbo was yet another incredible car Toyota made in it's golden era of the 90's. Those days are still gone unfortunately. The MR-S wasn't that special, nor was it a looker. It wasn't carried over as the MR-2 name because even Toyota knew it wasn't worthy of the title. I had a 2000 Celica GT-S. Fun to rev and the VVTL-i was cool, but once again, despite it being light, with a high-revving NA motor, it too lacked oomph getting out of the turns and on straights. Stepping into my Evo was like entering a whole new world. I'm still waiting on a real sports car from Toyota, but I don't think they have the magic left in them to do a proper MKV Supra.



It's like people are going hook, line, and sinker on the marketing stuff. The way some parrot it, it's like they're on the payroll. Look at the GT-R once again, where it's designer said it needed to be in that ballpark of weight to add to the handling, and it's numbers speak for itself. Reading here, you'd think the GT-R would corner like the Renault Robin, or a Yuke.
the mr-s was also called the mr2. if you want to split hairs about that fine but the fact remains that the mr-s was a sports car. it was also in line with the original mr2 than the sw20 was.

do you honestly think they intended to add weight to improve handling of the gtr? weight was a negative effect of adding things that had a positive effect like awd and dct. weight is bad period.

saying they wanted to add weight to improve handling is like saying people wear condoms to improve sex.
fatoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 12:48 AM   #19
Guff
Now w/ over 400 womprats!
 
Guff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Drives: BRZ LZR
Location: Texas/Illinois
Posts: 4,784
Thanks: 10,435
Thanked 3,420 Times in 1,424 Posts
Mentioned: 298 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Garage
The Supra and the 86 are fairly different, so it's all about what you prefer...


The feeling you get when that 63mm starts spooling at 2k RPM, and hits 25psi of boost at 5k to 7k. OH MAN. It's great! But I feel like having super-progressive chuckability in the FRS will be just as exhilarating.

I dare not try to take my Supra to the limit, but in an FRS, I feel like I could be more ballsy...
__________________
"Sweet Subaru, sweet Subaru, send your BRZ unto me, for the roads of the unworthy must be baptized in speed and glory."
- The Ancient BRZ Sacrament
by Zaku
Guff is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Guff For This Useful Post:
Nu_era (05-16-2014)
Old 03-27-2012, 01:58 AM   #20
carbonBLUE
Reverse Burnouts
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Drives: 2013 Argento FRS
Location: dallas!!!
Posts: 2,894
Thanks: 707
Thanked 1,257 Times in 592 Posts
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyR View Post
I'm still waiting on a real sports car from Toyota, but I don't think they have the magic left in them to do a proper MKV Supra.
supra and MR-2 are in the works, there was about 8 pages of it on this forum somewhere lost in a thread

it was about toda saying the gt86 was the first of 3 sports cars to bring back to the line up

gt86 - handling
supra MKV - power
mr-s - being in between the 86 and the supra

all most likely to be turbo'd and in production in the next 4 years

toyota is also going to the smaller displacement engines and turboing most of the lineup in a few years aswell starting in europe and bringing them to the US
__________________

2000 Carbon Blue Toyota Celica GTS 152000 miles
(wont forget you)
2013 Argento Scion FR-S
2011 Infiniti G37x
carbonBLUE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 02:16 AM   #21
uspspro
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Drives: DGM BRZ, MR-S 3.5L V6 swap (sold)
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 602
Thanks: 28
Thanked 188 Times in 121 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
The MR2 Spyder is 2195lb, has 2 seats, RWD, mid-engine, has more agility than pretty much anything out there... and somehow it's "not a sports car"

Get real...

Power can be added to any car. It's only one side of the equation. A simple bolt on turbo kit, or a 2zz swap, and you have a pretty damn fast car. I swapped a 3.5L 2GRFE into mine, and it's great... but it was still a sports car before any mods.

Looks are subjective too, but I like mine... It's a shame I'm selling it to get this slow ass BRZ

uspspro is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to uspspro For This Useful Post:
deliroast (09-20-2014), hmong337 (07-27-2014), InvalidJohnny5 (05-11-2014)
Old 03-27-2012, 02:32 AM   #22
carbonBLUE
Reverse Burnouts
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Drives: 2013 Argento FRS
Location: dallas!!!
Posts: 2,894
Thanks: 707
Thanked 1,257 Times in 592 Posts
Mentioned: 30 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by uspspro View Post
The MR2 Spyder is 2195lb, has 2 seats, RWD, mid-engine, has more agility than pretty much anything out there... and somehow it's "not a sports car"

Get real...

Power can be added to any car. It's only one side of the equation. A simple bolt on turbo kit, or a 2zz swap, and you have a pretty damn fast car. I swapped a 3.5L 2GRFE into mine, and it's great... but it was still a sports car before any mods.

Looks are subjective too, but I like mine... It's a shame I'm selling it to get this slow ass BRZ

2GR-FZE would have been even better, that thing probably would have made a few mustang owners pretty sad

still a cool and very different build i must say props, why not keep it and get the brz?
__________________

2000 Carbon Blue Toyota Celica GTS 152000 miles
(wont forget you)
2013 Argento Scion FR-S
2011 Infiniti G37x
carbonBLUE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 03:21 AM   #23
switchlanez
Glorious BRZ Master Race
 
switchlanez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Drives: Subaru Libird
Location: Race Wars
Posts: 3,645
Thanks: 1,050
Thanked 2,716 Times in 1,078 Posts
Mentioned: 110 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
^^UPSPRO I recognize that name from Spyderchat haha. My gawd you hooked that thing up so nice. I had a black one too w/ hardtop. Before I sold it, I parted out my C-ONE quads, full TRD bracing/suspension, TRD Japan headers/cat/inlet to a lucky few for way cheaper than I got them (think I was the only person in the country to import the cat and exhaust). Sweetest handling feel of any car I've owned.


It seems more and more spyderchatters are migrating over here I guess in pursuit of their next permagrin fix.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sully View Post
Nobody ever has any love for the MR-S/MR-2 Spyder. 7th gen celica GTS was quite a coupe, too.
I've owned them and miss them. Elements of the BRZ will remind me of them in some ways. My dad had a MkIV Supra TT; might be using the money he got from it for a BRZ/FR-S.
__________________
switchlanez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 05:15 AM   #24
tlp
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Drives: Supra
Location: Australia
Posts: 177
Thanks: 2
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
I just drove my supra the other day after not having driven it for about 4 months. I shat my pants! I know the 86 is never going to be able to give me that same feeling but I know it's going to be a completely different experience.

Supra's are power mad. The 86 is going to be hard to put in the same category...
tlp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 10:56 AM   #25
Turbowned
Senior Member
 
Turbowned's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Drives: 2017 Subaru BRZ Perf Pack 6MT
Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 5,048
Thanks: 1,949
Thanked 1,945 Times in 1,150 Posts
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
I still get held up over that 3400lbs for some reason. Maybe because the car is just smaller than most cars today I feel it shouldn't weigh so much. My Audi weighs 3800lbs but it's also fairly big, and yet it still handles brilliantly (thanks to quattro and some meaty Michelins). I've heard Supras don't make the best track cars, either. I think my biggest problem with them is that *most* of their owners are total douchebags. Hence the "GOD'S CHARIOT" comment, lol. All that crap aside, I still get a little giddy when I see one in person, but yawn when I see one in a magazine. "Oh look, another 1,000whp Supra... and I'll flip the page to another Civic with a shaved engine bay and a K-swap, and another 240 with a body kit...
__________________

Current: 2005 Porsche 911 Carrera S 6MT
Previous: 2 BRZ's, 997 C2S, C5 RS6, C4 S6, B8 S4, GDB STi, S30 240Z, FC3S RX-7 TII, AW11/SW20 MR2, E30 318is/325i, etc.
Turbowned is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 12:33 PM   #26
JohnnyR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Drives: 04 Evo 8
Location: PA
Posts: 171
Thanks: 4
Thanked 9 Times in 5 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by tlp View Post
I just drove my supra the other day after not having driven it for about 4 months. I shat my pants! I know the 86 is never going to be able to give me that same feeling but I know it's going to be a completely different experience.

Supra's are power mad. The 86 is going to be hard to put in the same category...
That's just because the Supra is a real sports car, and it outclasses the 86 in every regard outside of fuel economy. The MKIV Supra Turbo is one of those rare cars that we'll never see from the likes of Toyota again in full brilliance. If they were to do another, it'd be mucked up somehow I feel at this point with Toyota's track record.

Quote:
Originally Posted by uspspro View Post
The MR2 Spyder is 2195lb, has 2 seats, RWD, mid-engine, has more agility than pretty much anything out there... and somehow it's "not a sports car"

Get real...
You mean it should have got a real motor. The 1ZZ was a joke without what's considered heavy mods. Even my 2ZZ in my GT-S wouldn't have been a proper motor for the car. Like it or not, the motor is just as key to a real sports car as is the suspension, chassis, and styling. Deal.
JohnnyR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 01:39 PM   #27
uspspro
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Drives: DGM BRZ, MR-S 3.5L V6 swap (sold)
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 602
Thanks: 28
Thanked 188 Times in 121 Posts
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyR View Post
You mean it should have got a real motor. The 1ZZ was a joke without what's considered heavy mods. Even my 2ZZ in my GT-S wouldn't have been a proper motor for the car. Like it or not, the motor is just as key to a real sports car as is the suspension, chassis, and styling. Deal.
By that logic, the Miata is not a sports car either... many would disagree.

A 2zz Spyder with a PowerFC (to kick the left in sooner and smoother, makes a world of difference) is a car to be reckon with.

I am not arguing that the 1zz was the right choice... it wasn't. However, the Spyder is still a sports car, and a damn good one. I mean the car barely even has a trunk! It's almost as raw as the Elise. I have to ask if you have ever driven one in anger?
uspspro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 02:38 PM   #28
86fanatic
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Drives: auto
Location: us
Posts: 243
Thanks: 5
Thanked 43 Times in 19 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
JohnnyR is too concerned about putting cars into classes and making bold statements about cars "outclassing" others to be concerned with the details.

MR2 Spyder was meant to compete with the Miata. It did great. Those cars are not better or worse then a Supra, they are different and fill a different need. In many ways those cars are better then a Supra. I would go so far as to say the 1ZZ was the right engine choice, the 2ZZ adds a non trivial amount of weight to the rear and tends to throw off the balance. The stock car feels perfect 50/50. Take it from someone who has driven both a 1ZZ and 2ZZ swapped Spyder.

Supra was meant to compete with the VR4, 300ZX, RX7 and other Japanese twin turbo 6 cylinders. It did great in that sector of cars. These cars are not better or worse then a Miata or a MR2 Spyder, again they fill a different need.

The FRS/BRZ is meant to appeal to the same people who might be considering a Cayman, 911, or other purist sports cars. It will be a bit slower due to power, but also cost 1/4 as much and generally be more appropriate for public roads and having fun at a race track. It is not better or worse then anything else, again it fills a different need.

It's very telling that every time I talk about vehicle dynamics, handling, and involvement, JohnnyR always beings up 0-60 times and 1/4 mile times. Someone is living at the drag strip.
86fanatic is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
what would be a better buy new frs or used mk4 supra supramaster12 Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum 81 02-28-2013 03:47 PM
MKIV Supra Owners Roll Call SevenTenSplit Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions 10 01-23-2012 07:02 PM
From MKIV Turbo to FR-S Crashoverride Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum 62 11-11-2011 02:32 PM
New Supra!! A-Spike Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions 15 11-06-2010 10:18 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.